Sunday Mail Has More Details on Paula's Blood Values and Off Scores + News She'll Put up £1m for an MRI lie detector

rjm33 wrote:

I am sorry....but I am not going to go into details on how a blood transfusion is done. Do your own reading... learn to think clearly for yourself...and come up with your own conclusions.

.......I do not think that any reader should ever.... just trust me.....

.

I've enjoyed your posts, rjm, but this is a strange thing for you to say. You've been typing every unsolicited thought that crosses your mind for the past few months, but now you don't have time to answer a polite question from someone who is actually seeking your opinion?

You can admit that you don't really know something. There's no shame in that.

webby wrote:

rjm33 wrote:

I am sorry....but I am not going to go into details on how a blood transfusion is done. Do your own reading... learn to think clearly for yourself...and come up with your own conclusions.

.......I do not think that any reader should ever.... just trust me.....

.

I've enjoyed your posts, rjm, but this is a strange thing for you to say. You've been typing every unsolicited thought that crosses your mind for the past few months, but now you don't have time to answer a polite question from someone who is actually seeking your opinion?

You can admit that you don't really know something. There's no shame in that.

Broseph, do you have a man servant that dresses you? Is Siri broken?

C'mon bro.

Haha. That was funny, but didn't address the simple question about how complicated it would be for Paula to get her blood enriched and transfused, right? I just didn't get why our prolific doctor friend was suddenly at a loss for words when someone actually asked for his opinion.

I can't believe people are still debating dehydration, temperature of the race, and the infinite sources of lab error rekrunner comes up with to explain away any blood test result from pre-2009....after 6 months and 1,300 posts...Good luck!... I stopped reading his posts...

I find them completely boring, not entertaining, and not informative.

Here is something I find more interesting:

There is some progress being made by the testers in catching up to the cheaters!

There is progress on genetic expression analysis that will be able to detect EPO use possibly up to 3 to 4 weeks after stopping its administration.

There has also been progress on proteome analysis of RBC cytoskeleton and cell membrane changes that are being used to detect subtle differences between "older" transfused blood from the normal "newer" RBCs in circulation.

These differences will enable a test for the specific and direct detection of autologous blood transfusions for the first time, even though all blood transfusions have been banned since 1985.

.........Go readers!........

You have poor reading skills. I said that Lance and cyclists did blood transfusions in their hotel rooms and on the cycling team bus...so how complicated could it be?

I am under no obligation to answer your question...and you don't have to read any of my posts.....

I don't have a question. Another polite poster did. And I enjoyed many of your posts. I just find it annoying that you continue to pretend to be too busy to answer a simple question about the specifics of a blood transfusion. Of course you're not obligated to stop being obnoxious and no one here is obligated to keep reading this thread. But believe it or not, some of us were involved in this thread before you took it upon yourself to educate us all.

Let's not forget: - performances "too good to be true" - extremely vocal and combative about proclaiming innocence - threatening lawsuits to anyone who writes negative articles - using PR people to hone a finely crafted public image over the years - suspicious testing results that get written off lame excuses

cleans wrote:

I think this thread is popular because it touches on many issues that are dragging the popularity and credibility of athletics down, to a point where it may never regain the popularity it once had. And we find that sad.

Paula happens to be the focus of this, perhaps because she is the nearest athletics has to a Lance Armstrong figure:

- never tested positive

- record holder

- made lots of money from the sport

- close to the governing body's president

webby wrote:

Haha. That was funny, but didn't address the simple question about how complicated it would be for Paula to get her blood enriched and transfused, right? I just didn't get why our prolific doctor friend was suddenly at a loss for words when someone actually asked for his opinion.

Bro,

You lazy.

How to extract.

How to store blood

This is dumb sh!t you too lazy to look up. That's on you.

Again, I don't have a question. I am commenting on needlessly rude and evasive posts from a guy who hasn't otherwise stopped sharing everything he knows on the topic for months.

Then you mad bro.

Chill

. . . go LRC vigilantes . . . go cantankerous message board marauders . . . go arrogant know-it-all physicians!

I respect many posters at this site. I have rarely posted on other threads. I have been at this website for race results and reading the forums for around 10 years without ever posting.....and now I know why I never did.

