50+ Masters Training and Racing Open Forum

What is the goal of that workout? Just wondering.

Bill,

Mile race prep.

Igy

Yes, but exactly what does the workout do to that end? What physiological adaptations are you striving for?

Nice workout, Igy.

I actually made it to the track yesterday!!!

Did 6x300m (60s-62s range, about equal recovery) + wu&cd.

Knee felt better as the workout wore on and is OK today, but with a heat index of 100, not really keen on running this afternoon.

Cheers!

Bill D. wrote:

Yes, but exactly what does the workout do to that end? What physiological adaptations are you striving for?

Bill,

Good question. The physical adaptions I was looking for were anaerobic and mechanical. I am trying to get comfortable at a hard sustained effort. That requires both adaptation of both the energy and muscular systems to necessary support the effort.

When I was younger and training for a mile I often ran 3 x 800m @ 2:02-2:06. Mihaly Igloi was my coach at the time. Since I am now 66 this workout seemed age appropriate.

Igy

Thanks for your reply.

Anaerobic efficiency or capacity?

lucKY2b,

Thanks. Good effort on the 300s. Fortunately it was cool this morning, in the 60s, and the afternoons now are upper 90s and low 100s, but dry.

One thing I have noticed about the track work, my mechanics improve with the faster running. I tend to get sloppy at the slower speeds, and there seems to be some carry over after a time. Naturally controlling both effort and recovery seems to be the trick. Earlier in the week I was having some fatigue related to the adaptation to greater stress. I scaled back a couple hard days and did the same on the easy days. Worked for today's training. I am planning another KP recommendation Saturday if all goes well.

Igy

Bill D. wrote:

Thanks for your reply.

Anaerobic efficiency or capacity?

Bill,

I would say more on the efficiency side but capacity as well. The effort was hard enough where the last 100m of the last 600m stood me up. There is the bit of the psychological factor as well. Pushing yourself through a challenging effort.

Igy

Six today, including 3 mile tempo on the track - 19:00, with splits of 6:20; 6:20; 6:20.

Quicker than I expected. I wasn't timing individual laps, but I guess just got locked into a pace. Heart rate was never above low 150s, so doesn't seem that it was too hard.

Ghost of Igloi wrote:

Bill D. wrote:

Thanks for your reply.

Anaerobic efficiency or capacity?

Bill,

I would say more on the efficiency side but capacity as well. The effort was hard enough where the last 100m of the last 600m stood me up. There is the bit of the psychological factor as well. Pushing yourself through a challenging effort.

Igy

Cool. I'm assuming the 400 and 600s were at a comfortable pace for you with little recovery thus putting them in the efficiency category. The 200s with full recovery would be touching on capacity.

Cavorty wrote:

Six today, including 3 mile tempo on the track - 19:00, with splits of 6:20; 6:20; 6:20.

Quicker than I expected. I wasn't timing individual laps, but I guess just got locked into a pace. Heart rate was never above low 150s, so doesn't seem that it was too hard.

Well done. What are your racing goals, if you don't mind me asking?

Hi. Had a knee injury that ended up with meniscus surgery in 2015. Tried to come back too quick and ended up with a lot of tendonitis-like problems that are only just resolving. Was able to keep doing steady 5-6 mile runs at about 7 min miling, but couldn't push off on the leg that had surgery.

Really just starting structured training. I've just turned 60, so maybe if I got in shape, the Masters Games in Utah in October. I'm more 3000m/5000m than further, and I wouldn't be ready for anything serious much earlier.

I was very surprised with today - figured 19:30 (6:30 per mile) would be fine, but just seemed to grove into the 6:20s. Pretty much part of a continuous six mile run - ran 1 1/2 to the track - straight into the 3 miles - and then jogged 1 1/2 back to the car.

Did do 3 miles (or strictly 4800m) of 100m hard/100m jog in 19:30 a couple of weeks back, so I guess a tempo run at ten seconds per mile quicker shouldn't be too fast.

Based on what I was doing at 56, age graded equivalents for 60 would be around 4:59 - 1500m, 10:40 - 3000m and 18:35 - 5000m, but that would depend on getting back in a similar relative shape!

Bill D. wrote:

Ghost of Igloi wrote:

Bill,

I would say more on the efficiency side but capacity as well. The effort was hard enough where the last 100m of the last 600m stood me up. There is the bit of the psychological factor as well. Pushing yourself through a challenging effort.

