Ok, well I see your assertion did not lack for rationale! Thanks for the in-depth analysis. The WCs will be a lot of fun to watch.
Ok, well I see your assertion did not lack for rationale! Thanks for the in-depth analysis. The WCs will be a lot of fun to watch.
Anyone know who Ato was referring to as having failed a test?
Dont know if this was mentioned but every person will be blood tested in Daegu.
http://www.iaaf.org/news/newsid=61097.html
This is good news.
Who will be the first to have a lightbulb moment?"So that's why Davila is not taking the spot she was offered."
old coach man wrote:
Dont know if this was mentioned but every person will be blood tested in Daegu.
http://www.iaaf.org/news/newsid=61097.htmlThis is good news.
"Well he is primarily a long jumper...."
Bruny Surin, whose name appears on the legit could-have sub-9.80 list, started out as a long jumper but switched to the 100m! His PR's were 8.19w and 8.03 before he bailed out of the event relatively early in his career.
honestly, lasix is nothing more than a diuretic. some bodybuilders use it to "cut up". might just be something innocent...who knows?
Harmless? Lol, right.
Why would a sprinter knowingly consume something that dilutes urine. It's the equivalent of drinking a tank of coca cola. I.e. NOT innocuous.
As an aside, the guy who I think comes out of all this fairly squeaky clean is...Dix!
He's been consistent over the years, not only his body but his running style and times. This year he laid relatively low, and just came out to perform when it counted.
He did a couple of meets in Canada and the US, much as Lemaitre did a couple in Europe, and only a few meets elsewhere, thereby minimizing the distortions of his training, eating, sleeping, etc...
He has quietly been preparing to compete, and has put up credible times this year, and has some good race results to show for his efforts.
Nobody seems to pay any attention to him--it seems like all the attention paid to US male sprinters goes first to Gay, then to Rodgers running the circuit, then to Gatlin for sheer curiosity, then maybe to Dix.
He is quiet, a bit round, low-key, and a very solid performer who won't be running in Gay's shadow at WC's this year.
Good for him, I hope he does well.
If there's anybody who could really benefit from doping it would be him. If 'roids really do give you an extra 1-2m at the start, where Dix needs the most help, he would be the next 9.7x guy, and would then be just as suspicious as all the other 9.7x guys.
Nice to see that he doesn't seem to have succumbed to the temptation, and I hope he kicks some ass at WC's.
I have a life, too, track is just a diversion.
Even starving women in Africa take time to do each other's hair and apply make-up to their faces--considering multiple things simultaneously, not all seeming equally important, is a universal human trait.
Back to the Mullings thing, so he "tested positive"--does that mean that his "a" and "b" samples both returned positive results? I understand he will have a hearing, during which imposition of sanctions (if any) will be considered, and during which the tests results could also be thrown out or overturned if the evidence requires such a conclusion.
Does anybody know exactly where this all stands right now?
(And yes, Teller of Truth, we all know that it isn't really important)
...or IS it? Have you stopped to consider the moral ramifications, or the principles that are affected? Probably not, but that's OK.
Teller of Truth wrote:
It's unfortunate that you are all worried about some Jamaican sprinter using drugs when millions of White Christians and Muslims are murdered by Barack Obama every day. What is this world coming to?
Really?...this is a discussion on PED usage in international track and field. I direct you to the forum at
www.antiwar.comSprint Geezer wrote:
And also, at the top level, people in one camp know essentially what people in another camp are doing. People talk. I'm not saying there is a vast conspiracy, but there is a vast culture of conformity, both in attitude and action. It is subtle, but it is there--unfortunately, the dark side has taken hold and it is to that attitude that everybody basically conforms. Even if they don't dope themselves, they know other people are using, and don't say anything about it--not so much for legal reasons, but instead because they fear they have something to lose as far as their place in the sport goes.
As they say in grade school, nobody likes a snitch. And that's about the level of the prevalent mentality.
THIS.IS.TRUE.
Sprint Geezer wrote:
I have a life, too, track is just a diversion.
