German Fernandez Wins Big 12 Mile

While I think Jim Ryun and Alan Webb are great, I do think German is one the greatest of all time in HS if not arguably the greatest. Yes, Jim Ryun was world class in high school but he grew up in a different era and I think its a little unfair to give it so much weight. What I do know is this: German Fernandez ran a 4:00 1600 and then a 8:34 3200 two hours later at the CA state meet. Keep in mind that German was I believe 17 at time, correct if I'm wrong but I know he was still pretty young. As great as Jim and Alan were in HS, I don't think either of them could what German did at that state meet with only two hours of rest. Just something to think about.

Now

Another take on it wrote:

long dong silver wrote:

(Fernandez's) 3:55.02 indoors at age 18 years, 3 months, and 26 days is superior to Webb's 3:53.43 outdoors at age 18 years, 4 months and 14 days.

Another take on it wrote:

No.

???afoehasappeared??? wrote:

Umm yes?

Umm no, and it's not even close. When you get down into the mid 3:50's or faster a difference of 1½ seconds is a big gap.

Is 3:55.02 indoors on a flat track all winning by 10+ seconds as impressive as a 3:53.43 getting pulled along by possibly the best field ever assembled in the United States?

It sounds pretty close to me.

I understand that 3:53 is a lot better than 3:55 but given all the factors German's mile was at least in the same ball park.

That month was German's best in his running career. 3:56.5, 3:55.0, 7:47, and 23:20 8k crushing the best US Jr. XC field. Even his 13:25 and NCAA 1500 championship isn't nearly as good in comparison

By the way, its good to see German showing signs of a comeback. Congrats to him on a solid run.

The Rocket. wrote:

That month was German's best in his running career. 3:56.5, 3:55.0, 7:47, and 23:20 8k crushing the best US Jr. XC field. Even his 13:25 and NCAA 1500 championship isn't nearly as good in comparison

Best Junior XC fields ever assembled? Better than the year Teg and Ritz were both top 5 XC runners in the world? German placed like 8-11th. There is no way what you said is true.

The Rocket. wrote:

I understand that 3:53 is a lot better than 3:55 but given all the factors German's mile was at least in the same ball park.

No, apparently you don't understand. If anything, "all the factors (in) German's mile" worked to his benefit.

- He led wire-to-wire, never having to worry about surging past someone, temporarily running in lane two, jockeying for position, etc.

- He was running indoors, utilizing artificially perfect weather conditions, no wind, etc.

- Ultimately, it was simply a solo time trial conducted under ideal conditions

Don't get me wrong, I'm a CIF alumnus myself so I actually am a Fernandez fan! But the way that the German hype twists things around is simply unrealistic. That thread that I referenced earlier with gems like "The real question is over or under 13:00" is a classic example.

And while we're at it, Webbs 1:52 800 indoors is worth 1:46 outdoors. This is purely fact. The turns and twists cause such pressure on the body that it costs him 6 seconds. Simply unbelieveable. Oh, and, he was racing a field that no one even knows about. Surely he would run 3 seconds faster with a better field right? 1:43 equivalent! And he's not even peaked yet! I suspect when he peaks he will run sub-1:40 800m and sub-7:20 3000m and break all records from 400-Marathon.

Oh, and Webb paced at an incredible pace of 4 minutes a

mile not too long after that race. Four minutes a mile!like..What non talented school boys do? But then again, this was indoors and he could have easily gone on. I predict 3:52 outdoor mile equivalent! And it's only February, right? After a 1:43 800 equivalent? This clearly shows Webb is all the way up to his pure potential!

Oh, and that 4 minute mile and 7:51 3000 were simply Webb just letting the field win because he's just that generous. Webb could have gone 7:23 and 3:44 but of course he was feeling lucky and decided to give some one else a shot. What we can tell from this is Webb is not only the greatest athlete to ever walk this earth but also a very courteous athlete. What talent!

____________

In all seriousness, people on here twist things to make them seem like they were the absolute best thing that any athlete ever ran. You are saying that German is as good of shape as he was in when he was 18 but he ran 11 seconds slower...Right..Oh yeah he didn't try at all just enjoyed the flow. I don't like netting out athletes, but you got to face the truth. German is currently not in all that good of shape. So many College athletes could have beaten him. Yet you people wrape your thumb around him and defend him when the simple truth is he's not doing good.

He could do good in the future, could be bad. I don't know. But in the present and RIGHT NOW he is just not doing anything all that interesting. And you guys need to really see that.

