Renato Canova, Who exactly is Imane Merga and how did you develop him to get his win at World XC?

fast1 wrote:

So that means that if an athlete in altitude is running 4 x 2000m (rec. 3:00) in 5:45 + 1 x 1000m in 2:37 - means he

can run 27:20 in sea-level, because 0.5% faster than 5:45 is 5:27.5, which is about 27:20 pace.

And if the same workout is 4 x 2000 in 5:28 + 1 x 1000 in 2:31, it means that he can run those 2k's in 5:11.6 in sea-level, WHICH IS 26:00 PACE! Amazing!

the 3% and 5% figures he used refer to athletes going from sea-level to altitude for the first time, not the other way around...

Renato Canova do you know more information about how kenenisa bekele trained?

heyy jjjjjjji like ur program - i may just follow it

jjjjjjj wrote:

trollism and others, go ruin another thread.

By modulation, he means variance in intensity/quantity/duration. So, hypothetically, he might recommend that a masters runner do a hard long run Sunday, something quite taxing, then run quite easy and short Monday and Tuesday (not Daniels easy but more like recovery pace), before running, say, a 5M tempo between HM and 10k pace on Wednesday, and then running very easy Thursday and Friday, with strides and short hill sprints Saturday before another hard long run Sunday.

lol@tards.. wrote:

the 3% and 5% figures he used refer to athletes going from sea-level to altitude for the first time, not the other way around...

yes i got that, but what I really tried to say was that Canova wrote quite some time ago that in 1988 before Seuol Olympics, Salvatore Antibo (italian) went to Sestriere (2050m of altitude) and ran workout:

4 x 2000m (rec. 3:00) in 5:45 + 1 x 1000m in 2:37 and if you ccalculate 5% faster pace it's about 27:20! WHICH IS EXACTLY what he ran in Seoul OG when he got silver in 27:23.

Then in 1990 the same workout was 4 x 2000 in 5:28 + 1 x 1000 in 2:31, WHICH WOULD BE 26:00!!! if you count that 5% difference again. I've tried to ask Renato did he still use only 3min recovery and what would be the difference between 3min and 4min, especially for a european in altitude, but he didn't response.

What I wrote where the final workouts of Antibo in the two different occasions. The fact that he ran 27'23" in Seoul can be connected with his training in Sestriere, but also with the fact that it was for him the first time with this type of training.

What he was able to do later, confirms that muscle fibres have "memory" about altitude, and that every time an athlete (living and training at sea level for the most part of the season) goes to altitude, he has more adaptation to the conditions of hypoxia, so can run faster.

But this doesn't mean that the percentage of speed he can gain when competes at sea level is always the same.

The example of what he was able to do two years later, can show how Antibo increased the ability in running in altitude (this is something specific, not interesting gtoo much athletes that go to compete at sea level), but not that he could be so much stronger as, if we use the same percentage of difference than the first period ofv training, the calculation can suppose.

In my opinion, the Antibo 1990 could run about 26'50", if for example had the opportunity to be in a race as Bruxelles 2003 / 2005.

So, 26'50" is 2'42" / km (16"2 every 100m), while the average of his workouts in Sestriere was 2'44" (16"4 every 100m). This means a difference in the speed of 1.2 %, fruit of a better adaptation to the altitude conditions.

When we are in altitude, we have the same rule we use at sea level : faster is the pace, longer is the recovery.

So, because this workouts is always the FINAL workouts in altitude for my athletes of 10000m, I maintain 4' recovery, because I need to develop the highest quality compared with the speed we look for during the race.

Renato, I'd like to know how do you plan recovery periods for supercompensation (I know the 2 hard workouts per week rule but not much more). This is the most mysterious thing to me.

What is your opinion about passive rest days?

Thanks

I would like to know the same

I'd like to add one component to my questions: Renato, how do you use "windows" (recovery cycles) between each mesocycle? (Clearly, it seems that these "windows" are not classical 1 week recovery microcycles (like Joe Friel advocates).)

