I should have said "one possibility..." you got me detective.
[/quote]suggested fact wrote:
You actually wrote: :"They may have squeezed the bag because it was temporarily occluded." They may have .... because ... . That is what you called "amateur/incorrect information."
LCarnitine wrote:"They may have" is a possibility. Not suggesting a fact..
Actually, it looks like you got yourself.
[/quote]LCarnitine wrote:
I should have said "one possibility..." you got me detective.
suggested fact wrote:You actually wrote: :"They may have squeezed the bag because it was temporarily occluded." They may have .... because ... . That is what you called "amateur/incorrect information."
Here's a comparison, let's say I was writing a report trying to prove that there was a mistake made in timing a mile race. If made the statement that said the time couldn't have been correct because to run a x:xx minute mile that would have meant that the final lap was run in 55 seconds and it is known that it is an impossibility to run a lap in 55 seconds. Regardless of what else my report said you would view the rest of my conclusions with more skepticism because it is clear in one instance that I have made an incorrect assumption that indicates I don't fully understand the sport. You may conclude that the evidence still indicates that there was a timing error but the report is weaker due to a factual error.
[/quote]You got yourself... wrote:
Actually, it looks like you got yourself.
LCarnitine wrote:I should have said "one possibility..." you got me detective.
????????????? wrote:
What about other runners and coaches that were treated by Dr.Brown? Notice how they don't get brought up, only Salazar and NOP.
Steve Magness did not want to talk with USADA about the IV infusion of L-carnitine that he received from Dr. Brown. He finally did talk with USADA.
Steve Magness was an assistant coach (= support personnel).
Steve received an IV infusion of L-carnitine from Dr. Brown that was over 4 hours duration and probably over 1000 mL.
Steve Magness also was seeing Dr. Brown in Texas since he was a teenager for his "hypothyroid" diagnosis.
Steve is probably now starting to think about the possibility that his 'hypothyroid' diagnosis from Dr. Brown was total bullsh*t from the beginning.
Does Steve Magness now say that he had no idea that the limit for an intravenous infusion was 50 mL...when he received a 4 hour IV L-carnitine infusion of over 1000 mL from Dr. Brown?
Steve Magness was not very smart. Steve had zero knowledge of the anti-doping rules.
Steve Magness was also not very smart to let himself be used as the personal lab rat of Coach Alberto Salazar.
Steve Magness said that the results of the intravenous L-carnitine infusion were "almost unbelievable" at the time.
It sounds like Steve Magness thought that his experience as a personal lab rat for Coach Alberto was a huge success at the time.
Some other people who were not very smart because they allowed themselves to be used as Coach Alberto's personal lab rats:
USADA concluded the following:
"That Dr. Brown appears to have failed to advise Dathan Ritzenhein and possibly other athletes of the fact that their L-carnitine infusions violated the WADA 50 mL limit.
For the reasons set forth above, it appears highly likely that Galen Rupp received an L-carnitine infusion from Dr. Brown in excess of 50 mL in violation of the applicable anti-doping rules and in violation of Dr. Brown’s duty to Galen Rupp not to cause him to violate the rules.
For the reasons set forth above, it appears highly likely that Lindsay Allen received an L-carnitine infusion from Dr. Brown in excess of 50 mL in violation of the applicable anti-doping rules and in violation of Dr. Brown’s duty to Lindsay Allen not to cause her to violate the rules.
For the reasons set forth above, it appears highly likely that Alvina Begay received an L-carnitine infusion from Dr. Brown in excess of 50 mL in violation of the applicable anti-doping rules and in violation of Dr. Brown’s duty to Alvina Begay not to cause her to violate the rules.
For the reasons set forth above, it appears highly likely that Dawn Grunnagle received an L-carnitine infusion from Dr. Brown in excess of 50 mL in violation of the applicable anti-doping rules and in violation of Dr. Brown’s duty to Dawn Grunnagle not to cause her to violate the rules.
For the reasons set forth above, it appears highly likely that Tara Erdman received an L-carnitine infusion from Dr. Brown in excess of 50 mL in violation of the applicable anti-doping rules and in violation of Dr. Brown’s duty to Tara Erdman not to cause her to violate the rules."
In conclusion:
1) There are a lot of people who allowed themselves to be used as lab rats for Coach Alberto's intravenous L-carnitine infusion experiments.
Pfff I take 2 1000mg L-Carnitines in the morning every day from GNC have been for 15 years.
rjm33 wrote:
Does Steve Magness now say that he had no idea that the limit for an intravenous infusion was 50 mL...when he received a 4 hour IV L-carnitine infusion of over 1000 mL from Dr. Brown?
