Its not that you ran faster in training, its that your workouts were not catered to your racing style.
Its not that you ran faster in training, its that your workouts were not catered to your racing style.
o.O wrote:
Its not that you ran faster in training, its that your workouts were not catered to your racing style.
o.O,
Your post is constructive and helpful in contrast to metrododger's, which only spews vile sarcasm into the world, making it less pleasant for everyone, even himself.
I'm curious, how were my workouts not catered to my racing style.
o.O wrote:
Its not that you ran faster in training, its that your workouts were not catered to your racing style.
I think I was a little slow on this one. Witty. I assume you are saying that my racing style is "slow," therefore my training style "fast" did not match it. If I am understanding you correctly, then I say that your comment is witty, but over-generalized not helpful.
It is weird that in the past, I used to train super-intense and I raced faster. Lately, I've been trying less rest between intervals, which slowed me down in the workouts and I ran slower in the races. I'm still going to stick with what I'm doing because I can't know how much age has to do with the slow rate of my improvement. I'm just glad to be improving.
Another thing I'm doing differently is being consistent. In the past I would run a 51 mile week and then catch the flu or have some other problem that would make the next week low mileage. What I did was average what I was really running back then and it came out to about 24 mpw, even though in my mind it had felt like higher volume because of the high volume weeks.
The poster that made fun of me for only running 18.5 mpw seems to only value human dignity on whether or not someone trains at an elite level. If I can come up with a plan to help at least masters runners get to a high racing level without getting injured, that's be helpful. The sport can be fun for a lifetime if we restrict our training to make it so. "Fun" should not be undervalued.
I am trying a less popular training paradigm because it emphasizes longevity and being gentle to the body compared to focusing on winning ASAP. This is why I am happy about taking 18 seconds per year off of my 1500m time. If I can keep this up, I can take almost a minute off of my time in three years time. The alternative seems to be to take 30 seconds off of my time and then get injured and go back to square one.
I've already beat up my body by doing volume I can't handle. I've trained for an IronMan triathlon in 4 months, in my first year in that sport, and completed the race, trashing my body in the process. I've tried training exactly like Seb Coe and always ended up injured. Now, I'm facing that I am a has been who barely was and that is not going to change. I'm training like an 8th Grader because that is how I race right now.
Acceptance always precedes transformation. I don't think many of the posters on this site get that. They are too arrogant to.
From200mTo8k wrote:
The poster that made fun of me for only running 18.5 mpw seems to only value human dignity on whether or not someone trains at an elite level.
I don't think training at an elite level has absolutely any bearing on what you're talking about.
I've read through this thread and it's a bit strange. You seem to be trying to come up with some "plan" in which you get better without really doing anything (because 18.5 mpw isn't really doing much).
Then you get all defensive with it. Your thread is titled with the "Low mileage" banner but 18.5 mpw isn't even training. That's just running a little bit.
Just kind of dumb.
metrododger wrote:
I don't think training at an elite level has absolutely any bearing on what you're talking about.
I've read through this thread and it's a bit strange. You seem to be trying to come up with some "plan" in which you get better without really doing anything (because 18.5 mpw isn't really doing much).
Then you get all defensive with it. Your thread is titled with the "Low mileage" banner but 18.5 mpw isn't even training. That's just running a little bit.
Just kind of dumb.
My objection is not to when anyone respectfully disagrees with me. My objection is to when one lacks tact in the way they convey they disagree. All humans deserve respect, including me. For example, "Just kind of dumb" would be a statement that in my opinion lacks tact in spite of how "dumb" my plan might be.
For those who care, I changed the way I was training. I followed the plan, but took one of the Johnson's advice and ran my speed workouts easier. Training this way feels great but I ran slower one year later in a 5k than in the previous year.
Now I am going to modify the plan since this experiment seems a failure. The plan got me into shape so that I can get into better shape without getting injured, which I like, but it only took me so far. Most people would have guessed this, but I had to learn from experience. As far as my intelligence goes. I think that as long as I can learn from my experiments, that that is a sign of intelligence. All humans learn through experience. All humans try one thing, assess it, and make adjustments with no exceptions. There is no way around it, especially since what works for one runner might not work for another, etc.