I apologize due to grammatical-terminological errors, English is not my mother tongue, but I hope you can understand me.

Thanks

I don't use, and I don't believe, in the classic scheme of microcycles, when we speak about middle and long distances.

My system of preparing a seasonal plan is as follows :

a) At the end of the previous season (I don't speak about marathon runners, but about track runners), normally during the month of October, I give the athletes a period of recovery, based on easy run (but in any case twice per day with a normal volume of 30/32km or 20 miloes per day). These period is useful for recruiting all the nervous energies the athletes used during the season. In my opinion, to look at the nervous energies with particular attention is one of the keys for preparing a good season.

b) From beginning of November the athlete starts the real training program. I look at the main seasonal goal, and I prepare the global plan starting from that point, and coming back till the current day. Since a training program has the task to put the athletes able to have his top shape in the occasion of his main target, we cant have any good program without considering the calendar, and the individual goals. I give you some example :

1- In 2010, there were no important Championships for Merga, apart African Championships. However, because Imane never was really able to run fast in altitude (since I'm the coach of Wilson Kiprop too, I well knew Wilson was better of Imane in a competition in Nairobi in any case), we didn't give too much importance to that Championships. Instead, being the first year of Diamond League, we planned the total season looking at that goal. Diamond League is a circuit of top competitions where every event is carried on 7 times. So, we planned to run for 7 times competitions of 5000m and, since only the first 3 in the races of each meeting take points, we needed to have a preparation for remaining during a period of more than 3 months at a level of shape about 90%, without trying to reach the real peak. The fact Imane was able to beat for 2 times his PB doesn't mean he ran his best, because his value was very much better than in the previous season.

2- Instead, speaking for example about Wilson Kiprop, the plan was completely different. He runs very well in altitude, never had any market on track (5000m are too short for him), so his plan was directed to have two peaks of shape, one for African Championships at the end of July in 10000m (the only opportunity on track), the second for World Half Marathon Champs on 16th October (2 and half months later).

3- In the first case, I used the alternance between every competition. Normally, there was a competition every 2 weeks, sometime two meetings in following weeks with a period of 3 weeks without competitions in between. When there were 2 competitions in one week, we used in between only an easy workouts (for example, 12x400m in 60" with one minute rest controlling the efficiency of feet and the running technique). When we had more time, we used a very short microcycle, recreating a good volume, because the frequent competitions were a workout of intensity.

What I use, is some workout for the Aerobic Power, not very fast, in the middle of frequent competitions (for example, 1 hour fast long run between 19 and 20 km, or long intervals as 4x2000m in 5'25" rec. 4' that is very slow for a target of 2'33" / km, representing about 95% of the speed of the race). I never use lactic workouts, already the competitions are lactic workouts.

On the contrary, when I have long periods in the middle (for example 4 weeks) I use some workout of high speed, too, but far from the race.

4- In the second case (Wilson Kiprop) I started from a great aerobic base, and we controlled the level of long endurance with a marathon (Prague, on 9th of May) that Wilson finished in 2:09:09 with difficult last 5 km, but quick recovery. After this, he had one 10000m, alone, in high altitude, at the end of May, in 28:16, and one important competition every 4-5 weeks :

- National Champs on Track (10000m) in Nairobi at the end of June (27:26, WR in altitude)

- African Champs (10000m) in Nairobi again, at the end of July (winning in 27:32 with second 5000m in 13:29)

- HM in Lille on 6th of September (winning in 59:39)

- WHMCh in Nanning on 16th of October winning beating Zersenay Tadese.

We had time to use cycles of 3-4 weeks between one race and the other, tapering during last week only before African Champs (10000m) and Nanning, but not before National Champs and Lille HM (in those cases, only reducing his training 4 days before the race).

5- This year, instead, we have World Championships, and for Imane this is the main goal. We look for 10000m.