You are now the Stuart Smalley of Lets Run. People like you.
Sprint Geezer wrote:
James Lee said that "running 9.80 is no easy feat, something that no American athlete has been able to do without some serious pharmaceutical help, including Maurice Greene...Tyson Gay is really a 9.79 athlete no better"
James, IMHO NO athlete has ever been able to run sub-9.80 without serious pharmaceutical help, except for MAYBE Powell.
Bailey COULD have done it in 1996 if he had had either a start or a 2.0 instead of a 0.7 wind--but he didn't.
Surin COULD have done it in 1995 if he had had a 2.0 instead of a 0.2 wind--but he didn't.
Fredericks COULD have done it in 1996 if he had had a 2.0 instead of a -0.4 wind--but he didn't.
Boldon COULD have done it in 1998 or 1999 if he had had a 2.0 instead of -0.4 or +0.1 wind--but he didn't.
etc.
The point of this is that to run a sub-9.8, an athlete would need to BOTH run their perfect race, AND have the luck of excellent conditions of wind and temperature. For these 2 things to coincide effectively never happens. We see some guys have essentially their perfect race, but not perfect conditions--other guys we see have excellent conditions, but not their perfect race.
Of the remaining athletes who have done it, or who might have done it if conditions had allowed:
Johnson, Montgomery, and Gatlin got caught;
Carter's 9.78 in Rieti and Mullings' 9.80 in Eugene are bogus times, and it also looks like Mullings is caught;
Gatlin's 9.85 (0.6), Blake's 9.89 (-0.4)and Christie's 9.87 (0.3) were likely drug-assisted given the doping histories of these athletes, and should be removed from the list;
Thompson's 9.89 (0.0) and Obikwelu's 9.86 (+0.6) are right on the line, looked to be excellent runs, and would be 9.80 with a +2.0 wind, but not sub-9.80...
Atkins' 9.91 (-0.5) from 2007 is so far a legitimate contender, and could have been a 9.79 with a +2.0 wind--only just dipping under the 9.80 mark...
The remaining contenders are Bolt, Gay, Powell, and Greene.
Sub-9.8 is one thing, sub-9.7 is another entirely. Bolt and Gay should be crossed off the list, as should Powell--his 9.72 (0.2) is actually faster than Gay's 9.71 (0.9)
Greene is just lucky he didn't get caught, so he should be off the list.
So we have these people who may have been clean and who could have done it, given better conditions: Bailey, Surin, Fredericks, Boldon, Atkins...
And we have 1 guy who actually has done it, and who likely lies somewhere around the limit of performance, if not beyond: Powell.
Powell MIGHT be believable if he is essentially Bailey with a start...his form is so much better than just about anybody else's, that might just be enough to account for his superior times.
That's only 5 believable guys ever who might have done it, and only 1 POSSIBLY believable guy who actually HAS done it.
And people are calling Atkins into question now, and if that inquiry bears fruit, that leaves really only 4+1 guys in the FAT era, with only the +1 guy ACTUALLY having gone under 9.80
So Gay might be a believable 9.79 guy if he gets lucky--but only if, and only just.
Powell and Bolt seem to have played it smartly--Bolt's times this year are believable, as are Powell's, except for his 9.78 (+1.0) lying at the limit of believability. I would be surprised to see either of these guys getting caught for anything this year.
I would not at all be surprised to see Carter or Blake go down, and only slightly less surprised to see Frater go down.
But the bottom line is that if Pharmalita has not yet been caught, EVERYONE in the 100m, men's and women's, is suspect.
Now this is about the only sensible post I've read in this topic. On the sport thinking...my thoughts exactly.
Its a head fake for a much bigger problem with drugs and Jamaican athletes.
Major cover up , bust a few to show effort. Jamaican team adds excitement to the sprints and TV ratings to really clean house. Not the 1st time this has happened nor will it be the last.
Gay has nothing to do with this.
Sprint Geezer wrote:
"Well he is primarily a long jumper...."
