Is plant-based diet truly the best for running?

Sage, don't waste your time answering this illiterate anti-vegan crusader who posts the same sh*t over and over under different usernames...

cage sanaday wrote:

I already eat very clean, just not vegan. Not saying I should cut out animal products completely (eggs and yogurt will probably remain a staple in my diet), but in terms of overall performance, I would imagine if I switched to about 70% plant-based foods that it would have carryover to performance as well as quality of life.

On a side note, I think going completely vegan is a mistake because human beings are OMNIVORES. I barely eat red meat, maybe once every 2-3 months and typically eat white meat a few times per week. A healthy balance would probably be optimal, but I would have to find my personal sweet spot on my own.

Any anecdotes of people going partially, primarily, or completely plant-based and how it affected your running?

We are not omnivores, dogs, rats, squirrels, bears, pigs, skunks, rhinoceroses, badgers, raccoons and foxes are omnivores and we are nothing like these animals.

Meat itself (from animals on a primal diet free to roam and not lay in their own p*ss) is not fattening or unhealthy. It’s what you put with it and what it is cooked with that makes it unhealthy. Also, most meat is cnventional with an unstable omega fat ratio which could also be considered unhealthy but as long as you gett enough omega 3s from avocados and nuts, conventional meat occasionally shouldn’t kill you.

What would a map of refined vs unrefined consumption trends look like against all health markers. Plant vs animal, carbs vs protein is not the most influential variable. A note on meat, as Ray D mentions the quality of meat consumed reflects the environment and nutrition fed throughout the animals life. Just as growing a carrot in suboptimal conditions would result in a poor crop. This should be the focus of most peoples choice.

No it is the best diet for longevity.

With moderate amounts (1 pound/week) of quality meat.

Rayo wrote:

What would a map of refined vs unrefined consumption trends look like against all health markers.

Health markers follow wealth much more than any diet. Poorer countries have higher carbohydrate diets, lower obesity, lower diabetes rates, and lower life expectancy. It's really one-percenter problems when we get worked up about exact macronutrient percentage or refined versus unrefined foods (which there is no clear demarcation between).

Of course there are variations. There are a few wealthy countries that have high carbohydrate consumption (although not as high as the true poor countries) and low obesity, like Japan and Korea. And there are middle income countries with high obesity.

Rapo. wrote:

We are not omnivores, dogs, rats, squirrels, bears, pigs, skunks, rhinoceroses, badgers, raccoons and foxes are omnivores and we are nothing like these animals.

I found the source you took that list from, and it's inaccurate. Rhinos are herbivores, though doubtless they ingest a few insects in the course of consuming mountains of plant matter; in natural settings, every herbivore does that.

Bears, on the other hand, are generally omnivores--and are "something like" humans in a great many ways.

Most human beings, over most of the course of their quarter-million years of existence, have derived nutrition from a variety of plant and animal sources; human digestive systems have evolved to accommodate/require that.

Humans, like all other mammals, start out as non-vegan as can be: Mother's milk is exactly the opposite of vegan. Many humans of Northern European, South Asian, and East African descent have mutations that allow them to digest milk as adults. To suggest that consumption of milk products would necessarily be harmful to them is profoundly anti-scientific.

The fact is that individuals are different, and someone who's found the best diet for him/her (if s/he has even actually done so) has not found the ideal diet for all humans. A lot of evidence, both anecdotal and researched, suggests that some people are best served with a vegan diet but that most people are not.

Rapo. wrote:

We are not omnivores, dogs, rats, squirrels, bears, pigs, skunks, rhinoceroses, badgers, raccoons and foxes are omnivores and we are nothing like these animals.

That's very incorrect. We are much more similar to those animals than meet the eye. For example, our stomach acid PH is very acidic, like a omnivore or carnivore. We lost our cecum(something primarily carnivorous animals do), we cannot properly digest a large amount of plant matter now. Are digestive system is much more like that of a dog than of our great ape relatives.

If you're interested in how the vegans pull the wool over your eyes. Watch a scientist explain these studies vegans point to as proof. Go to 5:40

https://youtu.be/eh0AXbcG2WA

There are no plants with a nutrient profile similar to that of sardines. Fact.

Another fact. All notable elite runners, be it XC, roads, or track, eat meat and plants. The most successful vegan runners are Instagram promoters and ultrawalkers. Draw your own conclusions.

Vegans have never been able to demonstrate how an all-plant diet is healthier than a clean diet of meat and plants.

I spent a few meals in Thailand with Tim Shieff earlier this year. Nice guy, but there was the whole interview thing where he stated that the "world might be flat" or something of the sort. Of course I'm not a flatearther. I believe in science. Actually we don't have much in common (from my limited interactions with him). I think the question is: Why would someone feel "immediately better" after eating some eggs and fish? B12 deficiency doesn't work that way. This is typical though...people change one variable in their diet and then there is this magical placebo effect where they feel a certain way (tired /more energized/brain fog/clearer thinking) seemingly overnight. Such is the human condition. I grew up as an ovo-lacto vegetarian. I ate a lot of cheese and some eggs. I thought vegans where crazy and that it was an "Extreme diet." But the more one thinks about it the more one might realize that we don't really need to be drinking cow's milk. Sure we are designed as infants to drink our mom's milk....when we are infants. But then (like all mammals) we are weened off of milk at early childhood and probably shouldn't be drinking it anymore! Why would we drink cow's milk when it is specifically designed for baby cows? Why not dog's milk? Then the question: what is in cow's milk (besides casein protein and all sorts of hormones that mess with our own hormones that is all likely linked to cancer) that we really need? Milk sugar? The nutritional profile of human milk vs cow's milk is extremely different. But then again according to at least one person on here we are more like dogs and other carnivores anyway! Nope, not related to chimps or apes at all. I ate eggs for an extra B12 boost back in the day. Not for the protein. But then I realized we don't really need those either....I make sure to get B12 in other sources. Sure I still have an occasional baked good/dessert with eggs in it though...but I'm not going out of my way to eat an omelette. As far as my own "brain fog" goes? Hmmm I must be low on B12 and protein and omegas! People can judge all they want...I don't really care. Here is my latest youtube video "Training Talk." I'll let you know that I film these in 1 take and that they are totally unscripted...so yeah maybe I say "um" a lot and pause to think for a couple seconds. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K9lM9fNasW4 I post under my real name here to be transparent. I have nothing to hide. Plant based diets are the future...whether you like it or not.

