Babyjoggers should be outlawed in ALL races

sam w wrote:

i dont always agree with holland nass, but that was funny.

Thanks. To be completely honest, I really don't care about baby joggers. They've never gotten in my way, but there is the safety issue for those less fortunate enough to not be in the front.

If I knew it was THIS easy to piss off so many people with something as inanely insignificant as pushing kids in a stroller during the local Po-Dunk 5K, I would have started having kids when I was 15!

Seriously people, is this topic REALLY worth 100-plus posts? No one's being swayed one way or the other on this, an issue that affects a small (and slow) percentage of the running community as a whole. The only thing stupider than this topic is the fact that I and many others, apparently, read this much into it. Then again, I and most of you, too, will slow down to look at the after-effects of a car crash, even one on the other side of the median.

The point being made here is that if the entry form prohibits babyjoggers and strollers, leave them at home even if you think you are above the rules. If the entry form doesn't mention them, go for it. The runners who object can pass on the races that allow them. Simple enough.

You guys sound more and more like a Monty Python skit with every post.

funinthesun:

"Oh my god!! It's a stroller mom! Quick, spit on her!"

Bam Bam:

"Grab the infant and dash it firmly to the ground,"

Ravencourt:

"D*mn, where's my tazer? Somebody guard the 88-year-olds."

Bam Bam:

"or slap the f*cker silly."

Holland Nass:

"Release the hounds!"

Most Parents are IDIOTS!:

"F*cking bullsh*t f*ck!"

Bystander:

"Is all of this really necessary?

Dr. Running Mom:

"Oh yes maam. It's all in the interest of safety. You wouldn't want to see someone get hurt would you?"

Meanwhile, back in real life, we're all still waiting for someone to give us the details of one of those tragic stroller mom incidents.

I remember Monty Python use to be a lot funnier (or, well, funny). Don't quit your day job (especially if it lets you read 9 pgs of this crap)

Are you saying there haven't been any stroller incidents during races? I recall seveal over the years I have seen, but sorry I haven't noted them in my log.

I think people running with dogs during races are maybe as bad. I almost broke my neck during one race (well, it was a dog jog and I was tripped up by my dog, but...)

It does f*cking matter if you think they create a hazard. The entry form prohibits them for insurance purposes. Get real and respect the wishes of the race director. There is no gray area here. If the races accepts them, go for it. If it doesn't, keep them at home. Why is this so hard to accept?

dukey pussy wrote:

If the races accepts them, go for it. If it doesn't, keep them at home. Why is this so hard to accept?

It's not hard for me to accept. If the race bans them then they shouldn't be there. I agree completely.

But if you want to convince me that stroller moms are such a menace to public safety at road races(which many people in this thread are trying to argue), somebody, ANYBODY, is going to have to give an example.

It might be a good idea to have some real evidence before we start threatening to use tazars on them and their children.

right. i'm so sure that tazers would actually be used. there is no chance at all this is an ex-agg-er-a-tion. if you want the other side to grow up and show some sense, you'll have to too.

It's reprehensible to threaten children with violence, even as a joke. Grown-ups know that.

dukerdog wrote:

But if you want to convince me that stroller moms are such a menace to public safety at road races(which many people in this thread are trying to argue), somebody, ANYBODY, is going to have to give an example..

Read back through the thread, I gave two specific instances and noted I see about one a year. None in the last year, mainly because I'm a gimp and don't race anymore. The thread started with an example, which may have been far fetched, but your constant insistance that no examples exist is a bit misplaced since I'm not the only one to point them out. Seems pointless to repost earlier messages from the same thread, so look back a couple pages and you'll see several.

But there's a basic point that you're ignoring. They are banned already in most races because the insurance industry has determined that significant risk exists to make allowing them cost prohibitive for most events. If you want to argue with the insurance industry, go ahead, but the point is they're banned for a reason no matter what the BJ parents think. Someone that shows up at a race that specifically says "no baby joggers" or "no wheeled participants" and insists on racing with one anyway is selfishly tempting fate and potentially jeopardizing the future of that event. Now with only a couple of lawsuits related to BJ participants each year, the odds are with them, but the risk exists.