Now I am going to change the 60 minute run/walk in this plan to a max of two hours and 40 minutes. Right now I am at 1 hour and 40 minutes. I want to see what happens if I only increase the distance of the long run, but leave the rest the same.
I'm also going to have a longer base period and skip some of the transitional periods and also the finishing kick development period. I look forward to seeing if there are any changes in my performance this track season.
From200mTo8k wrote:
My objection is not to when anyone respectfully disagrees with me. My objection is to when one lacks tact in the way they convey they disagree. All humans deserve respect, including me. For example, "Just kind of dumb" would be a statement that in my opinion lacks tact in spite of how "dumb" my plan might be.
All humans do not deserve respect.
That is also "just kind of dumb".
I'm not concerned with your concern regarding tact. It was a dumb plan and that was stated outright from the beginning.
Now you've gone and wasted a better part of the year just so you could experience the dumbness in and of itself.
I don't know why you want to post all this stuff if you're just going to argue about the responses you get, especially when your defense is so silly in the first place. And now you're regressing to "I had to learn for myself".
Whatever floats your boat. Object away.
From200mTo8k wrote:
Now I am going to modify the plan since this experiment seems a failure.
Don't say we didn't tell you so.
Human beings, who are almost unique in having the ability to learn from the experience of others, are also remarkable for their apparent disinclination to do so.
Let us not get ahead of ourselves. It is possible that I will not improve. It is also possible that I will get injured. Already, I have had pains in key areas such as the knees from the increased time out there running. I'm not going to beat up my body and I am going to increase my longest run slowly, but let's not count our chickens before they are hatched.
It is a fact that I took a total of two minutes off of my 5k time before I plateaued using the original plan. My new plan is only a tweak of the original plan. I am not going to add days/week running or increase the distances I run on any of the days except for the long run.
Some of the latest responders seem not to be paying attention to the thread. I HAVE done things based on what others have learned. I was coached in college by a coach who believed in big miles, even for 800-1500m types. My particular body type is different than others. I have denser bones and bigger muscles than the average long distance runner. I DO need a plan tailored to me. The reason I wanted volunteers was to see if what worked for me would work for others.
To continue to do things the same way when they haven't worked for you in the past displays an inability to learn.
Just stop,Seriously. This training plan is retarded.
Just stop,Seriously. This training plan is retarded.
18 miles per week is not low mileage, it is no mileage. i'm sure there are people in big urban cities who walk more per week.
40 miles per week would be low mileage for an 800 guy. 18 is nothing. run more. not saying you need to do 100+ per week but you should at least get to 40, and even that is pretty damn low.
Wow I just read through this whole thread and I must say, I've never seen such a relentless display of faulty logic in all my time on letsrun. I've seen a lot of stupid posts here, but none with the length and consistency of the OP's posts in this thread. Virtually everything the OP has posted has left me scratching my head and wondering what the hell was going through his mind when he wrote it. For example, he makes the absolutely bizarre claim that Ryan Hall is less talented than Bob Kennedy because he ran more mileage in high school. Equally absurd is his use of Haile Gebrselassie as an example of the perils of high mileage. Both of these claims are so absurd that I find it impossible to wrap my mind around the thought processes that produced them. I would cite more examples but all the stupid comments contained in this thread began to blend together after awhile. The OP's posts in this thread were so offensively and unprecedentedly stupid that I felt the need to end my response with some rather harsh advice:
OP, everyone is bad at something. People should learn what they are bad at so that they can concentrate instead on things that they are good at. You are bad at thinking. You will be happier if you left the thinking to smart people. I'm sure you are good at something else. Figure out what that thing is, and excel at it.
there's a book called run less, run faster. it's kind of like your plan. i have been doing it and am running my fastest 5k's and 10k's since college. it's about 15-25 miles per week max. i'm 30 yrs old and doing workouts a lot like the ones you have outlined. lot's of 3x1 mile with little rest etc. it seems to work on people who are naturally fast, and have run competitively (know how to handle pain and discomfort in races) i'm interested and might give this a try since i have nothing to lose.
thanks
Is the op still around? I'd like to talk with him about this plan.