Bruny Surin, whose name appears on the legit could-have sub-9.80 list, started out as a long jumper but switched to the 100m! His PR's were 8.19w and 8.03 before he bailed out of the event relatively early in his career.
Surin wasn't a 9.7x guy. The guy took about 10+ years to put it all together and maxed out with that suburb 9.84 run. Ashame that he lost that one to the selfproclaimed 'GOAT', who is on bad terms with his former best frend and main competitor for obvious reasons.
Bailey was a talent who could had gone sub 9.8, if he took the sport seriously earlier. The man got robbed in '97 the same way Surin got in '99.
IMHO Powell is the one and only legit runner around nowadays. Most constistant runner of them all. No ducking, no mistery disapearances for weeks. He ran about all races there were to run on his level troughout his carreer, and he lined up against everyone who wanted to line up. Hell, 5 weeks after serious chest injury (and believe me...I know how that hurts your sprinting).
You call him 'choker', but that's what happens if you have normal testosterone levels and the pressure is on you.
You don't feel like you'll eat everyone alive,
you don't go acting like Kermit the Frog 30 meters from the line,
you don't bite and flinge your own tongue at the line, you don't clown to the public,
you don't lie down at the starting line shouting 'I did not move',
you don't have acne like the avarage 16 year old,
you don't put on gloves while racing,
you don't put on a silly act with a waterbottle,
you don't stare down your opponents,
you aren't 4kg overweight because of all the extra water in your muscles due to chmical testosrerone,
you don't touch hands with your training partners 20m out and you sure as hell don't act like the WR holder when you only have a 9.86 legit time to go with and barely beat a skinny white boy a few weeks earlier.
You just run your race...and sometimes lose it when you know you're up against guys who chemically peak for just that moment.
You know what....we might have found our Franklin Fredericks of the new century!
Hell...that's a nice thought...isn't it?? Anyone of you ever raced a roidhead?? No????
I did...ánd read his book...a few years after he ended his carreer. And now I know why I got intimidated by the way he walked around in my lane, was verbally AND physiccaly obnocious and was going around talking about how he was gonna beat everbody. He KNEW he was going to do that...and was getting away with it. Just like the last Olympic and world champions we hailed in the short sprints.
Gay was running 9.7's in no-name races for no money,
Gay didn't show his face in Europe for the whole season,
Gay now suddenly had to undertake action on a 'injury' already there in 2007,
Gay was talking big about beating Bolt...and that the few injuries he got while training for that wouldn't hinder him,
Gay is training under a convicted criminal,
Gay is training with a convicted drug cheat,
Gay withdrew for quit a few events the past years,
Gay is the new poster boy for clean American sprinting....guess who was his predeccesor..
Add 1 + 1 and you'll know. IAAF cut a deal once again.
Some have seen Ato's tweet of another bust coming down the pipeline and I have gotten word there are actually 4 more positives coming out in the next few days as well.
While some on here have asked or speculated as to Mullings B sample being able to clear him and thats possible, its also highly unlikely.
Lets all remember he was having cramping issues at Jamaican Nationals where he tested positive and this would explain the lasix use. He had to load up to cover his steroid use and its a mixture really of a drug cocktail that would have slipped under the test in years past but new info has made the masking agents less effective and its why we are going to see dozens of busts over the rest of the season from what is already coming down the pike and what I suspect will happen to some athletes who decide to "risk" competing dirty in Daegu.
sprint geezer, maybe this violates some sort of message board code of ethics, but I found your last post especially fascinating, the bit about having run against some famous roider and all, and I was just wondering...does everyone else on the boards know who you are? Am I the only person not in on it? At any rate,you have an interesting take on things--are you well known enough to be able to publish a memoir?
caesarsghost wrote:
sprint geezer, maybe this violates some sort of message board code of ethics, but I found your last post especially fascinating, the bit about having run against some famous roider and all, and I was just wondering...does everyone else on the boards know who you are? Am I the only person not in on it? At any rate,you have an interesting take on things--are you well known enough to be able to publish a memoir?
Please tell me that you're joking...