Andrew MF Hunter!!!! 3:58.25!!

Caucus Crazy wrote:

Holy Moly!

Editor's note: LRC Recap and results of race here

Indoor tracks are better than they were when Webb set the record 15 years ago so are the tracks. Did hunter run it on a banked track?

ALSO...nutritional supplements and enery drinks such as Monster are much better than they were a generation ago.

I would NOT by any means consider his performance better than WEBBs!

This kid is certainly the next big thing. The real question is can he break Alan Webb's outdoor mile record? Much like Michael Johnson's 200m record, I assumed it would never be broke, but then came Usian Bolt. Could Hunter be to Alan Webb's mile record what Usian bolt was to Johnson's 200m record?

He should be able to break Webb's records, both him and Webb were HS phenoms on PEDs. I would bet the house on it. 100%. And so would all of you.

I'm a proud WASP but let's face it, we invented PEDs because we aren't an athletic race, we are grinders and shufflers, who always use the system to tip the odds in our favor in everything we do because we don't do well on level playing fields against other groups in anything. We learned this 100s of years ago and devoted all our time to weapons development and chemical enhancements (steroids, EPO, hgh, botox). Our genes are limited but our will to win, at any cost, is what defines us.

wellwell wrote:

I'm a proud WASP

0/10

lnljn wrote:

RacingtheCanteloupe wrote:

Don't forget, according to his coach Tom Schwartz, there are about 15 kids just like Andrew Hunter out there this year, waiting to receive proper coaching and run 3:58 as HSer's along with him. The future of the US 4 x 1500m at World Relays looks bright indeed!

(Tongue in cheek. Happy for Hunter and Schwartz, just wish they would not downplay his unique gifts and his 13:36 dad)

^^ this

why does the culture of running knock talent so much? very few seem to want to admit they have talent, just that they are only working hard with "average talent". he's huge talent, coach should admit that.

My answer... humans with healthy self-confidence create self-narratives in which we are in control and we are the good guy. Here are two stories, tell me which sounds better to oneself: "I rose above my average talent, and by hard work and dedication ran sub 14:00 in the 5k." Story 2: " I was born with supremely good genes for distance running, and I trained hard for a good number of years. Those factors led to a sub 14:00 5k."

I would love to create an experiment with posters from this board who insist hard work is the key variable: give them a choice to try to become an elite swimmer, rower or shot-putter. See how years of hard work on their slight, lanky frames leaves them, for the most part, pretty average. (I would know: I have the archetypal distance runner frame and skill set and found my low ceiling in swimming pretty quickly). As a coach, I have seen that genes trump hard work... unless the kids are of a reasonably close talent level to start. Then hard work can make a big difference.

That brings me back to the topic at hand, Hunter and Schwartz. Schwartz never called Hunter's talent level "average," so I have stretched things out a bit here, but I believe he is still being disrespectful to Hunter's competition by essentially saying if the top 15 kids were coached properly they would be where Hunter is. No.

I like the kid, and Schwartz really does seem like a good coach. But let's not pretend Andrew not a genetic outlier among outliers. A hard-working, polite, determined outlier, but an outlier nonetheless.

I'd never seen him run before until that mile. Telling the truth, I was surprised how not smooth he looked. Sure it was fast, record and all, but I don't think he has anything below 3:33 in him. It was not just what you see in a GOAT candidate type runner—natural running speed, flow, form, bounce or whatever else you can call it. You know what I mean. Anyway, good luck and congrats to Drew Hunter!

a.newman wrote:

GOAT

Henrik wrote:

I'd never seen him run before until that mile. Telling the truth, I was surprised how not smooth he looked. Sure it was fast, record and all, but I don't think he has anything below 3:33 in him. It was not just what you see in a GOAT candidate type runner—natural running speed, flow, form, bounce or whatever else you can call it. You know what I mean. Anyway, good luck and congrats to Drew Hunter!

It's possible that he didn't look smooth because he has mostly been doing strength-oriented work. When he starts doing some work at mile race pace, it's likely that he will look a lot more smooth.