Steve Magness was not very smart. Steve had zero knowledge of the anti-doping rules.
Steve Magness was also not very smart to let himself be used as the personal lab rat of Coach Alberto Salazar.
Yes. And the same is true for Ritz, Rupp, Begay, Grunnagle, and Welling.
Hard to believe that they all never read about this Prohibited Method, which can be found online - literally within seconds.
People in glass houses wrote:
Pfff I take 2 1000mg L-Carnitines in the morning every day from GNC have been for 15 years.
http://www.gnc.com/performance-probiotics/265403.html?product_id=265403&flagtype=nonbrand&vendor=none&channel=ppc&adpos=1o2&creative=189757865881&device=c&matchtype=&network=g&gclid=CMWvmczistQCFQQpaQod-X8I-g
I somehow doubt that they were infusing only L-carnitine.
rjm33 wrote:
????????????? wrote:What about other runners and coaches that were treated by Dr.Brown? Notice how they don't get brought up, only Salazar and NOP.
Steve Magness did not want to talk with USADA about the IV infusion of L-carnitine that he received from Dr. Brown. He finally did talk with USADA.
Steve Magness was an assistant coach (= support personnel).
Steve received an IV infusion of L-carnitine from Dr. Brown that was over 4 hours duration and probably over 1000 mL.
Steve Magness also was seeing Dr. Brown in Texas since he was a teenager for his "hypothyroid" diagnosis.
Steve is probably now starting to think about the possibility that his 'hypothyroid' diagnosis from Dr. Brown was total bullsh*t from the beginning.
Does Steve Magness now say that he had no idea that the limit for an intravenous infusion was 50 mL...when he received a 4 hour IV L-carnitine infusion of over 1000 mL from Dr. Brown?
Steve Magness was not very smart. Steve had zero knowledge of the anti-doping rules.
Steve Magness was also not very smart to let himself be used as the personal lab rat of Coach Alberto Salazar.
Steve Magness said that the results of the intravenous L-carnitine infusion were "almost unbelievable" at the time.
It sounds like Steve Magness thought that his experience as a personal lab rat for Coach Alberto was a huge success at the time.
Some other people who were not very smart because they allowed themselves to be used as Coach Alberto's personal lab rats:
USADA concluded the following:
"That Dr. Brown appears to have failed to advise Dathan Ritzenhein and possibly other athletes of the fact that their L-carnitine infusions violated the WADA 50 mL limit.
For the reasons set forth above, it appears highly likely that Galen Rupp received an L-carnitine infusion from Dr. Brown in excess of 50 mL in violation of the applicable anti-doping rules and in violation of Dr. Brown’s duty to Galen Rupp not to cause him to violate the rules.
For the reasons set forth above, it appears highly likely that Lindsay Allen received an L-carnitine infusion from Dr. Brown in excess of 50 mL in violation of the applicable anti-doping rules and in violation of Dr. Brown’s duty to Lindsay Allen not to cause her to violate the rules.
For the reasons set forth above, it appears highly likely that Alvina Begay received an L-carnitine infusion from Dr. Brown in excess of 50 mL in violation of the applicable anti-doping rules and in violation of Dr. Brown’s duty to Alvina Begay not to cause her to violate the rules.
For the reasons set forth above, it appears highly likely that Dawn Grunnagle received an L-carnitine infusion from Dr. Brown in excess of 50 mL in violation of the applicable anti-doping rules and in violation of Dr. Brown’s duty to Dawn Grunnagle not to cause her to violate the rules.
For the reasons set forth above, it appears highly likely that Tara Erdman received an L-carnitine infusion from Dr. Brown in excess of 50 mL in violation of the applicable anti-doping rules and in violation of Dr. Brown’s duty to Tara Erdman not to cause her to violate the rules."
In conclusion:
1) There are a lot of people who allowed themselves to be used as lab rats for Coach Alberto's intravenous L-carnitine infusion experiments.
I don't know who to call "Dr.Mengele" and his assistant here. The real doctor or the one playing at being a doctor?
rojo wrote:
I added in "Is Alberto Salazar next?" to the title as it seems hard that one would happen without the other unless Salazar claims Dr. Brown went rogue and did treatment that he thought should be kosher.
Just stop it.
Pretty stupid since l-carnitine --> TMAO --> heart disease / cancer
Oral supplements are not the same as infusions.
And what Salazar has been doing is systematic and illegal.
Well, this report from the New York Times has not aged very well.
Pretty sure there are some time limits on this process somewhere.
Still no hearing, no public record of any sanction, Dr. Brown is still in good standing with the Texas Medical board, etc.