Sage next Tim schieff ? wrote:

I wonder if sage will be the next tim shieff? You can tell from sage's videos he has brain fog, constantly forgets/loses train of thought, his prefomances hasn't been that good and I am saying this because I want you to improve sage. Sure, you might have drank too much koolaid and won't change. But just listen to tim shieff. Long term vegan, felt immediately better after eating some eggs and fish. Anecdotal evidence vegans will say, but countless other vegans report the same thing. Than you don't realize it is a cult till you read /see how vegans react to ex vegans.

https://youtu.be/jfy54NpXn9c

Hi Sage,

Thanks for the input, I have been a huge fan for a while (junior in high school) and it is really cool how you interact so openly with other runners, whether they have different opinions or not. Diet has always been a gray area and it seems that many people have been successful on a variety of different types of eating habits. I doubt that I would be able to transition to a 100% vegan diet, but I agree with you on multiple points regarding the nutrients that can be taken in from a plant-based diet. I definitely plan to borrow a lot of recipes from you, but I noticed on the 'Nutrition for Performance' page that you do supplement your diet with a few pills such as iron, vitamin B12, vitamin D and magnesium. For someone who is not fully plant-based but does intend to incorporate many aspects of a vegetarian style diet, what sources would you recommend for those nutrients that you supplement? Eggs?

https://fueltoperformance.wordpress.com/sage-canaday/

Thanks for your support! In my non-medical opinion I'd say you could get tested first for any deficiencies (or overloads). Ferritin, total iron stores, CBC, % Saturation, Vitamin D, B12, Magnesium etc. Some vitamins/minerals are generally more okay to take (i.e. B12)....others are deadly if you take too much (iron). Some people have certain medical conditions or genetic predispositions that influence absorption rates (as well as food allergies etc). So consult your doctor before trying anything new. Again I ran with a lot of high mileage guys in college and at Hansons who would get "low on iron." These were guys that ate eggs and red meat all the time! They would also get a lot of stress fractures (something i've never had). Vitamin D seems to be low in a lot of Americans...even runners who are outside in the sun more. I closely monitor my blood values and get tested fairly frequently.

To the OP:

YES!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fu898NT-s04

Lol, sage has went off the deep end. No need to take artificial supplements. No need to eat BS plant foods for nutrients you can't absorb from plants. Omega 3 easy, just eat a can of sardines which also has 400% of your vitamin B 12. And from your brain fog I see in your videos sage, I would reccommend you start eating some sardines. Humans are obligate carnivores, we need meat to be healthy. Sure, sage will point to studies that say otherwise. But look behind the current sage, they fix the data to get the desire results. Our digestive track is to digest meat, not large amounts of plant matter. And before you sage say some BS about eating raw meat. Today I ate raw eggs, raw salmon, raw milk, and raw steak today. My digestion has never been better since eating raw animal products. Fact, we lost of cecum. Fact, our digestive system length is much more similar to carnivores. Fact, all long term vegans look sick. Sure, first couple years you might look fine. But so do people with HIV. A lot of times people do not know they have HIV until having it for a decade or more. More and more ex vegans are coming out. The vegan agenda is hopefully coming to a end. The science vegans point to is BS. Here's a actual scientist debunking vegan gains cholesterol BS. Soon he'll(the scientist in the video below) debate vegan gains, he has several other videos debunking vegan pseudoscience.

Go to 11 minutes or so:

https://youtu.be/_zcL-FfIBp4

"Plant-based" animals:

Brontosaurus

Diplodocus

Stegosaurus

Mastodon

Ground Sloth

Woolly Rhino

Musk Oxen

Manatee

Orangutan

Bunny Wabbit

Donkey

Cow

Pig

Sheep

"Animal-based" animals":

Tyrannosuarus

Allosaurus

Sabre-Toothed Tiger

Orca

African Lion

Cheetah

Jaguar

Wolverine

Wolf

Human Being

Take your bets, put down your money...

There is no essential amino acid for a cow.

There is no essential carbohydrate for a human.

Not sure why I’m even responding other than this is the most idiotic nonsense post. As someone who is primarily vegan and a nutrition major, there is SO much misinformation on this thread it’s actually ridiculous. If I were Sage, I wouldn’t even try to argue with people on here who are clearly anti-vegan and spewing it false information and weak research articles. Yes being vegan requires a bit more work to make sure one gets all the vitamins/minerals he or she needs, but if one is knowledgeable regarding that, this diet is definitely sustainable for an athlete. I have never had low B12 and my iron was actually lower when I was eating meat and dairy. I am far more knowledgeable now of what types of foods to eat and actually feel a lot better since going 100% plant based. But people on here clearly have their minds made up so no use trying to debate this.