"The Drug Cheat Mary Slaney"

Tyrannosaurus Rexing wrote:

LOGIC FAIL wrote:

Murder and doping isn't anywhere on the same scale.

If someone gets a speeding ticket they are not known as "the speeder".

Seriously, "true Brit" is a "true simpleton."

I am sure he has, at some point in his life, cheated at *something* or on *someone* - A quiz or homework assignment in HS or college, a girlfriend somewhere along the line, a favorable interpretation of his taxes owed, etc, etc, etc.

So for now on, everywhere he goes, let's call him: the CHEATER/LIAR, "true Brit"! That shall be his introduction forever. Yeah, I'm sure he love that.

if you cheat at, say, the SATs, whenever you take the SAT, you SHOULD be called 'the cheater'

if you cheat at, say, running, whenever you race, you SHOULD be called 'the cheater'

Heck, I wouldn't hire gatlin or powell or rodgers but if they want to quit running and do something else, they deserve a new name.

Tyrannosaurus Rexing wrote:

LOGIC FAIL wrote:

Murder and doping isn't anywhere on the same scale.

If someone gets a speeding ticket they are not known as "the speeder".

Seriously, "true Brit" is a "true simpleton."

I am sure he has, at some point in his life, cheated at *something* or on *someone* - A quiz or homework assignment in HS or college, a girlfriend somewhere along the line, a favorable interpretation of his taxes owed, etc, etc, etc.

So for now on, everywhere he goes, let's call him: the CHEATER/LIAR, "true Brit"! That shall be his introduction forever. Yeah, I'm sure he love that.

or probably better for a lefty like you, t-rex - if a hedge fund manager steals a clients' money or uses inside information to make money - shouldn't he be called a cheater/thief if he returned to the finance business?

but if he becomes a math teacher in an inner city school, probably he has earned the right to lose the title

Do you really think that being a drug cheat is the equivalent of cheating at a quiz or like Logic Fail thinks is the equivalent of getting a speeding ticket ? . Quite simply drug cheats are murdering the sport ! And if you commit a murder you get life imprisonment . A life ban would be an appropriate punishment for drug cheats. There are increasing numbers of athletes who have been robbed of what might have been the highest point in their lives, sometimes financially , sometimes in terms of glory , beaten by cheats. If you embezzled the company you worked for , it's not likely they would take you on again. If you reply , try and supply an answer without the abuse !

LOGIC FAIL wrote:

Murder and doping isn't anywhere on the same scale.

If someone gets a speeding ticket they are not known as "the speeder".

You're right doping isn't as serious as murder - it is on par with fraud, theft, and drug trafficking.

You're right doping isn't as serious as murder - it is on par with fraud, theft, and drug trafficking.

Yes and you wouldn't let them back into your business after a couple of years if they were guilty of any of the above.

Regardless of how much of her career was clean, Slaney did end up as a drug cheat so I don't see where calling her one is problematic. Are there others who could be called the same and aren't here? Sure and maybe the Johnsons have some bias against Slaney but it's their site and they get to say that sort of thing if they want to.

Randy Oldman wrote:

It's unfair to split out Slaney because 90% of the members of the 1984 US Olympic squad were doped to the gills, as were most other competitors.

Assuming that "doped to the gills" refers to roids, not EPO. EPO wasn't invented back then, right?

Lance was eventually caught doping despite never failing a test. As I recall they asked Jacobs some tough questions about doping at a press conference. I don't recall that they called her a drug cheat before the BALCO thing outed her but maybe you do. Can you confirm that? And no, "everybody" does not know that Radcliffe is a drug cheat. I certainly don't know it though I also don't know that she's clean.

True Brit wrote:

If someone commits a murder they will henceforth be know as "the murderer" . It won't be written up as "The good guy up until the day they murdered someone"

MDS and Gatlin will always be the Drug Cheats

This. Yes.

If you murder, you are a murderer. No matter how much time passes, you will be known as a murderer even if you only did it once.

If you lie, you should be known as a liar forever even if you only lied once.

