The official 2017 HEPS CROSS COUNTRY thread

Here is a video of the women's individual battle that came down to the wire:

https://twitter.com/NCAATrackField/status/923936635280084995

When is the last team in any conference went from last to 1st? What about the Ivy League?

https://twitter.com/TheRealMerb/status/923937449822257153

Men's race is underway.

https://twitter.com/IvyLeague/status/923942844645208066

Ivy League men live results at 2.1k. I wouldn't read too much into it as only 4 seconds separate 1st from 40th.

PLACE TEAM 2.1K 1 2 3 4 5 (6) (7)

1 Princeton 36

1 5 9 10 11 (12) (23)

2 Cornell 75

2 13 14 17 29 (30) (46)

3 Columbia 77

3 6 7 25 36 (37) (40)

4 Dartmouth 118

18 20 22 27 31 (33) (39)

5 Brown 119

15 16 19 26 43 (44) (52)

6 Yale 156

4 32 34 38 48 (50) (51)

7 Penn 170

24 28 35 41 42 (45) (49)

8 Harvard 183

8 21 47 53 54 (55) (56)

In-Progress Standings

PLACE ATHLETE 2.1K PTS

1 Conor Lundy

Princeton [SO]

6:18.2

-

1

2 Dominic Deluca

Cornell [SR]

6:18.4

0.2

2

3 Ryan Thomas

Columbia [SR]

6:18.7

0.5

3

4 Trevor Reinhart

Yale [SO]

6:18.7

0.5

4

5 Matt Grossman

Princeton [FR]

6:18.8

0.6

5

6 Brian Zabilski

Columbia [JR]

6:18.9

0.7

6

7 Kenny Vasbinder

Columbia [SO]

6:19.0

0.8

7

8 Hugo Milner

Harvard [FR]

6:19.0

0.8

8

9 Robert Stone

Princeton [SR]

6:19.0

0.8

9

10 William Paulson

Princeton [SR]

6:19.1

0.9

10

11 Garrett O'Toole

Princeton [SR]

6:19.4

1.2

11

12 Noah Kauppila

Princeton [SR]

6:19.4

1.2

12

13 Chase Silverman

Cornell [SR]

6:19.4

1.2

13

14 Roc Johnson

Cornell [JR]

6:19.7

1.5

14

15 Martin Martinez

Brown [SR]

6:19.7

1.5

15

16 Cameron Daly

Brown [SO]

6:19.8

1.6

16

17 Josh Dyrland

Cornell [SR]

6:20.0

1.8

17

18 Alexander Kushen

Dartmouth [JR]

6:20.2

2.0

18

19 Mike Wyman

Brown [SR]

6:20.2

2.0

19

20 Miles Irish

Dartmouth [JR]

6:20.3

2.1

20

21 Tyler Spear

Harvard [SR]

6:20.3

2.1

21

22 Patrick Gregory

Dartmouth [SR]

6:20.3

2.1

22

23 Gannon Willcutts

Princeton [SO]

6:20.5

2.3

23

24 Viraj Deokar

Princeton [SO]

6:20.5

2.3

25 Wolfgang Beck

Princeton [SR]

6:20.6

2.4

26 Patrick Hally

Penn [SR]

6:20.8

2.6

24

27 Lucky Schreiner

Columbia [JR]

6:20.8

2.6

25

28 Gabriel Altopp

Brown [SO]

6:20.8

2.6

26

29 Patrick O'Brien

Dartmouth [FR]

6:20.9

2.7

27

30 Christopher Luciano

Penn [SR]

6:21.1

2.9

28

31 Samuel Chauvin

Cornell [SR]

6:21.2

3.0

29

32 Michael Wang

Cornell [SR]

6:21.3

3.1

30

33 Will Shafer

Dartmouth [SR]

6:21.4

3.2

31

34 Jonathan Lomogda

Yale [FR]

6:21.5

3.3

32

35 Sean Laverty

Dartmouth [SO]

6:21.6

3.4

33

36 Nick Dahl

Yale [FR]

6:21.6

3.4

34

37 Aaron Groff

Penn [SO]

6:21.7

3.5

35

38 Spencer Haik

Columbia [SR]

6:21.7

3.5

36

39 Dylan Tarpey

Columbia [SR]

6:21.9

3.7

37

40 Will Laird

Yale [FR]

6:22.0

3.8

38

Ivy league men at 5k.

