50+ Masters Training and Racing Open Forum

CM, good thoughts. Unfortunately we are in the social media era and anonymous posters feel emboldened to say things they would never say face-to-face. Too bad.

My week started up, then finished down. I am icing my right calf/Achilles as I write this. I added some intensity this week and some more swimming. However, I foolishly got away from my post jog routine of strength work and stretching. I also introduced a new pair of shoes into the mix. And I spent a few hours on the 4th volunteering at the local events which had me on my feet for longer than I would have liked. Ultimately I noticed some calf tightness on my off day yesterday that lingered into today. I balmed up the area pretty good before heading out this AM, but ultimately shut things down before the half way point and walked home. I’ll be too busy for the next two days to do any jogging, so we’ll see what Wednesday brings.

Sun: off

Mon: 45’ w/ 4 x 440y on/off @ goal pace; swim

Tues: off

Wed: 51’ jog; swim

Thu: volunteering at holiday events

Fri: 41’ jog; swim (sluggish legs and heat/humidity); swim

Sat: off

Sun: 22’ w/ 2 x 440y on/off @ goal pace, walk home

Best to most!

Good morning,

I hope everyone had a good holiday. As for myself ran the 2 mile road race as planned Thursday morning. I hit the first mile in 7:51, then hit a 600 meter hill that put me behind goal pace (8:00/mile), but finished strong last 800m to hit 15:54 (22nd, 1 AG). This was my best race so far this season, and it was not that difficult. Saturday my legs felt good enough to run 9 x 350m @ 88 average (6:40/mile). This next week I will boost my volume back up yet save some energy for faster workouts.

Have a good week.

Igy

thoughtful perspective on this sad turn of events; thanks.

I had a good, if humid, week, tapering for goal summer race:

M 1:25

Tu 55:00 incl. 20:00 at half-marathon pace + 45:00 x-training

W 1:15 double

Th 50:00

F 30:00

Sa 45:00 incl. 5k in 18:35 (7th OA, 2nd AG)

Su 1:20

Saturday race I was hoping to break 19:00 for first time in about 2 years. It's downhill on bike path to turnaround, then [obviously] up. My guesstimate from workouts and races over the years on this path is that it's about 16--20 sec faster downhill per mile (ex: 5:50-52 downhill/6:08-10 uphill = even effort), so I was aiming for 9:15 down/9:45 up and instead ran 9:00/9:35. Very happy with it.

29 seconds faster than road 5k two weeks ago. Earlier one is hillier but was less humid, on balance maybe about equally difficult [age group winner Mark Neff ran 3 seconds faster yesterday; other friends of mine a mix of faster vs. slower].

Just before we started, a group of fast young guys on a training run went by and taunted us with "dewpoint 76". It indeed feel like a mix of running and swimming, but early enough to not be too hot, and the course had a lot of shade. I wouldn't have wanted to do a long race certainly.

now a bonus track mile friday night (goal = 5:42 to stay on track for breaking 6:00 at 60) and then a week of goofing off before I start training for JFK 50 mile in november

have a great week,

Dave

good racing Igy...solid.

dhaaga...great goals sub 6:00 @ 60 and JFK...you've done JFK a number of times, correct?

MF

Thanks....getting there....

lucKY: Glad the toe’s better!

amkelley: Your mileage is amazing and inspiring!

OGII: I agree, being old does not suck. We are the lucky ones. We should never forget that!

CM: Good thoughts.

igy: Congrats, def progress!

dhaaga: Nice sub 19 and sub 6.

Tue= 0

Thr = 2 easy on treadmill

Sat = 2.5 easy on road, 1 mile elliptical

Sun = 3 easy on road, 1 mile elliptical

Due to last week's calf strain I had to alter my schedule. I’m just taking it day by day going by feel. It’s improving fairly quickly but I do recall about 5 years ago I had a similar strain. Then, after about 2 weeks, I thought I was good to go and tried a speed workout which instantly re-tweaked it. I’ll try to learn from that mistake.

