Well VO2max and Lactate Threshold would allow us to know if he has got an exceptional lactate threshold at a high % of his VO2max, or if there is still some room for improvement.
Well VO2max and Lactate Threshold would allow us to know if he has got an exceptional lactate threshold at a high % of his VO2max, or if there is still some room for improvement.
Fullfeldein wrote:
Querfeldein wrote:
Those doping allegations are as predictable as they are pathetic.
Everybody knows EPO does not work for the top runners born at latitude.
Sure, testing is getting better, which is why we see the lack of guys running under 13:55 and 26:40
That´s åprobably why they run the marathon a lot slower today than they did in those days!
Oh, wait...
the 90s called, please leave wrote:
renatosmiracle wrote:
In the meantime we still don"t know whether this guy's VO2Max is exceptional as it should be
VO2Max?
HAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHA!
What a fvcking moran!
VO2Max has no practical relevance to marathon pace whatsoever.
Go away, idiot, just go away.
Moran. It means something if you want to run really fast.
Moen getting handled by everybody's favorite 16-year old phenom:
Renato, i’d love to see Moen’s full training between Valencia and Fukuoka when you have a chance. Really enjoyed reading one of your posts previous about his build into Valencia. Thank you for your great comments!
Not as bulky as Solinsky, by any stretch of the imagination. Runners just always look bigger in motion. This is one lean dude.
Renato's right that Europeans can run sub 2:06 clean but they were mentally beaten for twenty years with the rise of African talents in larger numbers. However, I have to wonder why there aren't more Americans at this level in the marathon, because there are talents at the level of Moen or better every year in the high school system. He ran the equivalent of 8:47 3200m as a junior in high school and 13:30 at 19. The latter is better but there are maybe a dozen 8:40s guys in hs every year and a few of them do it as juniors. Dathan was a low 8:40s guy as a junior and his best was 2:07:47, which was about two minutes faster than his 2nd best time. The only guy we've developed who was close to Moen was Hall (59:43/2:06:17 (don't count the 2:04:58)). Plenty of guys are at 60-61 every year and don't break 2:10 or even 2:11. There must be something about their marathon training in comparison to their half marathon training.
The other thing is that training at altitude with Kenyans or Ethiopians on dirt roads for a long period of time is going to improve just about anyone markedly. The training group is much more important to quality training than most realize. When I've had good training partners, I've seen marked improvements.
I think Moen is doing a lot of his training on his own. I do agree with you that with so many 60-61m guys, you'd expect
a few 2:08 guys at least. I bet their long runs are too slow or too short.
xcvxcvxcv wrote:
The other thing is that training at altitude with Kenyans or Ethiopians on dirt roads for a long period of time is going to improve just about anyone markedly. The training group is much more important to quality training than most realize. When I've had good training partners, I've seen marked improvements.
It`s good as long as you don`t do another runners best pace and just your own best pace (Or if your best paces is the same)
My take on Renato's opinion is that americans don't do enough fast long runs, which he attributes to the jump in marathon times since 2000.
For me, it seems that Americans are very focussed on interval based workouts, like for example 2-3 mile repeats at MP and continuous fast runs up until 10 miles or so. I think Renato has a more long and fast continuous approach to training runs that is more marathon specific
zxcvxcvxcv wrote:
Renato's right that Europeans can run sub 2:06 clean but they were mentally beaten for twenty years with the rise of African talents in larger numbers. However, I have to wonder why there aren't more Americans at this level in the marathon, because there are talents at the level of Moen or better every year in the high school system. He ran the equivalent of 8:47 3200m as a junior in high school and 13:30 at 19. The latter is better but there are maybe a dozen 8:40s guys in hs every year and a few of them do it as juniors. Dathan was a low 8:40s guy as a junior and his best was 2:07:47, which was about two minutes faster than his 2nd best time. The only guy we've developed who was close to Moen was Hall (59:43/2:06:17 (don't count the 2:04:58)). Plenty of guys are at 60-61 every year and don't break 2:10 or even 2:11. There must be something about their marathon training in comparison to their half marathon training.
Because the American school system is constructed to produce middle distance runners, not marathoners.
djcdjfjd wrote:
My take on Renato's opinion is that americans don't do enough fast long runs, which he attributes to the jump in marathon times since 2000.
For me, it seems that Americans are very focussed on interval based workouts, like for example 2-3 mile repeats at MP and continuous fast runs up until 10 miles or so. I think Renato has a more long and fast continuous approach to training runs that is more marathon specific
Also, it used to be that U.S. (and I think UK) road guys would race 10K-42K on a regular basis, thus getting in "long fast runs" at least several times a month, plus a lot of race experience. It seems that current U.S. guys spend months at a time without races just putting in miles.
As usual, getting lots of love and support from Kenya. Go Sondre!
nyc72 wrote:
Not just medium talent - guy ran a 8:12 3k as a HS junior (approx 8:47 3200) and a 13:30 5k as a college sophmore in 2011, before years of injury problems.
so there's STILL hope for German?
Sorry Troll Attempt wrote:
https://www.dn.no/incoming/article163152.ece/ALTERNATES/fullwidth/LB%20nordstad%20moen.jpgNot as bulky as Solinsky, by any stretch of the imagination. Runners just always look bigger in motion. This is one lean dude.
The chick looks feisty. I bet that every high school x-country team in the West has a skinny ginger like him on it.
He followed my secret training, in secret!
Getting ahead of the Joneses wrote:
If a guy like Steve Jones could run 2:07 30 years ago shouldn't a guy who likely has a bit more raw talent be able to run faster?
So the other Caucasian Europeans on the all time list with times from the last 25-30 years...
1. Antonio Pinto 2.06.36 (be very surprised if clean)
2. Benoit Z 2.06.36 (drug cheat)
3. Julio Rey 2.06.52 (drug cheat)
4 .Dymytro Baranovski 2.07.15 (highly suspicious)
5. Fabian Roncero 2.07.23 (drug cheat)
6. Victor Rothlin 2.07.25 (very strange medical issues!)
7. Olexandr Kuzin 2.07.33 (who!!! Exactly)
8. Henrick Szost 2.07.50 (coach is convicted drug cheat)
And people wonder why we are suspicious!
vaporfly for real wrote:
Did he train in the vaporfly? Honestly, I think it's the shoes. Look at what Shalane did in NYC, a tough course. The Vaporfly's hard to get so not everyone has them. Total advantage. They are way lighter than the Adios, a heavy shoe.
My question for Renata is what shoe did he train in? Shalane said she couldn't be without the shoe, think she trained in them, but not sure.
Don’t forget the singlet. The shoes will NOT work properly without the correct singlet!!!
nyc72 wrote:
Not just medium talent - guy ran a 8:12 3k as a HS junior (approx 8:47 3200) and a 13:30 5k as a college sophmore in 2011, before years of injury problems.
rupp ran 13:30 in high school. he should be a 2:04 guy then......