Starting from November, the plan was as follows :

a) A period (November and December) that we call "fundamental", for increasing mileage till an average of 230 km per week (about 140 miles) including circuits for strength endurance, short sprint on hills (80-100m) at max speed, and some long run till 30k, never used before

b) A period (January and February) that we call "Special", where we start to put long intervals (3000 and 2000m) on track, long fartlek (for example, sets of 8' + 5' + 2' fast with 2' recovery at moderate pace but not jogging, repeated 4 times), and fast long run between 8 and 16 km (pace, according the distance, between 4'30" and 4'45" per mile). During this period there were the Ethiopian Trials, that Imane ran without reducing his training (also the winner Mesfin uses the same training because they train together, but Mesfin had a tapering during last week).

c) A short period (between the end of February and World Cross Championships) for reaching a shape enough for winning. I posted the program of that period at the beginning of this thread.

For the future, we decided to try to win World Champs in 10000m. That distance is the first option : may be Imane can double, but my opinion is he has more chances in 10000 than in 5000. Since Ethiopia, different from Kenya, don't use trials for those two events, but they select the best times in competitions in Europe or US, we need to run fast for being selected. So, Imane runs 10000m in Eugene on 3rd of June for trying 26'40" (if there is a good pace), after a 5000m in Rome on 26th of May, and before another 5000m in NY on 11th June. Full preparation from now (I was with him on 25th April in Dongio for planning everything) till Rome (one month), easy period without hard training between Rome and NY, and again one full month of tough training between 15th of June and half of July.

So, we use recovery and cycles according to the needs of the competitions, in order to reach the top shape during the Championships. Of course, the most part of times there is some problem during a long preparation, and to change is a must. That's the reason because a coach of top atrhletes must be flexible in his programs, that are a continuous arrangement. Like a good taylor, a good coach must create the cloth on the measure and the shape of the user, and for the athletes, training is their cloth.

Thank you for good insight. Couple of more questions:

a) Why can't Imane run good in races, which are held in altitude?

b) If we talk about distances 1500 - HM (not 800m and not marathon, what is the differences between training "fast runners" (who have more fast-twitches) and "resistant runners" (those who have more slow-twiches)? Is "long and fast" absolute must for every type of athlete in modern training methodology or for only resistant type of runners?

For example: some years ago there was a thread about FT and ST runners on LR, A . Cabral said: "he (Mamede- 48.2 400m at 19, FT runner) used to run a session of 15-20 x 400m as negative split intervals. The first 200m would be approx 30 secs and the last 200m would be about 26-27 secs. He would run this session with only 50 secs recovery between the 400s.

Contrary to Lopes, Mamede hated LT runs and rarely did them. He used to train twice per day at 6:00-6:30m/m pace in most of the days."

I ask this question, because Merga seems to have very good final kick (like Mamede-FT runner), but at the same time there are "long and fast" work-outs (like in Lopes training programs) tempos in his program.

To define what is "Long run" cant be something objective. Instead, to define what is "fast run" can be.

If we start thinking of the speed of the event (for example, 10000m in 26'40" means 2'40" per km and 16" every 100m), this is a clear data, and "fast" is obviously related with. So, we can say that 90% of the race speed is 2'56" / km, and fast run must be done between 2'55" and 3' per km.

Instead, when we speak about "Long", this is a subjective term, depending on the previous training of the athlete.

If, for example, the athlete never ran longer than 30' at his "fast" pace, "Long" becomes every fast continuous run longer than 30'. In this case, the goal is to extend the "Fast run" duration till 40' - 50' - 1 hour, that is the max length inside the above percentage.

Starting from this point, we need to consider different speeds, each one direct support of the other :

a) For running 30' at 90% of the race pace (in this case 2'56" / km, as 10k in 29'20") we need to run 3/2 longer (in this case 45') at 85% (in this case 3'04"), like 15 km in 46'.

b) For running 45' at 85%, we need to run 3/2 longer (in this case 1 hr 10') at 80% (3'12" / km, like a HM in 67')

You can use this formula till a total duration of 3 times the time of "Fast run". So, for an athlete preparing 10000m, the distances for long and fast run include a range between 10 and 25 km, with some training till 30 km for giving mentality on the distance, but slower (in this case we speak about "duration" only, the speed is not important).

