NRR: France's Hand-of-God goal v. Ireland

"Played for 15 years...", certainly not at that level or you wouldn't say that.

Should France or Thierry Henry be proud absolutely not " And they are not" is it understandable that the Irish be pissed off? of course....but they are barking at the wrong tree, The French team has been on the other side of the fence many times and for much more important world cup games. France has been screwed by bad referee calls more than its fare share and guess what ...The final result was never in question. Matter of fact France vs Serbia game which ended in a draw 1 vs 1 was a big miss call by the referee which prevented France from winning the game which most likely would have pushed France on top of their group.

Referees have , do and will continue to make mistake even crucial ones. That's part of the game.

To compare this with Maradona's hand of god is ridiculous and if I have to explain why then it is clear you have not learned much about soccer.

To say Thierry should be fined or punished after the game is total nonsense.

The only punishment should have been yellow or red card if referee sees it during the game.

Even Roy Keane the great Irish player defends Thierry and blame the Irish team for missing big opportunities.

It was clear Ireland outplayed France on that day.....But we all know it 's not always the better team that wins at the end of final game. France played knowing they had one goal lead and Ireland played knowing they had to score.

To say Ireland would have been in the WC without the handball is also ridiculous. at that point is was a draw and penalty kicks are not much more than a coin flip. Matter of fact the way the french goal keeper was playing that day I would have bet some money on the french team to win any penalty kicks series against any team in the world.

No one disputes the handball (even Thierry admits it -Maradona never did!)

So now it's all about fairplay, Thierry is a cheater and FIFA needs to show the world that fairplay is important....Give me a freaking break!!

You want fairplay, Then have Ireland replay the match vs Georgia where the referee gave a fake penalty to Ireland that allowed then to draw 1 vs 1. Like Roy Keane said about that game defending Thierry...no one asked about replaying the game then.

You want fairplay, lets replay every game that was lost because a penalty was given to a player diving for no reason other than to draw a penalty kick from the referee(You can take 2 stars away from the Italian jersey on that one alone).

You want fairplay, then lets red card every player that claims the ball when it goes out of bounds despite knowing perfectly it is not theirs (that's basically every players on every team). Now how many goals came from such false claims?

That's cheating too!!

(I won't even talk about pulling jersey and holding players when the referee is not looking)

The point is, they all do it and in Thierry's position 95% of players would have done the same, because at that point even he couldn't know for sure that his play would lead to a goal . It is the referee's job to prevent players from getting away with it. Yellow cards, red cards whatever is needed.

Correct me if I am wrong but no international team has ever replayed a game because of a bad referee call. not any despite all the international tournaments that ever took place. But Ireland has to have their Prime minister ask the French President to get involved with this ....How ridiculous.

I guess Ireland figures France is used to getting screwed if there is one team out there for which this could happen it has to be France...

Soccer is like a giant poker game, once you get used to receiving bad beats, it's hard to feel bad when you give one out yourself. It's part of the game. nobody likes it but we all know the rules, and if you can't take it don't play the game...

I understand that Robbie Keane did not cheat to score a goal - but in true Steven Gerrard fashion he ran over and grabbed the ball to take the penalty. Given the recent outpouring in Ireland requesting fair play - why did Keane not put the penalty past the post. Also - and your point is stupid that Ireland qualified comfortably. There is no way to say what would have happened should Ireland have lost that game.

Again - the decision blows - and they should bring in TV replay. But there have been worse decisions than that - and much more important - which have not resulted in replays.

Big Jack wrote:

Well arsehole, Robbie Keane didn't cheat to score that goal....Henry did and that's the arguement.

I'm glad you agree with Roy Keane...arseholes think along the same lines....Keane walked out on his country when needed most in 2002....

Actually - thats not the argument. The argument is that the referee made a horrendous decision which resulted in Ireland losing the game - and Ireland want a replay. People are not saying 'we want a replay cause Henry cheated - there saying we want a replay cause the referee is a muppet'.

Also - not sure if your plastic or not - but majority of Irish guys I knew back in 2002 totally agreed with Roy Keane. In saying that (this is a running board) they were runners - so probably agreed more with his points about the dietary requirements etc of professional athletes.

I'll say it again - horrendous decision, unjust etc but the hypocrisy of Robbie Keane etc is galling.

Thanks for taking my post out of context. I said played for 15 years to defend my idea that i was never tempted to grab the ball with my hands because I'm not an idiot and I know that it is against the rules. That was more of a cheap shot than anything relevant. Soccer is soccer.

