Thats BS. Sounds like a jerk of a cop. I bet a milllion bucks he wont ticket a bunch of guys playing basketball in the park after dark. In NYC during the Guiliani years the park lights would stay on at night but you were not allowed inthe park, the police would chase you out.
Interesting. There was a cop car on the Monon just last night (11/20) at the Winthrop Ave intersection in the middle of Broadripple. Was about 8 pm. Looks like they're making a more concerted effort to make sure people know to stay off after hours. I was wondering what that was all about.
I got stopped once by a cop in Carmel on the trail 2 years ago, before I knew you were supposed to keep off. He just told us to get off the trail, explained it's closed after dark, and so we did. We didn't however give him any lip.
This is a very odd type of policing. The reson a parks have a curfew is to stop illegal activity from happening. Running is not illegal. Whomever the police chief is in Indianapolis might want to re-think his strategies for protecting the citizens.
They're all over now down in Broad Ripple. I passed one police officer (IPD - not park ranger) on the Kessler bridge. He was walking north, around 4:30. Saw another one south of 52nd. Guess they're taking the crime wave (?) seriously.
Monon Runner wrote:
Folks,
I was out a little later than normal a few nights back, running on the Monon in Indianapolis. I was about 4 blocks from home when a park ranger pulled onto the path and shined a light in my face. He yelled "halt" at me, which I promptly did. He immediately berated me for being in the park "after closing" and threatened to write me a $50 ticket. I wasn't entirely sure when the park closed, thinking it was closed at dark. The sun had set about 10 mins earlier. The cop said "park closes at dusk". When I asked him exactly what "dusk" meant (ie -- sunset, pitch black, etc?) he told me he didn't like my attitude and wrote me the ticket. I never did get clarification on my questions. This guy, I think, had a big chip on his shoulder and was just looking for someone to bust. It was me.
I'm trying to decide if I should fight this at all. My common sense tells me to just pay the $50 and move on with life. The other side of me would really like to know exactly what "dusk" is, and how one can determine that, and get a few digs on this guy for being such a jerk. Thanks for any input.
i dont understand why parks have to close at dark. its a public place, and should be open to eveyone all the time. its just nature, its just good ole' outdoors and mother nature. they dont own the park or the outside, mother nature does; so why is there a time limit for how long you can be outside?
you were right, and the cop is wrong. he's probably just jealous that he cant run like you, and should have just given you acknowledgement for having the desire to run at night/and or cold conditions.
tell him to go get a donut, and stop hating on you for being physically fit.
I live in a neighborhood just off the Monon, north of 86th street, and use the Monon to commute home from downtown periodically. Was riding home right around "dusk" (whatever the true definition of that is) last week and passed a cop walking on the trail, heading the same direction as I was going - right around the Brewpub. As I passed him I said "thanks for working tonight" and kept going - he said thanks and that was it.
I agree with trailrunner63 on his assessment of the changing realities. With the 3 incidents lately, there is going to be more of a presence on the Monon and they will be enforcing the rules that have always been in place. We can argue about the intent of the rules and we can also argue about it being right or wrong that they are only now enforcing them and we can argue about whether the rules should be written the way they are - but bottom line is that the situation has changed and we just need to react accordingly...
If you are in the general area of south Broad Ripple, just head over to the Canal Towpath where those rules do not apply and get your run in over there...
I said hi to both the guys I saw tonight, and they acknowledged me as well (one said "have a nice run"). Seems like IPD is a little more friendly than the park guys..
Anyway, the Canal would have the same rules...all parks close at dusk as far as I know.
Sounds like there's quite a few of us letsrunners using the path.
Good point - guess I never thought of it as an IndyParks controlled entity, but it is a greenway just like the Monon. Definitely not patrolled like the Monon is, but it doesn't see the amount of traffic the Monon does either...
Couldn't tell if the guy I passed was IPD or Park Ranger...
It is kinda funny to see how many Monon users are on the message boards here.
Canal tow path...is there a better place to run in indy? Especially considering the fact that you don't have any idiot monon bikers blowing past you...
i can't believe you didn't chew this pig out for being some fat, lazy, bastard...ticketing somebody for actually doing something healthy for themselves...i guarantee the fat bastard was driving up the monon straight to the broad ripple mcdonald's for his XL chocolate milkshake and double with cheese and you were just in his way! (forget the surface roads...the monon goes right past the front door!) hilarious!