I am also working on my chronic over-striding problem, which I believe was a factor in the calf strain (as well as half a dozen other things). Also, I have been planning to work in some elliptical miles anyway and since it hardly touches the calf I figure now is as good a time as any. Volume is something I’m missing and I ain't no amkelley :-)

Have a good week folks!

I had an excellent July 4th 10K. It went about as well as I thought I could do at my current fitness. My final race time was 43:26, and my GPS said the distance was 6.36 miles. Everyone I know who ran with GPS got 6.35 to 6.38 miles, and in races I am always focused on hitting the tangents as well as possible. So, GPS said I ran 42:25 for 10K, which is 6:50/mi pace. My mile splits were 6:48, 6:48, 6:44, 6:52, 7:02, 6:53, and at the course 5K mark (which my GPS agreed with), I came through at 21:10, which means my second 5K was 21:15 if GPS was accurate. The first 4 miles felt like just a good, hard steady effort. About halfway through the 5th mile it turned into more of a desperate struggle to hang onto the pace, but I did manage a modest kick the last 300 meters or so which were slightly downhill. I did win the 65-69 age group and was more the 3 minutes ahead of 2nd in the age group. 42:25 age grades to about 85.5% and 43:26 age grades to about 83.5%. I am more than happy to accept either of those numbers for my current 10K fitness.

I hope everyone who raced on the 4th enjoyed their efforts.

I read about Bernard Lagat's marathon result of 2:12. Amazing talent and range on his part as well as the obvious desire to try and continue to perform at the highest level of our sport.

I'll add some of my thoughts on Dr. Meza's tragic death. First, there is nothing wrong with making the effort to defend the integrity of our sport. All those individuals who provided factual information and commented respectfully about the issue of cheating in races at a level that got Dr. Mesa national attention for his performances before he got national attention for cheating, were acting appropriately. As someone who has spent a lot of years volunteering for a nonprofit that provides mental health services, I am aware of and have seen that depression is not uncommon in the senior population that I now am a part of. Dr. Meza's race cheating and subsequent suicide are behaviors that seem totally out of character with everything I have read about his earlier life as a doctor, volunteer assistant high school coach, track club co-founder, and well-loved family man. Looking at his life as a whole I have to assume that his racing behaviors of the last few years and suicide reflect symptoms of some aging-induced negative changes in his personality and ability to cope with the world around him. His family has my sympathy and I hope Dr. Meza is remembered more for all his good accomplishments than for this sad final episode to his life.

This was intended to be my final week of hard marathon training before I start backing off for the race in three weeks. "Only" 66 miles for the week, but that included one short race and one good long run.

M: 10.1 miles.

T: 10.5 miles.

W: 7.3 miles easy, preparing to race the next day.

R: About 6.5 miles including a 5 mile race in 39:53. I was hoping to break 40 so was OK with the effort--not nearly as good as the 5K I ran six weeks ago, but I wasn’t fresh coming into the race. I was surprised, however, that the listed winner of the 60-69 age group, and first female master, was someone I’d never heard of who ran more than 3 minutes faster than I. She did not show up for the awards and I suspect she was a misplaced finisher from the accompanying 2-mile race, which had a bunch of walkers.

F: 10.3 miles.

S: 32 miles easy on the bike. My heel was sore enough that taking a day off seemed prudent.

U: 21.4 miles in 3:13 (9:01/mile pace). This was a “dress rehearsal” for the marathon: I got up at 4 am, choked down a big hunk of bread with honey and a cup of coffee, answered nature’s call, and hit the road at 4:45 am. This allowed me to finish while it was still only in the low 70s, though the sun was intense over the last few miles. I had no GI problems and the run went well. The actual marathon starts at 5:30 and the weather will most likely be overcast and in the 50s for the whole race.

Next week is shaping up to be very low mileage. My heel will probably be too sore after today’s long run for me to run at all tomorrow, and then I have a small backpacking trip planned for Tuesday and Wednesday. So it looks like I’ll have three days of no running next week, but I sort of feel like I need them. I’ve been going at it pretty hard for the past couple of months.