PLACE TEAM 5K 1 2 3 4 5 (6) (7)

1 Columbia 42

1 5 10 12 14 (23) (37)

2 Princeton 42

4 6 8 9 15 (16) (17)

3 Penn 83

2 7 20 26 28 (30) (31)

4 Cornell 138

11 19 24 39 45 (49) (50)

5 Dartmouth 141

22 25 27 33 34 (35) (36)

61 Yale 154

3 21 41 42 47 (51) (53)

71 Brown 155

13 29 32 38 43 (44) (55)

8 Harvard 204

18 40 46 48 52 (54) (56)

I won't post individual splits. YOu can find them here:

Princeton has more room for erroer as their #6 and 7 are ahead of Columbia but Pauslon moved back a bunch of spots between 4.1k and 5k which is concerning. Is's still very tight as the top 20 is basically just one pack.

One coach told me his plan was to have his guys run as a pack for 5k and hammer. Let's see if that happens.

https://results.leonetiming.com/XC.html?mid=1295

It was totally a two team meet. A great stat from Jonathan Gault. Columbia should be proud of their runner-up effort.

https://twitter.com/jgault13/status/923951984503291906

I got something right in my preview. I wrote if someone dominated, it would be Princeton.They put 5 in the top 10 and won with 28 points!!

They did exactly what Vig wanted them to do. Pack it up for 5k and then race. Great runs by the speed guys Kauppila and O'Tootle who were 2nd and 4th. Paulson did fade but in the end it didn't matter a tall.

Columbia ran great with 4 in the top 8 but Princeton would have beaten them if they had to score 6 to Columbia's 5.

In-Progress Standings

PLACE TEAM 5 MILE 1 2 3 4 5 (6) (7)

1 Princeton 28

2 3 4 9 10 (13) (17)

2 Columbia 43

1 5 7 8 22 (32) (43)

3 Penn 91

12 14 20 21 24 (25) (28)

4 Cornell 131

15 16 26 34 40 (46) (49)

5 Dartmouth 138

18 27 29 31 33 (39) (45)

6 Yale 158

6 23 37 42 50 (53) (54)

7 Brown 164

19 30 36 38 41 (48) (51)

8 Harvard 189

11 35 44 47 52 (55) (56)

What was the weather like? Was there a headwind? I know it was tactical for 5k (top 20 still together) but my god the times are SLOW AS HECK. Look at this. Only 3 guys broke 25?

Individual results at Leone Timing.

In terms of the women's individual race, it was the second closest in meet history (0.6 seconds).

Kate Wiley of Harvard won with 0.4 sec to spare back in 1982.

A couple of random notes from a guy who went out to the Bronx to catch the meet today:

1. Holy sh*t, what a gorgeous day to watch a meet --or run a race. 58, sunshine, very light wind. Perfect. An absolute joy to be out there on a day like this, running back and forth across the lawn in short shorts and t-shirt,... at Halloween. Global warming's gonna suck for the human race for sure, but I'm really enjoying it this fall. (This extended summer, I should say, since summer hasn't really come to an end yet this year.)

2. Answer to Rojo's question: No, wind was not an issue. Yes, the men's race was very slow, very tactical. Big lead pack all the way through 5K.

Princeton pack did a really good job of controlling it and slowing it from the front, I think, but it seemed like no one else was ready to try and push it, so the first half was very slow --and that probably favored the miler-heavy Tiger group.

Women went out harder, and strung out quite a bit more.