XCGirl,

Something to keep in mind for your race. Several years ago my sister was on the committee of a race that got sued. The lawsuit had nothing to do with baby joggers (a volunteer was seriously injured due to a freak accident on the course), but it did show everyone on the committee, and the running club that sponsored the race, just how "flimsy" race insurance can be and how easily coverage can be voided by even the littlest policy violation. So if your insurance policy prohibits baby joggers and something happens in your race that involves a baby jogger, should you get sued, you are up the proverbial creek.

dukerdog wrote:

You guys sound more and more like a Monty Python skit with every post.

funinthesun:

"Oh my god!! It's a stroller mom! Quick, spit on her!"

Bam Bam:

"Grab the infant and dash it firmly to the ground,"

Ravencourt:

"D*mn, where's my tazer? Somebody guard the 88-year-olds."

Bam Bam:

"or slap the f*cker silly."

Holland Nass:

"Release the hounds!"

Most Parents are IDIOTS!:

"F*cking bullsh*t f*ck!"

Bystander:

"Is all of this really necessary?

Dr. Running Mom:

"Oh yes maam. It's all in the interest of safety. You wouldn't want to see someone get hurt would you?"

Meanwhile, back in real life, we're all still waiting for someone to give us the details of one of those tragic stroller mom incidents.

You are full of crap. i did not say "release the hounds".

There should be infanticide and late term abortions for those up to 40 years of age at road races.

If your stuck with the kids just leave em in the car locked with windows rolled up.

Keith Stone wrote:

Read back through the thread, I gave two specific instances and noted I see about one a year. None in the last year, mainly because I'm a gimp and don't race anymore. The thread started with an example, which may have been far fetched, but your constant insistance that no examples exist is a bit misplaced since I'm not the only one to point them out.

There have been three types of stories posted so far:

1. Ones where someone got injured but seemed rather "far-fetched" as you, yourself put it.

2. Ones where some details were given. There was obnoxious behavior on the part of the stroller parent, annoyance, inconvenience, and/or perceived danger, but no physical contact or injuries were mentioned.

3. Your stories, that seem believable enough, but don't appear to have resulted in any real injuries or I'm sure you would have mentioned it.

Not a single believable story has been told about a stroller incident that resulted in any real injuries (stitches, broken bones, concussion, as Dr. Running Mom suggested). Frankly, I'm a little surprised we haven't had at least a couple, aren't you?

Why do the insurance companies ban strollers? I don't know. They ban walkmen too. How many walkman-related injuries have you had in your races? One reason they charge more for events that allow strollers might be increased liability. Any time you include children in the equation, the potential liability goes through the roof, even if the liklihood of an incident is the same or even less. If there is a serious injury of a child, it is much more likely there will be a lawsuit and it is much more likely the award or settlement will be large.

But I'll admit, your insurance arguement is fairly convincing. They may charge more because they have data that shows races with strollers have a much higher incidence of serious injuries and lawsuits. If that's true though, I'm confused as to why no one on this board can tell us about a time that actually happened. Why do you and others think it's silly of me to ask for such stories before I'll admit it's true?

I suspect most of us can agree that that the majority of people who use baby joggers do so responsibly and enjoy spending time with their kids while they exercise. They don't intend to cause harm or get in anyone's way. I also suspect that the vast majority of people who'd like to push their kids in a baby jogger during a race would be courteous and conscientious to their fellow participants. The problem is the 2% or so who aren't.

Unfortunately, from a race director's perspective, there isn't much flexibility. If the insurance policy bans baby joggers, the RD would be financially irresponsible to not to enforce that. S/he would be putting the club/organization that is sposoring the race, as well as potentially the board of directors the club and the members of the race committee, at considerable financial risk in case of a lawsuit. Nine times out of ten, the baby jogger poses no problem whatsoever and everyone goes home happy. And most of the race directors I know would have no problem allowing baby joggers as long as the parents were careful and observant. But the risk of just one incident is more than most RDs are willing to accept.

BTW, dukerdog, I have two friends whose kids couldn't stand being in the jogger. The parents tried it several times (at different ages) and the kids screamed the entire time. So while most kids do love it, at least a few don't!

i agree

Holland Nass wrote:

You are full of crap. i did not say "release the hounds".

I know you didn't. The other people didn't say exactly what I put for them either.

You did suggest using your pit bull to intimidate a stroller mom and her child.

Thank you for clearing my good name. You are forgiven.

Pebbles wrote:

Should we ban runners that elbow people or ones that push from behind or spit on you. Where do you draw the line.

umm yea we should that's why if it's seen you get disqualified...soooooooooo YOU'RE A MORON