Official 2014 Boston Marathon Race Discussion Thread

Cheater awarness wrote:

6263 Cannon, Keri A. 31 F South Jordan UT USA

40k 2:06:15

Pace 5:16

Proj. Time 2:18:01

Offl. Time 2:18:01

Overall 21

Gender 1

Division 1

Wow, he really feel off the pace the last 2k!

Joey Mcintyre from New Kids on the Block just finished.

Woo-hoo!

Kara makes one bad mistake after another. Wonder if she was in the Oiselle booth selling t-shirts.

So Jeptoo ran the 1:09:28 for the first half and 1:09:29 for the second half? Is that the closest anyone has ever come to an even split in a marathon race?

The Boston marathon is not a time trial course. You are not going to set World Best times like London, Rotterdam, Berlin or Chicago. Was the field set up with rabbits to ensure a 2:05 or 2:06 today? Sometimes the more talented guys don't win, how about a front runner who gets lucky and "steals" a race. It's happened before, although it's a lot less common today. I don't believe there was a fix. Meb knew that he couldn't win by just staying with the favorites. He had to take the lead and then see how long he could get away with it.

Very happy for Hall that he's finally silenced his critics. I was getting really tired of hearing that he hasn't finished a marathon in over two years.

Er... wrote:

Anytime you hear someone comparing road running to cycling you know you can stop listening. The pack in a road race can't "reel in" someone with a big lead the way the peleton does in cycling. Nor do they think they can, for that matter. The chase groups in a marathon don't sit there calculating how many seconds/mile they can make up on a breakaway. Anyone who doesn't understand this misunderstands both sports!

rojo wrote:

While some on tv are amazed by it. the guy behind me in the press room is a VERY well connecte person in the sport laughed and said, "It's like the Tour de France. They are the domestiques. The big guys don't care. We're taking bets here as to how many minutes they (meb and boit) finish bheind the leaders)."

One thing to note with the cycling comparison is that every once in a while, the peleton does indeed misjudge just what it takes to reel in the breakaway and the breakway does manage to hold on for the win. Which seems to be what happened- the pack was expecting the old guy to fold and he didn't.

I've been playing support crew for kin who was running in the second wave, so I saw the finish of the men's elite while sitting in a bar on Newbury street (I got outvoted when others wanted lunch) Huge round of applause from the patrons when Meb crossed the line.

Weather was apparently slightly on the hot side- a little too sunny and a little warmer than forecast had called for.

Exactly! Meb did Buzunesh Deba of 2013 New York marathon, and that was the only way he could have a chance to win or place well. It work for him. Josphat Boit who went with him also ran a great race, getting a PR(after he PRd in the half marathon a few weeks ago at the world half marathon champs). Had he sat with the pack that would not have happened.

Meb's "Strategery" worked wrote:

The Boston marathon is not a time trial course. You are not going to set World Best times like London, Rotterdam, Berlin or Chicago. Was the field set up with rabbits to ensure a 2:05 or 2:06 today? Sometimes the more talented guys don't win, how about a front runner who gets lucky and "steals" a race. It's happened before, although it's a lot less common today. I don't believe there was a fix. Meb knew that he couldn't win by just staying with the favorites. He had to take the lead and then see how long he could get away with it.

This was exactly the kind of race where we would pick a healthy Meb to go for the win, out slow, 1:04:21/50, the win in 2:08/9, a big-time, hugely meaningful occasion (the anniversary of the bombing in this case, the Olympics in two other cases), and we know that he goes for the win whenever he has a shot at it, multiple times he tried to do that in NYC before winning it. Most important, he is tough as nails and does not drop off at a pace like this. He always overperforms. He does not have a shot in a 2:05 (nor obviously, 2:03) race, but this is his wheelhouse. He came up huge and for all of you anti-immigrant and racist types, he stepped up when there was an opportunity after the white guys never could. Think about it. Both Ritz and Hall could absolutely have run 2:08:37 and stolen one as well but they have never had the will to dominate, the gutsiness to break away like this. Of course, they've both had injury issues for years but the opportunity to do this has been there and why is it Meb's fault if he grabs it.

A great American who makes us proud and one of the nicest guys you will find anywhere. After Gasparilla this year he was out hanging out with the slower finishers and he will go on easy training runs with much slower guys that he just happens to meet on the way frequently. And look at what he did in running with Michael Cassidy at NYC on a day he just did not have it last year.

