Rats, that was suppose to go to a view of this: https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/236x/78/5a/7a/785a7a01b795b3ed982a034b62e69b5a.jpg
Rats, that was suppose to go to a view of this: https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/236x/78/5a/7a/785a7a01b795b3ed982a034b62e69b5a.jpg
Stade Delort is featured on google maps. Unfortunately it was under construction when the image was made, but where the lines were can still be deduced.
from the video, it is clear that turn 1 starts immediately after the start finish line. The rearward waterfall is about 4m from the edge of the HJ area, and the forward waterfall is 6 or 7m past it. There are no stands on the back straight so they started on the south side of the track.
Using the gmap pedometer it is possible to accurately pinpoint the start of turn 1 to within a meter or so by the outer line and the north grandstand. Measuring manually as close as possible to the inner border of the running surface - erring toward the inside of the kerb, if at all - I got a distance of 102.9 meters around turn 1 to the edge of the HJ area.
Since it errs on the side of short measurement, that's a lower bound. 100m occurs well before the edge of the HJ area, and nothing beyond it is farther than 297m from the start/finish line. The forward waterfall 6 or 7m beyond the edge was thus 290-291m short of the start/finish line.
Though turn 2 is harder to follow in the image, I finished measuring the track at a total of 399m to support the accuracy.
Funny. The 300m start on the inside land should be level with 1500m start on the inside and one can clearly see the 300m start in the second lane just in front of the line they are initially standing on. Mass confusion and they are called forward to another curved line which is start of some mysterious distance. Never ever seen this before.
^^^^ This sounds completely accurate..... ^^^^^^
No lines seen on track and measure it with google. Yep, makes sense.
I think someone already said it, but I would think this is the 800m break line (though usually it is a different color) but that seems to line up better with the other lane markers http://www.iaaf.org/download/download?filename=90af96aa-3d93-4e8f-a295-40c0c971c20f.pdf
Hahaha they all would have known it was the 800m break line too.
It looks like they moved them up from the 1500m start to the break line.
Incidentally, I think this is what they did for the women's 1500m world record, which had an amazing first 300m split followed by decent splits the rest of the way.
The break line is at the beginning of the straight where 800m runners are allowed to break to lane one on a one turn stagger.
Since the turns are more than 100m (and the straights less) the 1500m start is behind the break line.
Depending on how wide the turns are or where they place the finish line, the distance back from the break line to the 1500m start can vary.
Here it didn't seem like much of a difference.
It had to be the break line because we don't see them cross any break line after they start.
When I used to run 800M go we had a marker on the inside of each lane. A little hat to tell us when to break. No curve.
Each track has a different way to mark the break.
Most tracks have a dotted curved line. Some just have dashes at each lane.
A solid line is unusual but works just the same.
I can see it confusing the officials but "1500m start" should be written on the track next the the real start.
None are right wrote:
There is no way to determine which way is right given the video and maps. If people are assuming the two curves are the 1500m start line and the 1500m SC start line then that assumption is wrong. Those two lines aren't more than 12 meters apart. For a 1500m SC that is 4 extra meters per lap. However, for an outside steeple pit, that adds a minimum of 9 meters to each lap. Most outside lap tracks add about 14 meters (Texas adds a ridiculous 25).
Another assumption could be that the two lines are the 1500m start line and the 2000m SC start line. That would be five elongated laps of ~422 meters minus 110 meters which would put the steeple line 10 meters before the 1500m start. Or it could be five ~418 meter laps minus 90 meters, putting the steeple start 10 meters behind the 1500m start. Although not completely impossible, these measurements are highly unlikely given that the track is 8-lanes. We will just have to wait for the IAAF to make their ruling.
No further assumptions need to be made. It's simple. It's the break line. They started at the wrong line.
A solid line for an 800m break seems plausible but should be a different colour entirely. I thought the little markers worked the best. Notice how the 1500m runners know exactly where to start until they are moved forward by the officials. Repaint the line another colour. Also time to standardise the 800m break line.