This is a common phylosophy : to extend the ability in lasting at a speed already consolidated for a shorter distance.

Some months ago you wrote:

"In 1988, the team of East Germany went to Sestriere for preparing OG of Seoul, with their best group of sprinters. Among them, there was the World Champion of 400m of the previous year, Schoenlebe (winner in Rome in 44"33). I saw one incredible training of Lactic Capacity : 3 x 500m with 7' of recovery, in 59"7 - 59"5 - 59"6 (the official World Best performance was 60"02 !). I was sure he could win Olympic running under 44". Instead, he ended his career going out in qf running 46"60 !

Only several years later, studying the lactic reaction in altitude with a group of French scientists, we discovered that SO HIGH INTENSITY FOR A LACTIC WORKOUT COULD PROVOKE A REVERSAL OF THE POLARITY OF THE MEMBRANE. Practically, the athlete is no more able to eliminate the rubbish rimaining in his cells, and the cells cannot receive the right nutrition. In this case, the sensation is to have legs always very heavy, a feeling of "chocking", like a stagnation of lactate inside. The problem is that, ecceeding in this type of training, this situation becomes irreversible, and the athlete is no more able to have any type of endurance for ever."

Can this kind of "catastrophe" also take place at sea level training, when young 800 or 1500 m runner is doing lots of lactic capacity workouts without good support of aerobic power and aerobic strenght?

Does Imane Merga run his fartleks and tempos in Entoto mountains?

Did Imane Merga take passive rest period after 2010 track season?

mr.canova

wilson kiprop 10000ｍ training June and July?

no rest after Prague　marathon?

Mr Renato.

When you build your sub 13 runners what capacity do they have in max speed over 200m and 400m? Do you consider this an basic need even for 5k.

We never tried 400m or 200m at max personal speed. For Imane, I suppose he can run about 51" in 400 and 24"/24"5 in 200m, not faster.

I don't look for this type of quality. The most important key is to increase the "speed endurance".

Speed is a mechanical and neuromuscular quality, that we always train during all the season using short and maximal sprint uphill.

But it's for me more important to train the ability in running a high volume of 400m in 58" reducing recovery time, or something similar, for giving to the athlete an advantage of about 5" compared with his ability to run every km in 2'34" pace (it means 12'50"), that remains the main goal of his training.

So, for clarifying, near 12'50" BEFORE using some workout of high speed, thanks to a high level of SPECIFIC SPEED ENDURANCE, 40 days before the main competition of the season (for example, World Championships), can mean the ability to run in 12'45" AFTER putting the kind of speed I spoke before. This is my way for PEAKING when we need.

So, Imane runs 10000m in Eugene on 3rd of June for trying 26'40" (if there is a good pace)

Who is going to run in this race with Imane? Solinsky? It would be great to see him try and run with him.

Imane Merga just absolutely dominated in Rome(on Thursday). Have to say he is the best kicker on the circuit right now. I knew with 2 laps(or really from the getgo as it was slow) to go he was going to win as the pace was(relatively) slow and Imane is just so good.

The other runners should have tried to beat him with a fast consistent pace from the beginning and a move from somewhere between 400m-600m to go.

If they had done that, Imane would have most likely been beaten. Merga probably has the best chance at winning the 5k in Daegu right now besides maybe Lagat in a verryy slow 5k and if Lagat can really pull out his kick. The only person who can challenge his kick right now is Yenew, but then again Yenew strikes me as a pure 3k guy, not really a 5k guy(at least yet).

Either way, congratz to Merga on his success and it would be awesome to see him go unbeaten this year!

Renato, could you please show us Imane Merga's April-May training log?

Wow, What's happening with Merga? Does anyone know?