3. Running back and forth across that giant field with all the 'B'-teamers, coaches, friends, parents, grandparents, siblings, cousins, etc. --and the odd Olympian-- is truly hysterical, fairly ridiculous, and a lot of fun. A lot of older people in very good shape in that crowd.

4. Megan Curham looked like someone who's been slowly working her way back to top form, knew she probably wasn't quite there yet, but thought just maybe she could gut it out and catch lightning in a bottle if things went just right.

She was out with the leaders for about the first half, but came out of the woods in ~ 16th or so, and looked like she was really hurting.

Give her another couple months, and maybe she's back to the top tier in the country again.

5. I nearly got clipped by Coach Vig, steaming across the field to catch the boys as they disappeared into the woods.

He still moves and looks like a serious mid-D guy.

6. In-between races, I noticed a youthful guy in a Princeton t-shirt bounding by, carrying a rack of drinks for the team.

Couldn't see his face too well, but immediately thought, 'Man, that guy's stride looks really familiar.' (Very distinctive, super-athletic, bouncy, powerful stride.) Then I thought, 'Man, that guy runs just like Robby Andrews.'

Then I looked again and thought, 'Oh, that's 'cause it IS Robby Andrews.'

Kinda cool to see an Olympian out there selflessly helping out the guys he trains with, and holy sh*t does he have an impressive stride when you see him run in person --even just striding down the cinders in the park.

7. Tactical bent of the men's race led to a really exciting mass finish down the home straight. Really impressive how Thomas managed to hold off the charging Princeton trio.

There was also, however, an amazing drama in the finish that no one here has mentioned.

Watching the boys come down the home-stretch, it was clear it was all Princeton and Columbia, and it looked like it was very close.

Princeton, of course, had 3 right up front, but then Columbia followed right up with 5, 7, & 8, which gave them 4 in the top 8,... so I naturally craned my neck to scan down the cinders for the Lions' #5.

And I saw him, right there, except for two things: 2 more orange jerseys were right with him --making this a desperately tight battle-- and as soon as I saw him, I saw him slow, stutter-step, stagger, weave, and then drop to the track, as the two Tigers drove away from him to the finish. He struggled up, staggered again, went down again, hard, and that was it. He collapsed at the side of the track, and almost immediately got medical attention from multiple parties.

I think that must've been Spencer Haik, who was listed near the leaders for the first half of the race, but for some reason doesn't show a 7K split. He must've come out of the woods right with, or very close behind, his teammates at 7 and 8, before totally imploding with 150 or 200 to go.

If he'd been able to hang with those guys for the last 200, and keep in front of the Princeton pair ten seconds back, this race would've been tied, 30-30.

The Princeton guys ran brilliantly, but so did the Lions. They made this really, really close. (Even closer than the scores look.)

8. Disappointing races from the Quaker duo, Monogue and Luciano, and also from Cornell's Deluca. All three of those guys faded badly in the last K or two. Didn't a lot of folks pick Deluca to win? What happened?

9. Conspicuous by their absence (people I thought I might see, but didn't): Rojo, Wejo, Merber, Cabral.

Anyone make any other interesting sightings?

It's a really fun meet to watch. Check it out sometime, if you have a chance.

Anyone get photos of the race?

Great meet. Great Job Princeton and Jason Vig......

However, take a look at the results at the Princeton Invitational-- held at Princeton 2 weeks ago where almost everyone was running close to 24:00 for 8K. Then you go to VCP and the winner runs 24:58. At the Princeton Invitational, Princeton AVERAGED 24:18 for 8K at home but only 25:07 at VCP. What accounts for the 51 second difference?

1) Obviously VCP is a tougher course but,

2) Princeton University's 8K course is short by 15-20 seconds at a 5:00 Mile Pace. I train on their 8K course regularly and know the course quite well.

