Big Ups: Hall, 2:04.57 AR

2'04'57 is a very fast pace to handle no matter what the conditions. It is like running mile repeats downhill, your body is not used to going that fast and will take a major pounding. So running 2'04 is very difficult to do no matter if the course is flat, downhill, or hilly. Props for Ryan for going solo, Mahon must have been holdinghim back.

I think Haile may think about Boston next year, just to have both the World Record and World Best marathon times. Very tempting.

Link wrote:

Part of the magic of the road racing scene from the seventies was lost when the focus changed from races of 'about seven miles' to TAC certified 10ks. The attractiveness of a race was primarily a function of its likelihood to get you a 'PR'. People who think of the sport in this way miss out on a lot of its charms, I think.

You're absolutely right. I think this ballyhoo about these Boston times not counting is a side-effect of the obsession over time rather than racing. Not only is time more important the competing, but you have to run in certain conditions to "prove" the time is "legit" - both the result of taking the track mindset to the streets. It's all bulls*** it and it's bad for the sport.

Agreed. So that puts Hall's performance in the proper perspective: He ran well, he looked like he was in contention for the win, but in the end he wasn't that close. And Meb is the greatest American marathoner since Khalid.

Nice job, Ryan!!

Truly a great race and awesome PR.

WooHooRyan wrote:

Nice job, Ryan!!

Truly a great race and awesome PR.

PR* you mean...

2020vision wrote:

unfortunately, the time is nothing to be amazed by. it's well within what we already knew hall to be capable of, even without the tailwind. in reality, we should find this yet another disappointing race. hall isn't disappointed, but that's just it. the kid talks about winning marathon majors, but time and again, when the break is made, he's content to let them go. 2 minutes back, off-podium finish. fail.

I suppose you can do better? You may say that's not even relevant, but actually, it really is because you can't set a standard for Hall and say HE should reach it, but you? Nah, of course not me! That would be silly. Well, maybe Hall just isn't fit enough to win. You have to face it, people have their limits. It's no failure for Hall to place extremely well but not win. You can't just expect someone to win and then be let down because there was somebody faster. That's ridiculous. Hall is extremely good, but he's not quite the world's best. So what? Stop expecting him to do something that he may just not be able to do right now. Maybe he will someday, but it's not a disappointment if he doesn't. It's just really awesome if he does. He doesn't make the break because he can't, not because he's not tough enough or he's too lazy or his strategy is wrong. He just isn't quite as fit as the other guys out there. I guess you can rag on Davila for letting Kilel go in the final meters, but why would you? Would you say she didn't give it her all? How can you even say that about someone else when you weren't the one out there racing the world's best? The high expectations have got to stop. It would be nice to see Hall win some day, but I'm not going to set unrealistic expectations. I'm just going to party really hard if he does do it.

Wow, you really took that guy seriously didn't you? Save your energy for the reach around you can give Hall if he ever wins a major...

He did win a major. To the mooks on Letsrun the USOT is the most major race there is.

toro wrote:

So Hall finished 4th last year at Boston and now finished 4th this year at Boston.

Different conditions producing different times and very different reactions from the crowd.

Sounds like he is a pretty good and consistent marathoner but I recall quite a few negative posts about him in the year between these two races.

The reason so many people talk shit about Hall is because he doesn't race a lot. He only runs 2 marathons a year, and the half marathons he races during his buildup usually aren't anything amazing. This year especially I think there was a lot of shit talking because he dropped out of Chicago and became self coached, which led to the LetsRun message board doubting him, saying he's done, etc. like they do with all the talented runners in this country.

hall's the fastest american anyways.

khalid is a foreigner, screw him.

you dumbshit-that can't even be considered sarcastic because I doubt very much anyone has ever jumped out of an airplane at 138000 feet.

Irrelevant? What about the net elevation drop...is that irrelevant also. Cause I ran on a 90 % decline and ran in under 10 min for my marathon via sky-diving![/quote]

hypnotoad wrote:

Agreed. So that puts Hall's performance in the proper perspective: He ran well, he looked like he was in contention for the win, but in the end he wasn't that close. And Meb is the greatest American marathoner since Khalid.

Meb? Not anymore he isn't. Hall ran against a much tougher field than the one Geb faced in the Olympics. Much tougher. But, you're just another whiner trained to instinctively rail against whites, meaning you're white and self-hating. On this holy day, you should ask yourself who's taught you to be this way, heh.

Ask yourself who you aren't allowed to criticize, then you know who's in charge.

HEY ALL YOU IDIOTS WHO ARE TALKING ABOUT THE TAIL WIND. I WAS THERE YESTERDAY. I RAN A 3:20 PERSONAL WORST (MY SECOND MARATHON) I RAN 3:09 FOR A PR A YEAR AGO. THAT WIND CERTAINLY DIDN'T HELP ME DO ANYTHING, AND I THOUGHT I HAD PREPARED BETTER AND WAS MORE KNOWLEDGEABLE ABOUT RUNNING A MARATHON. I WENT OUT CONSERVATIVE IN 1:34 AND DIED LIKE A B*TCH AT MILE 22.75.