Didn't Pre run the same way, to see who had the most guts? Same as Ron Clarke.

Abdi seems clairvoyant with his " Are they gonna run that tomorrow?" quip about the 2:05 guys

Spot on about Meb's gutsiness etc but you don't seem to realize how slow a course Boston is, absent a 30 mph tailwind. There has only been one sub-2:07 ever at Boston outside of that crazy 2011 race. Anyone who doesn't think Meb could go 2:05 on a time trial course right now is delusional.

Look, my bad about the intelligence thing. My apologies.

That said, I disagree with your main points, if I am understanding them correctly.

1) Meb ran a great race. No argument there. And his time was more than respectable. However, it was not the overall time that looked suspicious. It was the fact that he dropped the pack of elites with no effort. He did not put in a single surge. He ran a very steady 2:08 pace and the entire pack of elites just dropped off before half-way. That makes absolutely no sense under 'normal' racing circumstances.

If there is a replay of the race, watch it. Watch the whole thing. And then tell me you are not scratching your head wondering what in the world is happening as Meb is pulling away without picking up the pace.

2) Not sure about Shalane

Women's sports are not as prestigious, monetized, visible as men's sports. For better or worse that is just the way it is. If you are going to fix one, fix the men's race. And remember, to fix the race does not mean that you pick the winner. It just means that you pick the losers (African elites). The rest is up to the luck of the day. Lots of folks were thinking Hall had a shot today.

I love hindsight:

Looking back on the pre-race interview with Meb, he says just trying to go in healthy, knowing he had accumulated lifetime miles but didn't get in the speedwork that he wanted to in build up.

So of course if it was slow and even he was going to try to take a slow-building lead from way out -- knowing he didn't have the speed to win a close one in the final miles.

Neat to re-read that after watching the win.

Recognizer of Brilliance? wrote:1) Meb ran a great race. No argument there. And his time was more than respectable. However, it was not the overall time that looked suspicious. It was the fact that he dropped the pack of elites with no effort. He did not put in a single surge. He ran a very steady 2:08 pace and the entire pack of elites just dropped off before half-way. That makes absolutely no sense under 'normal' racing circumstances

Of course it makes sense. The rest of the lead pack underestimated an old guy whose with a slower PR who last finished the NYCM in 2:23. You don't chase a recent 2:23 guy and they figured Meb would come back to them. If Kimetto or Deisisa had gone, the other top guys would would have gone with them. They didn't give Meb the respect he deserved and it cost the.

akaaaaaaaaaa wrote:

Of course it makes sense. The rest of the lead pack underestimated an old guy whose with a slower PR who last finished the NYCM in 2:23. You don't chase a recent 2:23 guy and they figured Meb would come back to them. If Kimetto or Deisisa had gone, the other top guys would would have gone with them. They didn't give Meb the respect he deserved and it cost the.

This would make sense if Meb picked up the pace or put in a surge. The point being made is that Meb was running a steady effort and the pack of elites decided to slow down before halfway while running a pace that the majority of them should have been able to hold for several more miles.

akaaaaaaaaaa wrote:

Recognizer of Brilliance? wrote:1) Meb ran a great race. No argument there. And his time was more than respectable. However, it was not the overall time that looked suspicious. It was the fact that he dropped the pack of elites with no effort. He did not put in a single surge. He ran a very steady 2:08 pace and the entire pack of elites just dropped off before half-way. That makes absolutely no sense under 'normal' racing circumstances

Of course it makes sense. The rest of the lead pack underestimated an old guy whose with a slower PR who last finished the NYCM in 2:23. You don't chase a recent 2:23 guy and they figured Meb would come back to them. If Kimetto or Deisisa had gone, the other top guys would would have gone with them. They didn't give Meb the respect he deserved and it cost the.

Nope. Meb came in 4th at the 2012 Olympics for crying out loud. There is no chance that these guys would just write him off. None.

Did anyone notice that Joan Samuelson, Female winner in 1979 & 1983, ran a 2:52:11 at age 56. Good for an age grade of 100.64%

Recognizer of Brilliance? wrote:Nope. Meb came in 4th at the 2012 Olympics for crying out loud. There is no chance that these guys would just write him off. None.

So you think it's more likely that there was a massive bribery conspiracy where a dozen top runners and their agents were bribed to throw the race instead of the top runners underestimating a 38-year old with the 15th slowest PR in the field who last ran a 2:23 marathon?