Last night around 5:45pm, i passed two police officers, one at 54th, he waved and one driving over the bridge over Kessler. It still wasn't dusk out. I ran a half mile before 86th street and turned around. When I came back through Broad Ripple I saw the Cop sitting there on Broad Ripple Ave, so I ran down the side streets (where i saw 2 other runners and a biker) to 54th and cut over to College going back home. I actually didn't feel as safe with whoever random people that are out in the neighborhoods, plus I almost got hit by 3 cars! You can't run on the sidewalk at night because it is uneven and you can't see where you are stepping. Why don't they let runners and bikers do their thing while the police still patrol as they do now?
indianapolis runner wrote:
Why don't they let runners and bikers do their thing while the police still patrol as they do now?
Somewhere along the line they decided that placing yourself in dangerous situations in public places is not in the best public interest. Park closes at dusk.
Wow, my mom grew up in the Broadripple area and attended Broadripple High back in the early '50s. That area seems to have gotten a bit rougher.
Anyway, a couple of comments:
The original poster said the situation got off to a bad start because the ranger shined a light in his eyes. The police are trained to do that in order to have the upperhand. If you did have a gun and intended to shoot him, it would be a little more difficult if you were blinded by the light. He's doing his job.
The ranger defined dusk when he said you had to leave. I seriously doubt a local court is going to try to determine whether dusk occurred at 6:01 or 6:04 p.m. They will probably say that the ranger is in charge and if he told you to leave at high noon, you are supposed to leave.
To the guy who wanted to know if he should run if the cops tell them to halt, why be stupid? Running makes it appear that you are doing something wrong. Just be polite and do whatever you are told to do.
My local park also has a dusk to dawn curfew. I've been stopped by the cops dozens of times over the 9 years I've run there. I'm always polite, point out the nearest exit from the park, and ask if I can leave that way. One cop has stopped me so many times that he just calls me by name and asks me to leave. I've never gotten a ticket.
On the other hand, by running at night through that area, I've helped the cops catch people who were doing illegal things. I was running one night and saw some kids selling pot to a bunch of other kids. I kept going and saw two officers sitting in their cars. I asked them if they wanted an easy bust and showed the fastest/easiest way to get to the scene. Ever since then, those two officers just wave at me when I run on the trail at night.
If you're not doing anything wrong, just stop, answer their questions, and move on. They deal with a lot of situations daily that are potentially dangerous to them; there's no reason to set them off just because you want to run to a certain place.
I didn't know that David Letterman posted on this board!
:)
I agree with ya...
Happy Turkey Day everyone...look out for the field of 3000 at the Turkey Trot in Broad Ripple tomorrow morning...never would have thought that many people needed an excuse to get away from their family on Thanksgiving!
I was gonna do this run....but my plantar fasciitis flared up something terrible about 3 weeks ago. Sigh. My best days are behind me anyway....good luck if you are running.
There are NO lights out on the Monon... meaning that it is DARK out there ! I ride a bike out there frequently, and I run out there frequently, but do both only in the daylight hours. Forgetting about the crime issue, it is dangerous to run or bike out there at night, as unless you have on good reflective clothing and/or lighting, a biker cannot see a runner and vice-versa. This of course applies to walkers as well. Ergo.... they very intelligently proscribe anyone being out there ! Plus the potential safety/crime issue is even of greater importance and a further justification.
Agreed...I do commute with numerous lights on my bike, both front and rear, but still won't use the Monon after dark to do so. I figure that the lights would make me even more of a target because they would see me coming down the trail. Not to mention that it would still be too dark - there are plenty of other options to get me from downtown to the Nora area using surface streets...
When is the court date?
You should go and pull up this thread afterwards to tell us what happened. I am in favor of telling the judge that the ranger wants you out of the park so that he can pursue his own homosexual activities. Only use that as a last resort when it appears that you won't win.
Don't think I'll be pursuing it, I look at it as a $50 donation to Indy Parks. Besides, this thread contains far more entertainment than that $50 ever would have purchased..
I hope you know that you're disappointing a whole bunch of bored people.
At least make something up for us.
Not from Indy wrote:
The ranger defined dusk when he said you had to leave. I seriously doubt a local court is going to try to determine whether dusk occurred at 6:01 or 6:04 p.m. They will probably say that the ranger is in charge and if he told you to leave at high noon, you are supposed to leave.
That is ridiculous. First, he wasn't ticketed for "not leaving" when a ranger asked him to leave. He was ticketed for being in the park after dusk. If a traffic cop gives you a ticket for speeding--and if you contest the ticket in court--do you think the judge is not going to care what the speed limit actually is? The definition of dusk is probably the *only* thing the judge will be interested in.