THE TAIL WIND A LOT OF THE TIME WAS COMING AT US FROM THE SIDE, AND I KIND OF FROZE MY ARSE OFF GETTING SWEATY AND HAVING THAT CHILLY WIND DRY ME OFF. CONDITIONS WERE CERTAINLY APPROXIMATING IDEAL, BUT THE WIND DIDN'T GIVE AS MUCH HELP AS EVERYONE CLAIMS.

RYAN HALL IS AWESOME. EVERY TIME HE'S RUN AT BOSTON COULD HAVE WON THE PREVIOUS BOSTON MARATHON. HE JUST CANT CATCH A BREAK SINCE SOMEONE ALWAYS SHOWS UP AND COMPLETELY STUNS THE WORLD.

on another note, i like how all you idiots have many a forum on letsrun.com about how hard boston is and how conservative you have to be because the downhills kill your quads and leave you with nothing to get up the newton hills. And now that ryan hall does well, everyone and their brother is like... "OH MY GAWD, BOSTON, SUCH AN EASY DOWNHILL COURSE, OMG, GAWD" YOU F-ING ELITIST B-S RUNNERS.

Abraham Foxxxxman wrote:

Meb? Not anymore he isn't. Hall ran against a much tougher field than the one Geb faced in the Olympics. Much tougher. But, you're just another whiner trained to instinctively rail against whites, meaning you're white and self-hating. On this holy day, you should ask yourself who's taught you to be this way, heh.

Ask yourself who you aren't allowed to criticize, then you know who's in charge.

Wow, nice piece of pocket psychology, dumbsh\it. Just like all the other 12-year-olds here you've concluded that anyone who doesn't worship the Reverend Ryan Hall hates all white runners. How very convenient. You'll be a success in life, I can already tell.

Not that you deserve an explanation but I'll give you one anyway. The point being discussed was that finish times don't matter in marathons, what matters is the race. By that rationale Meb IS the best since KK (note how that's not saying he's the best TODAY) because he's actually won a major and been closer to winning another. When Meb runs a marathon he competes. He runs against the other guys. When Hall runs he runs with God, a delusion inside his own head from which he presumably gets his pacing strategy. I've not seen him apply intelligent race tactics and beat runners who seemed stronger than him on the day like Meb does. RH has better legs and lungs but he doesn't seem to have the brains to put them to their best use.

Stick that in your racist pipe and smoke it.

All of those guys raced hard. Great conditions after years of dedicated training and God given ability. Just awesome.....anyone that wants to downplay their performances is second rate. Ryan is a great inspiration. Keep believing in yourself and always give your best effort.

I also ran yesterday, and while the conditions for racing were excellent, it is still a very DIFFICULT course. Dont lose sight of the fact that the hills are placed at very challenging parts of the course and the downhills are brutal on your quads.

I think the runners deserve more credit, even given the favorable conditions. Mutai and Mosop just beat last years champ by 4 mins. Im willing to bet they would taken down last years record with less than ideal conditions and no tailwind. I would say the tailwind and hills cancel each other out......it was in my mind a legitimate WR performance by Mutai. And Hall's performance is the greatest of his career. This was a very special race.....honored to have been a part of him

Agreed on Hall, because he took them out in 1:01:57 and made the race. Robert K. Cheruiyot and numerous other world class runners went with that pace looking for the win and paid the price. As for the day, I also was out there and conditions were perfect. As Obiwan said at times you could feel the wind from the side, at times to me there seemed to be very little wind, just looking at the trees as I was moving along. Sure, there is no kidding that the wind and temperatures helped tremendously, but only four guys withstood the fantastic pace and could take maximum advantage of them. Kudos again to Hall.

CmonMan wrote:

I also ran yesterday, and while the conditions for racing were excellent, it is still a very DIFFICULT course. Dont lose sight of the fact that the hills are placed at very challenging parts of the course and the downhills are brutal on your quads.

I think the runners deserve more credit, even given the favorable conditions. Mutai and Mosop just beat last years champ by 4 mins. Im willing to bet they would taken down last years record with less than ideal conditions and no tailwind. I would say the tailwind and hills cancel each other out......it was in my mind a legitimate WR performance by Mutai. And Hall's performance is the greatest of his career. This was a very special race.....honored to have been a part of him

CmonMan wrote:

I also ran yesterday...

It's not totally inconceivable that the tailwind more than outweighed the hilly course for the fastest runners, but not for slower and/or heavier normal runners.

3:09 is a very respectable time, but you can't necessarily judge what the pros felt by what you felt, even though you were in the same race.

As for Ryan Hall: I, too, questioned his decision, but I certainly didn't condemn it (or him, for that matter). So now that he proved that it has worked for him, I'm surprised. But I don't feel I have to defend my past judgement by diminishing his performance. No AR, but an outstanding performance. I'm looking forward to more.

Of course, it would be nice if all the "haters" had the guts to admit they were wrong and apologize. But frankly, Ryan Hall won't care.

So if Hall was 1 minute 55 seconds behind Geoffrey Mutai at Boston, and Mutai ran 2:05:06 at New York, than dos that mean Hall's run was equivalent to a 2:07:01 New York Marathon, what would now be the fourth fastest NYC time ever(and equivalent of a sub-2:05 marathon)??