Coyote, I agree completely with your thoughts about the Meza situation. He needed to be DQ’d and prevented from further cheating, but there has to be a better way than the “vigilante justice” you describe. I did read a lot of the posts on the main thread on this subject and a number of people did some very serious and thoughtful work to uncover the evidence of his cheating. But you’re right, this needs to be done by the race directors in a less public way.

MikeF, nice week and good job on the 5000 time trial. At age 61 I’m still within 6 minutes of my PR for that distance, but it helps that I was so slow when I was young…

Igy, good job on the 2-mile race. That looks really encouraging.

dhaaga, that’s a very nice 5K given the conditions.

old guy II, good job on the 10K! And yes, Bernard Lagat’s 2:12 at age 44 is really impressive.

Happy and healthy running to all.

dhaaga wrote:

(N)ow a bonus track mile friday night (goal = 5:42 to stay on track for breaking 6:00 at 60) and then a week of goofing off before I start training for JFK 50 mile in november

have a great week,

Dave

Dave - I hope you are able to achieve your goal of 6:00 at 60 - a good goal to shoot for!

I have been working on it for the last several months and finally nicked it at a flat certified 4th of July race on Thursday morning. I felt pretty confident it was doable when I hit the mile in a 5K last Sunday eve at 6:24 and the temp was 87 degrees with a Heat Index of 95.

5:59 (maybe 5:58 high) clock time at age 62 (and 1/2). Temperature wasn't too bad at 74 (much better than the high 80s and low 90s before and after) Lots of entrants with the winner going 4:09 (whew!) Sure helped having lots of others to focus on catching or staying with others . It is still a challenge to accept that I all out I can only run a mile at pace that even 20 years ago I could run a full 10Km race.

Completed week #20 of 50mpw plus a couple hours ago with just over 11% at mile/5k race effort.

Still struggling to keep my weight up. Eating when I am not hungry and drinking copious amounts when not thirsty, just to keep things even. My spouse is still concerned, but I am pretty sure it is just the heat and my training efforts.

Next up Monday July 15th biggish road mile race USATF certified course with about 400 runners each year in the 'community' race section. Just hoping it doesn't get too hot.

Hoping all of you have a healthy and productive week ahead....

Copy&pasted from another thread:

I'm preparing for the M50 and 800m / 1500m next year. 5x200m uphill with 8% gradient today. A tool tells me that it corresponds to 280m flat. I ran in training shoes, the ground is sandy and slippery. So let's pretend it's 5x280m.

Results: 5x280 / 4min rest in 38s; 39s; 39s; 39/40s; 40s

Is it realistic to think about 800m in sub 2:10? I will go to a track as soon as possible but I prefer to train in the forest.

To be fair, I don’t believe this has been confirmed as a suicide. Though that may be the ultimate conclusion, we should allow the authorities to do their due diligence in determining an official cause of death. The family is adamant that he did not take his own life.

Awesome Independence Day racing folks. I had a lot of fun racing in Longview WA just before a parade chockfull of patriots mighty proud of their town and country. Point-to-point road mile in 5:31.00. 6th overall. 1st grandmaster. Biggest award was fun fun fun.

Completed a longest-in-three-months volume week of 50miles with a 10-miler yesterday that felt better than expected. Trying my best to 'just run' and by feel, not watch.

Hope all y'all continue to run when you can and how you wish.

KP

Thanks for the clarification. There were several news reports that said the police were called to report a jumper at the bridge above where his body was found, but you are right, there has been no definitive conclusion reported yet on the cause of his death.

Thanks for hearing me out earlier today.

nice race results OGII, Igy, amkelley, and dhaaga, everyone representing well. MF, cool that you got to watch Pre last week.

