Frank Meza 2:53:10 at LA Marathon (70 years old) unofficial time (just finished)

I blew the picture up on my iphone. Can not do that with a my desktop. Absolutely FM rejoins the course. As you say, could have been a potty stop, But to maintain his time, it would have to have been fast like Shalane Flanagan in the Boston sleet. Frank came in cold to maintain 6:40 or faster for at least a mile. So the issue has never been that Frank can't run fast enough. Just for not 26 miles straight. I guess, in a way he is doing repeats. If he is biking ahead, this is still impressive stuff for a 70 year old. James Bond like. Maybe FM just got caught up in this, and can't get out. There is a chance he could see this thread, and just settle for his last 3 races, all at 2:53...and give it up. That would leave FM with the 2 fastest actual times for 70 plus. If you could turn LA 19 into a DQ, show Phoenix the tape from 2015 and they may just DQ it too. Then the record won"t be tainted. His gun time was real close to 1108 at 15k and 25k. Questions remain. Did Frank have help or not? The amazing thing is we debated this so long. The contributors to this thread who were adamant about FM being a fraud, sure seem to be right. The real problem is there is still that scintilla of doubt. We don't want to hang an innocent man, do we. This is why the death penalty does not work. You have to be right every time. With overzealous prosecutors, and lazy law enforcement, that is impossible.....It is comical, yet tragic...catching FM in the act. It just doesnt look like someone hurrying to rejoin the race. It looks like someone sneaking up and quickly rejoining the race. Pit stops in half marathons are not common for runners that finish sub 1:40. Usually youngsters. To say that someone chasing his own best 70 plus marathon time, would give up time for that, is suspect. Good work to the people trying to keep record times legit. (eligible or not for WR) How about USATF? Has anyone checked to see if FM is a member?

Looks like him coming in from the side to me, and he ain't in the sequence of photos leading up to it as far as I can tell, but you'll need to get high res copies of them.

As it says on FinisherPix:

"SHOPPING CART You could not yet decide? Why not buy a present for an athlete friend?"

and send them to Frank. ?

Roderick Powell wrote:

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As you say, could have been a potty stop,

..

If it were a potty stop, wouldn't there would be photos of said person leaving the course? It looks like that camera was recording photos every X seconds.

Roderick Powell wrote:

If he is biking ahead,

Did Frank have help or not?

If he's biking ahead, he'd have to have help, wouldn't he? Someone collects the bike and moves it on to the next pick-up point. I don't know the course and whether you could get a vehicle around and drop off/pick up a bike, so just sayin'.

potty shop wrote:

Roderick Powell wrote:

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As you say, could have been a potty stop,

..

If it were a potty stop, wouldn't there would be photos of said person leaving the course? It looks like that camera was recording photos every X seconds.

Yes.

Observation alone....doesn’t look the part....?

potty shop wrote:

Roderick Powell wrote:

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As you say, could have been a potty stop,

..

If it were a potty stop, wouldn't there would be photos of said person leaving the course? It looks like that camera was recording photos every X seconds.

Enough Rod.

If I took a potty stop in a marathon, I wouldn't walk directly at 90 degrees. I'd cut in fastest tangents. If this thread is unfair, email Rojo to take it down. Let them decide. They've decided to keep it up. Age group records should be scrutinized. There's enough doubt to DQ here.

If I were RD, in 2018, a 39:27 first 10k would get said 70 year old runner DQ'd. But that's just me. No one's running 39:27 in a marathon that's doing 2:56 times. No one.

And why don't any of these record holders EVER have their GPS data. They never have it.

And what's he wearing? Double layers! No one else is dressed like that. Re-read marathon man by the New Yorker. Here's a quote.

”No non-élite runner in his late forties could run a 2:52:12 marathon—an average pace of 6:34 per mile—in mild weather wearing that kind of clothing."

Do you even realize how fast 2:53 marathon is? For a 44 year old none the less?

it's only matter of time wrote:

the photos in front of the wax museum are b/f the 15K mat, as are the photos you reference. but, go to page 7213 (the sequence of frank in front of the chinese theatre). go to pic 3017_115397, enlarge it, and look to the figure walking on to the course, just to the right of the 9 water mark. did this photographer just catch frank jumping back on the course? go through the sequence following. the 15K mat is w/in a mile and frank and the woman, 18573, cross the 15k mat within three seconds of one another (frank 3 seconds back).

