It does seem that Houlihan has passed Simpson. I don’t think Simpson has slowed but Houlihan has just gotten faster. I could see Simpson running 3:58 and Houlihan 3:55.
It does seem that Houlihan has passed Simpson. I don’t think Simpson has slowed but Houlihan has just gotten faster. I could see Simpson running 3:58 and Houlihan 3:55.
Javman wrote:
Houlihan was a basic 400/800 girl in Iowa HS. Speed wins the day in a slow race, and Shelby has the sprinting ability that most of those "distance" runners don't have. Given a moderate-slow race, a sprinter will ALWAYS win over so-called distance runners. Somehow, this basic fact is lost on idiots that think that the more miles you run makes you a better sprinter at the end of a race. Pure B.S. Basic fast-twitch muscles will always win out, and Shelby showed that over the others.
You’re correct but not completely. So there are levels to your theory and I’ll explain further to enlighten you. Shelby can have that sort of finish in a 5k that is going 15:40 pace when she’s has 14:45 capabilities. In say a 14:40-50 race she ain’t finishing the last 200 like that, trust me. That’s where the “miles” come into play. The stronger you become aerobically the less you have to rely on the anaerobic system i.e when you start “hurting” or getting tired. Reserving that anaerobic until the end allows one to be able to kick like crazy. Now of course you need to have that ability to run that fast also. Meaning if someone’s fresh 200 speed is say a 28, they won’t be able to finish a 5k no faster than 29-30. Shelby can probably run an all out 200 in the high 24/low 25s when fresh, so that’s why she can finish a 5k with a 26/27. But no she won’t be able to do that again East Africans until she gets her aerobic system better with all the “miles” as you put it. East Africans can kick so well because they are so strong aerobically, but they don’t have jets like Shelby so she has the potentially to medal at the WC/OLY but has to get stronger. She’s there for the 1500 I believe but not quite for the 5k
lienellekjldnxlkndlkknsld wrote:
Shelby kicks down Jenny like a boss!! So amazing! And what a great, fun personality to boot! I enjoy cheering for her!
Jenny is old......or ageing...........which in itself is old.
It was coming.
ONe cannot be ontop for ever. This is the change of guard. I t is good for the sport.
Even Frerichs, or someone much younger will overtake Coburn in another two to four years.
These things do happen.
That kick in the 5k did not look like it was unassisted! How in the heck did she do that? Not with Jerry's training!
Jerry Juice
NativeSon wrote:
lienellekjldnxlkndlkknsld wrote:
Shelby kicks down Jenny like a boss!! So amazing! And what a great, fun personality to boot! I enjoy cheering for her!
Jenny is old......or ageing...........which in itself is old.
It was coming.
She's looking rough.
why??? wrote:
That kick in the 5k did not look like it was unassisted! How in the heck did she do that? Not with Jerry's training!
Are you kidding??? The real shocker was that she didn't win by more. She certainly should have. This was the second slowest 5000 at USATFs in the last ten years. It was 17 seconds slower than last year, when Houlihan also won, and 30+ seconds slower than her qualifying time. She was by far the fast runner on the track. Her qualifying time was 15 seconds faster than anyone else's. Given all that, it's hard to see how she won by only 1.7 seconds (over Rachel Schneider, who she beat by almost 3 seconds in the 1500 on Saturday!).
The real test will come in July, when she runs against the Gang of Four in the DL. She was well beaten by them in Birmingham in March, finishing 4+ seconds out of 3d in both the 3 and the 15. Since then, she's dropped her 1500 PB by 4 1/2 seconds.
Maybe it's time for Jenny Simpson to start a family and let the young runners like Houlihan succeed.
Jenny doesn't have to do anything to let Shelby succeed - Houlihan has progressed very well. It is possible for them to co-exist in the track world.
So now Goucher has a case with Houlihan? LOL! Someone needs to spend more time running and less twittering.
Predictor wrote:
It does seem that Houlihan has passed Simpson. I don’t think Simpson has slowed but Houlihan has just gotten faster. I could see Simpson running 3:58 and Houlihan 3:55.
Well, it's not a binary thing. Houlihan owned EVERYONE at USA's but it's not guaranteed she'll never lose to simpson again
Simpson could still beat Houlihan in a race and Houlihan will probably beat Simpson. Simpson has shown over the years she is peaked and in position in the right, big races. She's consistent and fast. easily one of the best USA mid-distance runners ever
Why do we need to discuss an absolute changing of the guard?
round and round wrote:
Predictor wrote:
It does seem that Houlihan has passed Simpson. I don’t think Simpson has slowed but Houlihan has just gotten faster. I could see Simpson running 3:58 and Houlihan 3:55.
Well, it's not a binary thing. Houlihan owned EVERYONE at USA's but it's not guaranteed she'll never lose to simpson again
Simpson could still beat Houlihan in a race and Houlihan will probably beat Simpson. Simpson has shown over the years she is peaked and in position in the right, big races. She's consistent and fast. easily one of the best USA mid-distance runners ever
Why do we need to discuss an absolute changing of the guard?
A better topic is Simpson vs. Houlihan in the 5k. This is with Jenny actually training for a 5k.
Often, 800m races are similar to 400m races as far as tactics. 400m: often athletes go out one to 1 1/2 second(s) slower than than 200m PB. Last 200m is a battle fighting deacceleration. 800m races: often fastest 400m runners go out 3.5 seconds to 4 seconds slower than their 400m PB. The 800/1500 athletes running an even pace appear to be outkicking everyone. The 800/1500 runners simply are not slowing down. 800m runners are not necessarily psychologically suited to racing last 200m faster than penultimate 200m. I would like to see both Kate Grace & Brenda Martinez get in sub-1:59/sub-3:59 800/1500 condition over next eleven months. I'd like to see them both race 1500m @ USATFC, 2019 with following pace: 62, 66, 66 & 44.9. If they don't go out fast next year, letsrun will have hundreds of post stating 2:01 800m runner S. Houlihan actually is a secret 1:56 800m runner due to her final 200m kick.
ironside wrote:
letsrun will have hundreds of post stating 2:01 800m runner S. Houlihan actually is a secret 1:56 800m runner due to her final 200m kick.
"Will have"? I guess you haven't been keeping up with current events -- letsrun already has hundreds of posts saying exactly that!
Don't be an idiot wrote:
why??? wrote:
That kick in the 5k did not look like it was unassisted! How in the heck did she do that? Not with Jerry's training!
Are you kidding??? The real shocker was that she didn't win by more. She certainly should have. This was the second slowest 5000 at USATFs in the last ten years. It was 17 seconds slower than last year, when Houlihan also won, and 30+ seconds slower than her qualifying time. She was by far the fast runner on the track. Her qualifying time was 15 seconds faster than anyone else's. Given all that, it's hard to see how she won by only 1.7 seconds (over Rachel Schneider, who she beat by almost 3 seconds in the 1500 on Saturday!).
The real test will come in July, when she runs against the Gang of Four in the DL. She was well beaten by them in Birmingham in March, finishing 4+ seconds out of 3d in both the 3 and the 15. Since then, she's dropped her 1500 PB by 4 1/2 seconds.
This. Weak field, not a terribly fast time. Probably not the hardest 5k she has ever run. Will be interesting to see how she does against international competition at DL this summer.