Lets run tears him apart in 3...2...1...

mlcollll wrote:

My old coach used to say there are WCs walking around the streets.

.

Thanks, tips. What would prevent current, future or past champs from doing that?

wellwell wrote:

I'm a proud WASP but let's face it, we invented PEDs because we aren't an athletic race, we are grinders and shufflers, who always use the system to tip the odds in our favor in everything we do because we don't do well on level playing fields against other groups in anything. We learned this 100s of years ago and devoted all our time to weapons development and chemical enhancements (steroids, EPO, hgh, botox). Our genes are limited but our will to win, at any cost, is what defines us.

The REAL question is that you have guys like Rojo saying they ban certain users for claiming that all they talk about is how different people are on drugs, yet there is SO MUCH ON THE LETSRUN.COM FRONT PAGE devoted to doping and cheats. It seems like the Brojos are fostering the lack of faith in the sport in general, but then they get mad at people for claiming highschool kids are doping? Seems pretty hypocritical to me.

His training is very strength based, hasn't done a lot of speed or even been on the track much at all due to weather in the last 2 weeks. He was also sick and said post race that he felt awful during the race. If you think he looks bad now, you should have seen him 2 years ago! Steadily improving, form-wise. And he's probably not going to be a 1500/miler, long term.

Considering that he is primarily doing 10k pace work, plus a few 200s and lots of strides, we aren't coming close to seeing his ceiling. Now German's ceiling was very, very high but he couldn't stay healthy. Hunter has been very healthy and coached with admirable restraint. This is the second sub 4 hs miler that the Hunter family has coached, so this isn't coming out of nowhere. Rupp sure didn't have that tremendous speed until well into his professional career. Hard not to see this kid running sub 13 and sub 3:50 in the future if he is doing this at 18 on restricted training.

Has it escaped the brojo's attention that two consecutive distance stars have had coaches with lengthy posting histories on Letsrun?

And to think he will only get faster in College since he has the best distance coach in the Country at Oregon, GO DUCKS

but his name is still "German Fernandez". Name sounds fake. I'd rather run 3:58 and be Drew Hunter than run a 3:55 and have to tell people my name is German.

Say German and Drew are at a bar and a fine girl walks up to German.

"Hi. What's your name?"

"My name is German."

"Okay, but what is it?"

"German."

"Okay...so like...what? Jan? Klauss?"

"No. German."

"Klauss is German."

"No. My name is German."

"Ugh. Whatever."

Same girl walks up to Drew.

"Hi. What's your name?"

"Drew."

Much less of a hassle.

Pssh. No wonder Fernandez was so fast. He's trying to outrun that stupid first name. Thats practically cheating. Hunter is saddled with a normal name like Drew, much harder to run faster that way. Clearly, Hunter's accomplishment is much more impressive.

This guys does indeed have a lot of talent and potential but much caution is needed to ensure he realises his full potential. Often the guys who really go on to be world beaters don't tend to run so quickly in HS as they haven't yet grown into their strength and full development.

Does Hunter look like he is 18 or a older? How much natural development does he have left in him?

Anyone know what his training schedule is like?

Reality check is that 3:58 is blazing hot in HS but shit*ville in the real world of top notch MD.

However for now, the guy is on a huge upwards curve and it would be great to see this continue.

caution needed wrote:

This guys does indeed have a lot of talent and potential but much caution is needed to ensure he realises his full potential. Often the guys who really go on to be world beaters don't tend to run so quickly in HS as they haven't yet grown into their strength and full development.

Does Hunter look like he is 18 or a older? How much natural development does he have left in him?

Anyone know what his training schedule is like?

Reality check is that 3:58 is blazing hot in HS but shit*ville in the real world of top notch MD.

However for now, the guy is on a huge upwards curve and it would be great to see this continue.

1) Almost all of the "world beaters" showed phenomenal levels of talent within the first 1-3 years of running.

2) Hunter looks like any normal 18 year old.

3) Pretty conservative training (there's a post by rojo like 15 threads down from this....)

4) 3:58i is blazing for a high schooler, and very very quick for a NCAA guy, not that great for a national class guy, and pretty poor for world class.