Also, I never once said that the game needed to be replayed, I said that Henry should be fined like many other people who get in trouble off the field for things not caught on the field. For example, the crazy New Mexico soccer girl. This is the World Cup and it comes around every 4 years, not every year like your lameass NBA Finals. It's a bit bigger. Also, is this what we want to be portraying as soccer? Cheating? I don't care how sorry Henry is, that was a lame move. And you obviously have no idea of the soccer world with how you're raising Roy Keane's defense up on such a high pedestal. That guy is one of the biggest wankers in soccer, man.

Fairplay Patrol wrote:

Matter of fact France vs Serbia game which ended in a draw 1 vs 1 was a big miss call by the referee which prevented France from winning the game which most likely would have pushed France on top of their group.

Is this it?

What do you all think? Did the Serbian guy dive? Henry did a nice job of getting a goal after that.

Another one.

Re the decision above. I really do not think France can have too much complaints about that one. Like the Evra incident last Saturday - if a goalkeeper dives at an oncoming strikers feet - and does not get the ball - then he's playing with fire.

IIRC the more controversial decision was in the first France Serbia game - that Serbia won. But I cannot remember exactly what it was.

I see Wenger is saying that France should offer a replay. Like he did after Eduardo dived to win penalty against Celtic.

Again - all the hyperbole and hypocrisy this situation has created is ridiculous.

Why does everyone think Roy Keane's opinion is Gospel??

He's a dickhead who walked out on his country when it mattered most, he offers nothing but criticism for the FAI, regardless of the job theyre doing... In 2004 he called Ireland a shit team wearing a shit jersey managed by a shit manager, and that was before he agreed to rejoin the team to help them qualify for the 2006 world cup (which he failed to do).

He said in his press conference yesterday that he wouldn't blame the referee nor Henry for what happened, rather he would blame McShane (the defender) and Given (the goalkeeper).

He said "I’d be more annoyed with my defenders and my goalkeeper than Thierry Henry. How can you let the ball bounce in your six-yard box? How can you let him get goal-side of you? If the ball goes into the six-yard box, I’d be saying ‘where the hell is my goalkeeper?’."

I can only assume that this is a rant Keano has memorised, by this point in the season. His team, Ipswich, are coming in 23rd place of 24 teams in the second tier of football in england... with one win... from 16 games... and 28 goals conceded to put them there.

Another common theme in Keane's criticisms of Irish football is his prevalent attacks on Shay Given... i'm going to paste in an extract from an Irish newspaper to back up the claim...

"However, it's significant that Keane should take fire at Given, with the antipathy between the pair thinly concealed. They were the driving force in Ireland's World Cup campaign in 2002, but they are different characters. Unlike Keane, the Donegal man was viewed as someone who would turn up for his country regardless of the occasion.

In a bizarre attack, Keane chose to criticise Given publicly two years ago, claiming that his attitude was depriving other keepers of a game.

"I think players have agendas, certain players come over all the time no matter what," he said. "Maybe they want to get 50 caps or 100 caps and a pat on the back for it. Shay is one of those ones. He wants to get 200 caps." "

I don't think we should be listening to the criticisms of an arrogant, failure like this guy.

Roy Keane - a failure!

Can you please tell me a more successful Irish footballer over the last 20 years?

Again - the majority of the non-establishment Irish public totally agreed with Roy Keane's stance at the world cup. The FAI was a shambles, unprofessional and riding their luck.

And another thing - it is not like Roy Keane brought this up - did you watch the clip. He got no questions other than about teh game. He's obviously going to voice his opinion on it.

im Irish. My view on Roy Keane is that he should be ashamed of himself. He is a dark man with a dark soul. He was a great midfielder but thats about it. everything else about him is shitty - his personality, his opinions - everything. plus, he's a complete prick! this is the man who beat up a 14 yr old boy. he is a useless, good for nothing, unsportsmanlike asshole who brings shame to his country

actually wrote:

Roy Keane - a failure!

Can you please tell me a more successful Irish footballer over the last 20 years?

Again - the majority of the non-establishment Irish public totally agreed with Roy Keane's stance at the world cup. The FAI was a shambles, unprofessional and riding their luck.

And another thing - it is not like Roy Keane brought this up - did you watch the clip. He got no questions other than about teh game. He's obviously going to voice his opinion on it.

actually wrote:

Again - the majority of the non-establishment Irish public totally agreed with Roy Keane's stance at the world cup. The FAI was a shambles, unprofessional and riding their luck.

That's not true... as I remember from 2002, the country was split down the middle on the Saipan issue. I personally didn't think it was acceptable for the captain of a national team to leave the squad and return to Ireland, without a moments thought about how his country was going to compete without him... that was just spineless what he did.

The 2002 world cup was one where any half-good team could have potentially WON it. Ireland had the worst German team in decades in their group, and had Ian Harte not missed that penalty against Spain in the second round, we would have had to play South Korea in the quarter final and then Germany again in the semi final... we actually had a chance, but that opportunity was eradicated when our captain decided he didn't like his manager, his team mates and his football association.