3) By the way, HEPS Results from VCP says the race distance is 5.0 miles. Is the course they ran yesterday 5.0 Miles?? or is it 8K??

http://www.runccrs.com/princeton-invitational-mens-8k-101417/

https://xc.tfrrs.org/results/xc/13080.html

Heps was 5 miles.

CanDoGuy wrote:

However, take a look at the results at the Princeton Invitational-- held at Princeton 2 weeks ago where almost everyone was running close to 24:00 for 8K. Then you go to VCP and the winner runs 24:58. At the Princeton Invitational, Princeton AVERAGED 24:18 for 8K at home but only 25:07 at VCP. What accounts for the 51 second difference?

1) Obviously VCP is a tougher course but,

2) Princeton University's 8K course is short by 15-20 seconds at a 5:00 Mile Pace. I train on their 8K course regularly and know the course quite well.

3) By the way, HEPS Results from VCP says the race distance is 5.0 miles. Is the course they ran yesterday 5.0 Miles?? or is it 8K??

Ok, Princeton definitely isn't 20 seconds short. You must just run really really slow if that's true for you. The slow times came purely from the difficulty of the course and the tactical nature of the race.

sp2 wrote:

8. Disappointing races from the Quaker duo, Monogue and Luciano, and also from Cornell's Deluca. All three of those guys faded badly in the last K or two. Didn't a lot of folks pick Deluca to win? What happened?

Word (third- or fourth-hand) is that Deluca picked up a back injury on the course.

Great insight. Great point. I didn't realize it was that tigh as I swear the live timing had Princeton totally dominating at 7.1k. Was anyone else watching it? Did you see the same thing as me?

I saw Princeton dominating at 7.1 k and figured they couldn't blow it. I got on the phone to call fellow Princeton alum Chris Lear who has known coach Vigilante since junior high. Then they started adding in people and it was closer. But nothing like it shows now. It shows Princeton down by 1 a 7.1 k. I wonder if someone from Leone timing can provide an explanation?

Yep. I thought if Princeton ran their best they might go really low but never in my wildest imagination did I think no one from Penn or Deluca fail to get in the top 10. Penn's #1 would have been Princeton's #6 - just one spot ahead of their #7.

I was packed and ready to come but just couldn't pull it off. What is your connection to the league? Or are you the one fan with no connection.

kibitzer wrote:

sp2 wrote:

8. Disappointing races from the Quaker duo, Monogue and Luciano, and also from Cornell's Deluca. All three of those guys faded badly in the last K or two. Didn't a lot of folks pick Deluca to win? What happened?

Word (third- or fourth-hand) is that Deluca picked up a back injury on the course.

Reminds me of Weldon's senior year. He hurt his back about 10 days before heps. Went crazy on a bike to keep fit and used a bunch of muscles he wasn't used to running. Didn't place in the top 40 I don't think. I'd love to see full results for 1992-1993-1994-1995 including jv results.

If you have them post t hem.

I know the course is short and I have an e mail into JV. How fast you run has nothing to do with "calibration" if you know 4th grade math.

rojo wrote:

Great insight. Great point. I didn't realize it was that tigh as I swear the live timing had Princeton totally dominating at 7.1k. Was anyone else watching it? Did you see the same thing as me?

I saw Princeton dominating at 7.1 k and figured they couldn't blow it. I got on the phone to call fellow Princeton alum Chris Lear who has known coach Vigilante since junior high. Then they started adding in people and it was closer. But nothing like it shows now. It shows Princeton down by 1 a 7.1 k. I wonder if someone from Leone timing can provide an explanation?

I also saw Princeton dominating at the 7.1k, per team scoring. Must have been a math error... didn’t someone suggest that haik wasn’t initially given a 7.1k split? He could have somehow not registered immediately (therefore scoring with their sixth man, resulting in a higher score?) but then they revised it later? My theory.

Cr26 wrote:

Anyone get photos of the race?

Photos by Bill Shearn (affiliated with Penn) available here.

Sideline Photos (hired by Ivy League) available here.