If you doped, you should be known as a doper forever even if you only doped once.

Decker = doper

Gatlin = doper

One doping incident should automatically be a lifetime ban. It really should be prison considering the damage it does to the clean competitors.

The proof's in the pudding.

HRE wrote:

Lance was eventually caught doping despite never failing a test.

he did fail tests, darnit

Bluebird wrote:If you murder, you are a murderer. No matter how much time passes, you will be known as a murderer even if you only did it once.

If you lie, you should be known as a liar forever even if you only lied once.

If you doped, you should be known as a doper forever even if you only doped once.

Decker = doper

Gatlin = doper

One doping incident should automatically be a lifetime ban. It really should be prison considering the damage it does to the clean competitors.

Ugh. When it comes to doping my impression is that Slaney is not in the same league as Gatlin, yet Gatlin is competing today and can run in the World Championships and Olympics. For the sake of argument, let's say Slaney made a mistake in the twilight of her career. Can we be more nuanced in our harsh judgement and recognize that heroes make mistakes. It does not make their earlier accomplishments less meaningful. Some think Slaney should have sticks poked in her eyes, but I'm ready to forgive and move on and feel proud of most of her running career.

I find the brojos use of "drug cheat" prefixed to athlete's names very juvenile and unprofessional. It's hard to take them seriously as journalists.

thoughtful wrote:

Ugh. When it comes to doping my impression is that Slaney is not in the same league as Gatlin, yet Gatlin is competing today and can run in the World Championships and Olympics. For the sake of argument, let's say Slaney made a mistake in the twilight of her career. Can we be more nuanced in our harsh judgement and recognize that heroes make mistakes. It does not make their earlier accomplishments less meaningful. Some think Slaney should have sticks poked in her eyes, but I'm ready to forgive and move on and feel proud of most of her running career.

I find the brojos use of "drug cheat" prefixed to athlete's names very juvenile and unprofessional. It's hard to take them seriously as journalists.

Slaney was a doper at least in the early 80s under Dick Brown. It wasn't a "mistake" for her to dope at the end of her career. It was a mistake for her to test positive. It was a mistake that someone on the inside leaked the positive results.

With that said, the "drug cheat" moniker reeks of junior high girls calling the popular girls "sluts" because they're the ones dating the boys on the football team.

OK, Lance was eventually caught doping without the public learning that he'd failed drug tests.

Thoughtful wrote "Can we be more nuanced in our harsh judgement and recognize that heroes make mistakes.it does not make their earlier accomplishments less meaningful."

Sorry but totally disagree. There will always be a doubt as to at what stage they started taking drugs and hence on any earlier performance. Zero tolerance is the only option. Brojos are spot on.

HRE wrote:

OK, Lance was eventually caught doping without the public learning that he'd failed drug tests.

that's still not quite right - everyone knew the test was positive - but lance's excuse (saddlesore medicine) was accepted.

the point is that testing is not completely useless - it does work much of the time, and is certainly getting better.

No, the "drug cheat" moniker reeks more of a spouse calling their unfaithful partner a "cheater".

HRE wrote:

Regardless of how much of her career was clean, Slaney did end up as a drug cheat so I don't see where calling her one is problematic. Are there others who could be called the same and aren't here? Sure and maybe the Johnsons have some bias against Slaney but it's their site and they get to say that sort of thing if they want to.

Maybe they have bias? I don't know what other explanation there is.

It is interesting to consider what letsrun would look like if the brojos were totally consistent. The front page headlines would be riddled with the "Drug Cheat" label! It's as if the brojos are afraid to take it that far, so they just decide to pick on certain athletes and give others a pass.

agip wrote:

HRE wrote:

OK, Lance was eventually caught doping without the public learning that he'd failed drug tests.

that's still not quite right - everyone knew the test was positive - but lance's excuse (saddlesore medicine) was accepted.

the point is that testing is not completely useless - it does work much of the time, and is certainly getting better.

I think another point is that just as there were banks and financial institutions that were "too big to fail" there are also athletes who are "too big to test positive" and when they do the results are either doctored or discounted.