His words aren't worth the air he's consuming.

Not as bad as Maradona's - at least Henry finished it off with his foot

France should go to the World Cup, but Henry should pay for his cheating by being banned from it

I know very well why you mentioned that you've played 15 yrs and that is exactly why i used it right back at you...to emphasize my point!! After 15 yrs I would think you'd have a better understanding.

The fact that you have the nerves to compare what the crazy new mexico soccer girl did with what Henry did just says it all. You have no clue.

Cheating is wrong and has no place in sports that goes without saying but ....AGAIN, let's stop the BS with portraying Henry has the dirtiest soccer player that ever existed. The man has over 100 international selections, over 50 goals for the french team alone and basically a clean record with lots of respect from every other players in the world. Basically a well liked player. He makes one mistake that, as I mentioned earlier is no different than what most players do on a regular basis in every soccer games and HE is the BAD guy..... That's just plain ridiculous and pure hypocrisy.

It was a bad play he acknowledge it we all agree to it but it is no worse than a fake dive which gets you an undeserved penalty kick. It shouldn't happen at all but it is unfortunately part of soccer and it is the referee's job to stop this.

I 'm not raising Roy Kean on a pedestal I just copied and paste from what has been written about the man as a soccer player.... For a player to qualify as one of the top 100 to ever play the game is a great thing... for an Irish player it is indeed legend worthy (Joke!)

Peace...

A hand ball in the box is about as bad as you can get. Two hand balls is even worse. Scoring off it then celebrating the goal makes is unthinkable.

Henry is known for diving too. He dove famously in a game against Spain and again while playing for Barcelona. Replays showed zero contact.

He's a dirty cheating, french pig!

Exactly. They suspend people for diving and getting away with it. So they should had Henry a 3-match ban for this and rule him out of the group stage. Will they? No, because it's Henry and it's France. FIFA should have given Maradona a serious ban for discrediting the game with his obscene tirade, but it's Maradona and they want him at the World Cup so they let him off the hook.

A replay would open up Pandora's box. Bad idea. There have been many worse and equally decisive referee mistakes. And it's not like Ireland were practically qualified and robbed of their victory. It was even on aggregate and they were not looking like favorites to score the next goal.

TV replays in the game are an equally bad idea. There is no sport in the world more excruciatingly boring to watch than NFL because nothing fuc\king happens - it's just endless replays and commercial breaks. Adding more refs is a better solution. Can't say that it has proven a big improvement in the Europa League so far but if there had been a ref behind the goal at Stade de France he would have had to have spotted the handball.

hypnotoad wrote:

TV replays in the game are an equally bad idea. There is no sport in the world more excruciatingly boring to watch than NFL because nothing f***ing happens - it's just endless replays and commercial breaks.

Umm... Ever heard of Rugby Union?

The delays in the game in NFL is mainly due to sponsership obligations... and NOT due to the use of referee-aiding replays.

What you just said was untrue

ukathleticscoach wrote:

http://backporch.fanhouse.com/2009/11/19/thierry-henry-diego-maradona-forever-linked-by-hand-of-god

Not as bad as Maradona's - at least Henry finished it off with his foot

France should go to the World Cup, but Henry should pay for his cheating by being banned from it

I would go back to talking about something you know a bit about.

Not that I could tell you what that is mind you, given my experience of you on a couple of forums.

I did qualify what I said by saying that the Irish people I knew were all fairly good runners - and thus were more likely to agree with Roy about what it actually takes/took to succeed at the highest level.

I cannot actually believe you go on to indicate that you think Ireland had a chance to win the WC that year - that was never going to happen.

So who saw the quote of the FAI representative when it was confirmed there would be no replay.

I would have thought he would look good if he said something like this:

'We know referees make horrible decisions, like when we played Georgia we benefited from a decision which was more inexplicable than that on Wednesday night. However, FIFA has to take a stand against cheats - and by ordering this game to be replayed and banning Henry for a certain number of games, they could have made that stand.'

Instead all we got was:

'Whine whine whine...its not fair....whine whine whine.'

Seriously. Why the F*** are Ireland more deserving of a replay than Georgia or any other team which has been obviously screwed over.

Just because the handball resulted in France going to the World Cup and Ireland not, doesn't mean the Henry should be banned.

Are we going to give bans to every player that dives, claims a corner when they know it's not or fakes an injury in the future?

The fact that it was such an important moment is irrelevant.

Henry won't be banned, and he shouldn't be banned.

Would you be calling for a ban if it didn't result in a goal? No you wouldn't, so therefore he shouldn't banned.