Had a decent week, actually best in a while. I got a massage at the end of last week and took it easy for a few days following that, and it helped get some life back into my tired legs. Have had a decent 2 month training block, going between 57 and 66 miles a week and averaging 61-62 for 9 weeks. So can't complain, even though plans were for a bit higher. Hey, I'm healthy.

For the week 6.3, 10.2 (double), 6.4, 7.6 (including race), 8.2, 9.4, 11.6 for 8:08 of running and 59.7 miles.

On Tuesday I did my first dedicated speed day of the year, a fartlek on gravel path with reps of 1:15 working down to 45 sec at mile race effort. Only totaled about 5 minutes of faster running, but a good primer.

Thursday's 4th of July race was a 4K at a brewery, with about 750 runners on a 1 or so mile out and back in an industrial park. Each lap featured three roundabouts and a hairpin turn around. Had a pretty good field up front, with some track and marathon OT qualifiers in there. Splits were 5:40 (2nd fastest mile of the year, the other being a wind-aided mile at Va. Beach 8K in March), which was a bit too fast. 6:02 (Too slow! I eased up and we also started lapping waves of runners), but finished with a decent last 0.49 (5:40 pace) or whatever to finish in 14:25 and 1st in age. So I'm pretty happy with that as a training race. Got a case of good beer as an award, making it all the more fun.

Saturday did some tempo effort reps, 2X 1 mile (6:04 net downhill, 6:22 net uphill) and 1X 1.25 at 6:06 pace (net downhill, but not that much) and that was encouraging. Early on in this cycle I was averaging about 6:22-6:25 on the same section.

Have a big race next week and will report on that later.

There are a lot of things in regards to Dr. Frank Meza that don’t add up. I always associated the Aztlan Track Club with Carlos Alfaro. The website for the club lists Alfaro and Meza as founders of the club in 1974. I was very active in the Southern California running scene at that time, and have results of 1973-1974 Southern Pacific Association of the AAU. In one booklet it lists Aztlan club and Carlos Alfaro as the contact. There are no race results for a Frank Meza. In fact I never heard of the guy until the story of his 70 year old 2:50-something record. At the time I thought “huh, must be a late bloomer.” Of course I don’t know every masters or runner of my era, but I do know most.

The other thing that struck me was the vehement denials by the family even though there was evidence of bib-swapping by family members in one race. The claims by the son of Frank’s 6:00 training sessions is not credible. The defense of Frank by friends and family is admirable for its loyalty, but is betrayed by the facts.

In one of my past careers I was NCAA Compliance Coordinator for a Division I athletic department. We had a very serious string of infractions that were denied by numerous parties. I found the psychology of justifying an untruth as interesting. Of course to some I should be the focus of ire rather than the perpetrators. We saw similar calls in the Meza threads, blaming those that exposed events while minimizing the effects on society by such behavior.

Lots of GREAT RACING Congrates to all

dHaaga you demolished 19 2 more years do it again.

NDJY sub 6 at 62.5 is Great save some for 63;)

Igy you keep riding the wave nice 2 miles and workout

OG2 Nice 10k especially coming back from being sick

AMK IMO that 5 miler is pretty darn good indicator for your Marathon.

KP glad to see you enjoying yourself only problem with Longview is the water it was on my short list

MF 5000 TT makes me want to go do one. I love TT on the track just me the track and the stopwatch.

Down Week 2 good sign I actually started to get the urge to run lots of bike riding c2 rowing some walking and the daily sauna . I wish I could fit a treadmill into the sauna now that would be cool

So here is my master plan to world domination at 70 well domination of my world anyhow.

Lifting the calf

18:59

60 82.63 nope

61 83.37 nope

62 84.11 nope but came close 19:05

63 84.86

64 85.64

65 86.42

66 87.22

67 88.03

68 88.86

69 89.79

70 90.81

Charlie wrote:

Lifting the calf

Nice Milo of Croton reference...I think :-)

Rtype wrote:

Charlie wrote:

Lifting the calf

Nice Milo of Croton reference...I think :-)

Yeah but also Inspired by what CM has done.