Allright Letsrun - Who wins, Ryan Hall 2007 or Galen Rupp in 2017

Ryan Shay died at mile 5

I never understood all the talks about Hall having guts. He popped a couple fast races but I seem to remember the majority of the time he would "run his own race". Too often the leaders would eventually break away, he would glance at his watch, and just keep the same pace.

Anyway, I would rather have wins and medals than a fast PR.

I have a feeling that those who say Hall are maybe in their 40s or even older, and those who are Rupp No Matter What on this and other threads are much, much, much younger. The kind who believe the world began in 2004.

They make every possible modification to whatever Rupp does, meaning every race he runs is "worth" something faster by bizarre machinations, but those same situations for every other runner ever are not allowed.

Wind? Rupp had the worst ever, even compared to runners ahead of him.

Rain? Same.

Hills? Same.

Humidity? Same.

Fast courses are slow when Rupp runs them.

Slow courses are slower when Rupp runs them.

Sorry, Nike and Al, Rupp is at risk of women running nearly as fast as he has, and the men's WR something like 2 miles ahead of his best. Funny how the near 2-flat marathon is a video all over the place, and Rupp is slower than crap. Did you expect this?

You must be new here. Here, the older runners are the ones who convert everything: "Ryun's time on cinders was worth...", "If Bill Rodgers ran today..."

Without insulting either group, it's this:

The people who support Hall are literal thinkers. Hall ran faster. Hall ran more races. From that perspective, Hall wins because it eliminates nearly every other variable other than time. This was of thinking is rather simplistic, but it's not necessarily wrong because it requires the opposing side to provide evidence to invalidate the the tangible numbers.

The people who support Rupp are contextual thinkers. They can point out that a 90 degree marathon is slower than a 50 degree marathon and factor in other variables. To this group of people, Rupp is more impressive. And generally, when people run consistently impressive races without running a time trial, they have huge time trials efforts in them. To this group of people, they look and say, at peak, Hall couldn't be as competitive as Rupp, and Rupp is racing better runners.

Nice thoughts. Not new here, nor to running, since I ran my first road race in 1976.

And I've never personally viewed any time as "worth" anything. The progression of fast times has been fascinating to watch these past 40 years, even if I was under the impression that the 70s was a drought of marathon records (until Salazar in 1981, making a nice segue here).

Because the thing about Rupp that is plain as day to me is, his track PRs are from many years ago, and his fast half marathon is a from long ago. His marathon times are coming down at a glacial speed, and his PR basically is glacial, considering the world record. I understand running for championship wins, and can point at Lasse Viren, who withstood WR-like paces to win Olympic medals. I can point at Carlos Lopes, who had a singular focus to win the 84 Olympic Marathon then set a world record at Rotterdam. I can point at Geoffrey Mutai's 2:05 at NYC and call it the most amazing marathon ever run, yet not a record, and can realize that Kipchoge's near 2 flat will be quaint in a few years when someone runs that for real. (At Berlin likely, since that's a legit race run much like Monza anyway.)

I don't 'hate' Rupp, I've called him a baller before, and thought his Olympic bronze run was awesome. But I've also thought that he came into this marathon field a few years too late. I guess we'll all see about that one.

Check out @JoshCox’s Tweet: https://twitter.com/JoshCox/status/930867718575685632?s=09

Lol. Wow.

That's what happens when you switch from EPO to testosterone.

Holy fatness, Ryan Hall.

Making gains ...

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C94aK0_UMAA4SQB.jpg

I thought lifting was supposed to make you look better. Hall was much better looking before. His face looks like bloated now.

Hall wins easily - if it's a bench press competition.

Jacked now wrote:

Check out @JoshCox’s Tweet:

https://twitter.com/JoshCox/status/930867718575685632?s=09

I still don't like that people call him a 2:04 marathoner. 204:58 on a non-record eligible course. Next best time over 2:06. Doesn't seem right.

Huuuuge wrote:

Who cares!!!!!!

Both SUCk!!!¡

Hall all talk no fight pansy

Rupp special sause cheater

Get a better question

Hate them both

That seems quite sick (and not in the sense of "awesome").

Skolvith wrote:

vkvkcjcjcj wrote:

I agree that when he was a sub 27 10k runner he would easily been 2:06 or faster. Although I think he's still a low 27 runner who just hasn't been in the right race yet to run that fast. The thon has shown that one can pr in his mid thirties. So he just needs to get in London or Berlin and go after it. If he sticks to just the major domestic thons and Olympics it will be very disappointing. But it might be better for him financially, so who am I to judge.

Alberto has a plan here. I would expect to see Rupp in one of the high-speed marathons next spring, most likely London. His chicago race should get him on the 2018 WC team already, so he could go for it in the spring and see what happens.

Most people here expected Rupp to run London this spring, but it looks like it's another Boston. I'm not getting the feeling that Al Sal thinks Rupp has a fast marathon in him.