Igy

Cool. I'm assuming the 400 and 600s were at a comfortable pace for you with little recovery thus putting them in the efficiency category. The 200s with full recovery would be touching on capacity.

Bill,

Honestly, I did not run the workout that way. I took full recovery on everything. I do workouts that I think will help me improve. Of course I generally approach it from both a scientific and experience perspective. Fifty-one years of experience as a young runner, college athlete, club athlete, college coach, and masters athlete plays a larger role in my training. Of course for better or worse.

Igy

Cavorty...I am impressed at your fitness level at 60 yo and 2 years removed from knee surgery. You are wise to be patient, but you've obviously made great strides recently. At this rate, the sky is the limit for you. Keep up the good work. I wish you all the best.

Ghost...with full recovery, I'm sure you'd agree we'd have to classify that as anaerobic capacity. The volume is reasonable for such workout, the paces are relative to your current fitness level (which I have no knowledge of) and presumably appropriate, and the rest interval clearly categorize this as a capacity session. Given your coaching experience, I'm curious why you seemingly do arbitrarily suggested workouts. Maybe I'm missing something.

Bill,

Perhaps your inclinations are correct. I write weekly workouts for our masters club. It is nice to incorporate other ideas. The suggestions seemed reasonable for what I was trying to accomplish. I thought it might be fun to give them a try. The workouts seem to be helping my overall fitness. My training partners notice I am catching up. Having fun is half the battle.

Igy

Dang Igy that KP session impresses...you've made really nice steady progress throughout the year...Charlie too.

You guys keep this crusty old guy inspired.

MF

PS Solid 300s there Lucky2B...must have felt good after last week...steady as she goes

MikeF,

Thanks. Watching out for old rusty nails though. Don't want a flat tire before I reach my destination!

Igy

The flip-side of the fast Master's workout might be mine (as a 66 year old), with Tuesday's track work of 4x400 in 1:56.8 (200 recoveries, walking the first few steps to get breathing back) and 4x200 in 53.9 with the same 200 recoveries. Temp was about 85 to start and 93 to finish, humid, thin cloud cover making it feel a bit cooler, but may have been a heat index close to 100 by finish. Was far too hot for my wife to run and support me, so she went to the gym to finish her workout.

First time at track in a month, and no races planned before an end-of-August 5 km. Goal is sub 8 minute pace for the race, prefer sub 24:00 but will depend on the heat/humidity, as there's no shade and course has a couple of tough hills, plus a short one near the finish (runs around and inside the KC Royals stadium, Kaufman Stadium).

Kansas Rains, I like that term! Thought we had that a couple days ago in our back yard, but without rain, turned out a water main had broken in the street behind us!

Good health to all!

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Week 319

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Greetings, Semi-Centenarians! Impatient as I am want to be, I gave it a go this week, first three days went well; after the fourth day, I developed some tightness behind the knee (though it's not as bad as where I was a couple weeks ago.) I guess I'm not ready for multiple days in a row at this point. So it's 4-days and 16+ miles for the books:

Sun: Off

Mon: Off

Tue: 4.3 intervals-lite (6x300, ~equal rec.)67,63,61,60,61,61

Wed: Off

Thu: 4.2 progressive through 3.1 (7:33 avg, 3rd mile @6:23)

Fri: 3.6 easy (8:23/mi) Oh, the Humidity!

Sat: 4.1 easy (7:54/mi avg) First 3 easy, last 1.1 at 7:12/mi

Felt good to get back to some running, and the speed doesn't seem to be bothersome. It was only after Friday's easy slog that there was an inkling that something was still askew, but I gave it a go Saturday, since it felt fine Saturday morning. That probably was a bad call. Patience...... Also, I remembered to throw in some retro-running strides after Tuesday and Thursday, which were both on the track, but forgot to do so when on the roads Friday and Saturday. So I'll back off some, but will press onward more cautiously and mindfully (which, for starters, means only walking today.) I also need to spend more time rolling out the hamstrings, as well as the quads.

OK, I'm optimistic that this will resolve itself soon. Like I said, I've been through this before, so I just need to manage it.

How about y'all? Looking forward to any reports out of Baton Rouge.

All the Best!