Be interesting to know if the woman and yellow top man can recall anything, anyone know who they are and what time they ran?

stinks all around wrote:

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Good post, agree 100% with points raised.

Remember that this is very likely a group effort. That could include bib muling with the race belt, which not only allows for quick exchanges between runners, but also allows one to hide it and still cross chip mats. It could also include designated pick-up and drop-off points for a driver.

After Kip Litton, nothing seems far-fetched anymore.

In the photo sequence where Frank jumps back in at Hollywood Blvd the runner and yellow appears to turn towards Frank and gesture WTF by throwing up his arms in the air.

There’s also some discrepancy in other LAMs as well. In 2017 he’s running by himself with a few runners well off in the distance near the 6M mark on Glendale Blvd. They catch up and pass him within 3-400m right before the 10K timing mat: I’ve been able to track down most of the runners’ bib #s and compare 10K splits + gun times to Frank’s and of course they don’t add up. Frank would have needed to run a blazing 4600m to account for his calculated speed along the stretch next to Echo Park Lake on Glendale Blvd. If I have time this weekend, I’ll drive out to the location, measure it, and work on the calculations.

stinks all around wrote:

And what's he wearing? Double layers! No one else is dressed like that.

Usually, when I see older guys on city streets wearing that many layers, they're pushing shopping carts or something.

[quote]Roderick Powell wrote:

"If he is biking ahead, this is still impressive stuff for a 70 year old. James Bond like. Maybe FM just got caught up in this, and can't get out. There is a chance he could see this thread, and just settle for his last 3 races, all at 2:53...and give it up. That would leave FM with the 2 fastest actual times for 70 plus."

You can't be serious. Impressive stuff? just caught up? Settle for his last 3 races?? 2 fastest actual times??? You, sir are in denial. He should be exiled to the Rosie Ruiz cemetery of shame, along with all the other cheats.

Good work by all you sleuths.

Frank Meza Report wrote:

In the photo sequence where Frank jumps back in at Hollywood Blvd the runner and yellow appears to turn towards Frank and gesture WTF by throwing up his arms in the air.

I was thinking the same thing. Either that, or he's doing a highly premature victory celebration.

Geez, you aren't kidding. Look at 3017_115398. The guy in yellow seems to be quite upset, which is understandable. Nothing like running an honest pace just to see some guy jump in right behind you from a side street.

Roderick Powell wrote:

The real problem is there is still that scintilla of doubt. We don't want to hang an innocent man, do we. This is why the death penalty does not work. You have to be right every time.

If I ever get in trouble, I want you on my jury.

stinks all around wrote:

If I were RD, in 2018, a 39:27 first 10k would get said 70 year old runner DQ'd. But that's just me. No one's running 39:27 in a marathon that's doing 2:56 times. No one.

Whitlock did, well past 70 too

stinks all around wrote:

”No non-élite runner in his late forties could run a 2:52:12 marathon—an average pace of 6:34 per mile—in mild weather wearing that kind of clothing."

Do you even realize how fast 2:53 marathon is? For a 44 year old none the less?

A 46 yo here in Sydney ran a Pb of 2:36 in Berlin

I Am Sam wrote:

stinks all around wrote:

If I were RD, in 2018, a 39:27 first 10k would get said 70 year old runner DQ'd. But that's just me. No one's running 39:27 in a marathon that's doing 2:56 times. No one.

Whitlock did, well past 70 too

He ran standalone 10ks that fast. Big difference. Post the marathon he ran 39:27 in the first 10k.

A 46 yo here in Sydney ran a Pb of 2:36 in Berlin

Yes, that's faster. What's your point? 2:53 at 48 or whatever is still very fast.

If you read my post, than you ought to know I do not buy the bathroom story. I was replying to raddison who was replying toits only a matter of time these were Raddisons words, not mine. This is what raddison wrote. Excellent!!!! The only way he can explain that photo is he needed a sudden - and lengthy toilet break. I thought I made it clear that I disagreed with that. Read what I wrote...about him not hurrying back (as in a potty stop) FM was sneaking back into the race.