It is just brutal the way that people act and troll and confuse and attack...look at all the stuff people like Jon Orange and rekrunner do to just ruin it for everyone else.....because they think it is fun to do.....and after a while...it is easy to become like that yourself......everyone else is acting mean and crazy ..it's fun!

Even though I may try to use humor... I feel this topic of blood doping is deadly serious. The May 19,1991 NY Times has an article about the 18 young Dutch and Belgian cyclists who all died in the years 1987 to 1990, when EPO first entered cycling.

That is when I found out about EPO use in cycling, running, cross-country skiing, swimming, and all endurance sports...not because of incredible performances...but because of DEATHS. That is a long time ago. Many of you were not even born. I remember when Wang Junxia and the Chinese women set the records in 1993 that still stand to this day.

Everybody remembers the winners like Lance and Pantani. Nobody remembers the young riders who didn't win... and lost their lives.

Thanks for that. You made an important contribution, without a doubt.

FYI, I don't think many people have been convinced by rekrunner, and absolutely no one takes Jon Orange seriously. You have made your points convincingly.

webby wrote:

I don't have a question. Another polite poster did. And I enjoyed many of your posts. I just find it annoying that you continue to pretend to be too busy to answer a simple question about the specifics of a blood transfusion. Of course you're not obligated to stop being obnoxious and no one here is obligated to keep reading this thread. But believe it or not, some of us were involved in this thread before you took it upon yourself to educate us all.

Without going into the specifics, which have been linked in a reply already, a blood transfusion is very simple. You can easily extract the blood yourself with the right equipment. It would typically take 10 minutes to withdraw a pint of blood depending on the needle size and condition of the vein.

Storing the blood long term was the major challenge back then. Fuentes had a 'special fridge' for it so I think if Paula was storing long term then she would probably be looking at external help. The medical supplies are easily purchased without restriction. After all it's just a bag with some anti-coagulant.

Putting the blood back in is similarly simple, hang the bag off a coat hanger, stick in the needle and wait.

As simple as it sounds, it has to be said that it can be lethal if you transfuse someone elses blood and very very uncomfortable if you put in your own poorly stored blood.

Uncomfortable enough to fake injuries because you're unable to train/race? Liking making up a knee injury sustained while writing thank you cards?http://www.theguardian.com/uk/2001/aug/09/athletics.sport?INTCMP=ILCNETTXT3487Or making up an injury about a rock and bicycle?

Plasma rubbish wrote:

As simple as it sounds, it has to be said that it can be lethal if you transfuse someone elses blood and very very uncomfortable if you put in your own poorly stored blood.

webby wrote:

Again, I don't have a question. I am commenting on needlessly rude and evasive posts from a guy who hasn't otherwise stopped sharing everything he knows on the topic for months.

There is no such thing as rude on this board. And the Doc isn't evasive.

If this happened my guess is that there would have been at least a trained medical professional involved. As you say the transfusion procedure does carry a risk and when things go wrong they can be quite serious as happened to the Italian cyclist Ricardo Ricco in 2011:

"On 6 February 2011 Riccò was admitted to a hospital in critical condition with sepsis and kidney failure, allegedly due to a blood transfusion he performed on himself with 25-day-old blood. Riccò admitted he had performed the transfusion to the doctor treating him in the presence of his girlfriend Vania Rossi. The doctor treating him reported this information to authorities leading to an investigation being opened against the professional cyclist by police and the Italian Olympic committee (CONI)."

And that is why I did not want to reveal any details here at the LRC forum about how to do blood transfusions.

.....because I assume that there are probably some people reading these posts with weak mind disease that would be stupid enough and crazy enough to go try it themselves at home this Saturday for the local 5K fun run age group competition....

Did anyone also read my previous post about EPO use and 18 DEAD cyclists?

....This may surprise anyone reading this...but I think I have run out of crazy conspiracy stories for now!.. until more Dr. Fuentes stories come out.. oruntil the next story breaks...

...like Dr. Mark Bonar....I saw that UKAD was unable to take any action against Dr.Bonar for the last 2 years... and some government officials were "shocked"...

...this picture reminds me of the old motion picture Casablanca... with the Inspector played by Claude Rains....