The 3:55.02 was on a banked 200m indoor track. I'm on your side though- it's definitely equivalent to a 3:53.4 on an outdoor track, in a 3:50 race.

German needs to get his swagger back... cause when he does, he's a baaad mo-fo.

Remember him at USAs in the 5K? He was right there with 800m to go. 5th place as an 18 year old, running a 13:25 PR. Man that was great.

Is 3:55.02 indoors on a flat track all winning by 10+ seconds as impressive as a 3:53.43 getting pulled along by possibly the best field ever assembled in the United States?

It sounds pretty close to me.

I understand that 3:53 is a lot better than 3:55 but given all the factors German's mile was at least in the same ball park.

That month was German's best in his running career. 3:56.5, 3:55.0, 7:47, and 23:20 8k crushing the best US Jr. XC field. Even his 13:25 and NCAA 1500 championship isn't nearly as good in comparison[/quote]

007run wrote:As great as Jim and Alan were in HS, I don't think either of them could what German did at that state meet with only two hours of rest. Just something to think about.

There is nothing remotely the same between Fernandez's Cal State and Ryun's Kansas State runs.

Fernandez 4:00.29 1600 = 4:01.69 mile

Ryun 3:58.3

call me big poppa wrote:

The 3:55.02 was on a banked 200m indoor track. I'm on your side though- it's definitely equivalent to a 3:53.4 on an outdoor track, in a 3:50 race.

Nonsense. Those hyper-fast banked 200 meter tracks are faster than any outdoor track.

in his 3:58 in HS his team mate did some rabbit duties for the first 2 laps ...

no no no no no .... Ryun led from the start. They ran a staggered start and broke for the pole coming off the first turn ... Ryun in the lead and never behind. Not sure how this got started but it is categorically false. I had heard that for some time but ....glaring truth verified by simply watching the video.

malmo wrote:

Nonsense. Those hyper-fast banked 200 meter tracks are faster than any outdoor track.

Exactly! Thanks for providing a sane voice, Malmo. Once again, I'm guessing that the German hype machine that produced some of those "under 13:00" predictions must have infiltrated this thread.

The Rocket. wrote:

By the way, its good to see German showing signs of a comeback. Congrats to him on a solid run.

This may be true.. but can he do this?

no one wrote:

in his 3:58 in HS his team mate did some rabbit duties for the first 2 laps ...

no no no no no .... Ryun led from the start. They ran a staggered start and broke for the pole coming off the first turn ... Ryun in the lead and never behind. Not sure how this got started but it is categorically false. I had heard that for some time but ....glaring truth verified by simply watching the video.

Ryun in an interview said that his teammate helped him by being right behind him in the beginning because it helped him keep a solid pace. or something.

Now THAT is nonsense.According to your logic, Webb would have ran FASTER than his 3:53.3 HSR at the Prefontaine Meet if it had been held at the 2009 Big 12 Indoor Championships location??!!What would he have run as the HSR that day? 3:51? Would he had dipped under 3:50?Wow.

malmo wrote:

Nonsense. Those hyper-fast banked 200 meter tracks are faster than any outdoor track.

call me big poppa wrote:

Now THAT is nonsense.

"Wow" is right! I'm sorry, but if you honestly believe that a solo indoor 3:55 on a banked 200m track (no maneuvering for position, artificially perfect weather, etc.) is the equivalent to an outdoor 3:53, you probably don't know nearly as much about the sport as you think that you do! Beyond that, it's also a safe bet that Malmo has much more insight regarding world-class distance running performances than you do.

Yeah, so according to malmo, we really need to revise the conversion charts. A banked 200m indoor track is marginally faster than a flat 200m track, as well as faster than a 400m outdoor track. So, is a 200m indoor track the same as a 400m outdoor track? Or is it too faster than a 400m outdoor track?

Haha. I almost fell for your sarcasm. Ha- good one man. I was gonna say, if this is all true, we need to let big time meet organizers know that if they really want to be setting the best World Records possible, they might want to move the big time distance races indoors. I mean, we could be looking at a sub 3:40 this summer if we can move the Rome meet indoors.

Again- WOW.

2 years on wrote:

This article from 2 years ago may sum it up

How good is German Fernandez?

http://www.time-to-run.com/blogs/index.php/a/2009/01/26/how_good_german_fernandez

It doesn't.

Fernandez was limited by his coach to no faster than 30 second 200s in his training when he ran 4/8:34. An incredible talent.