So the race started from the wrong line, probably the 800 break line, and was about 10m short as a result. The IAAF has received at least two emails about this within the past few days, and claims to be 'investigating'.
My question is, what next? The wounds from the Mike Rossi fiasco are still fresh - a similar situation in which letsrun sleuths uncovered extremely strong evidence that something was amiss with the race, and contacted the authorities. In the Mike Rossi case, the race director promised to investigate, but after a couple weeks of silence simply released a short statement that did not address the evidence for/against Mr. Rossi's completion of the race, but simply stated that no action would be taken. I don't want to get burned again. Is there anything we can do to ensure that the IAAF doesn't just stall for a couple weeks, then do nothing?
Star wrote:
It had to be the break line because we don't see them cross any break line after they start.
I retract that after seeing the Monaco video from last year posted in another thread:
https://youtu.be/qc2GSBUZEMk?t=114They also walk several meters form one solid to another where they start.
And I can't see a break line after that in this race either.
Was Monaco short?
Are there not break lines but break marks like the one poster mentioned?
I am less sure that this was short than I was.
Star wrote:
Star wrote:It had to be the break line because we don't see them cross any break line after they start.
I retract that after seeing the Monaco video from last year posted in another thread:
https://youtu.be/qc2GSBUZEMk?t=114They also walk several meters form one solid to another where they start.
And I can't see a break line after that in this race either.
Was Monaco short?
Are there not break lines but break marks like the one poster mentioned?
I am less sure that this was short than I was.
No Monaco was not short. You have to look at the start line in relation to the other lines on the track. The Marseille race was short. The line they used is clearly too far up the track in relation to the other lines. The start line in Marseille was just short of the 4x100 exchange zone exit line in lane one. It should be 10 meters behind that line (and 10 meters in front of the start of the exchange zone.) In the Monaco video you can see the start line is properly positioned in relation to the other visible lines on the track.
malmo wrote:
No further assumptions need to be made. It's simple. It's the break line. They started at the wrong line.
800m break line would not extend into lane 1 (lane 1 obviously not having any reason to cut in).
As mentioned by several previous posters, just looking at the 300m stagger start lines/4x100 exchange zone lines, they obviously were originally lined up at the correct 1500m start line and then were moved forward to what is possibly the 1500mSC start line.
Um, yeah wrote:
malmo wrote:No further assumptions need to be made. It's simple. It's the break line. They started at the wrong line.
800m break line would not extend into lane 1 (lane 1 obviously not having any reason to cut in).
As mentioned by several previous posters, just looking at the 300m stagger start lines/4x100 exchange zone lines, they obviously were originally lined up at the correct 1500m start line and then were moved forward to what is possibly the 1500mSC start line.
Sure the break line would extend to then inner lane. go to any track and take a look.
The 1500m SC start line would be BEHIND the 1500m start line, and it would only be about 3-4 meters different (inside water jump). If it was an outside water jump the 1500m sc start would be at least 30m IN FRONT of the 1500m line. The line that they started on was about 8 meters IN FRONT of the 1500m start line -- the line that they had originally been lined up to.
It's the break line. Simple.
There is no doubt that the line at which they initially lined up was the 1500m starting line. It intersected with the 300m starting line, and was in the center of the 4x100m handoff zone. I will not speculate on what the second line was. All we need know is that it was the wrong line and caused the race to be too short.
Also, to the people trying to use some kind of online mapping tool to measure the length, stop embarrassing yourself.
Now we can also all agree that the women 1500m world record also started on the wrong line. The first 300m in the women world record was just as wonky...
Here is an article we have on the incident:
International Athletics Meeting of Marseille
Samedi 6 JUIN 2015 from 14.00
Delort Stadium - 13009 MARSEILLE
Race Video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=05GEhZqhYcQ
Athlete:
http://www.iaaf.org/athletes/morocco/abdalaati-iguider-201943
Abdalaati Iguider is a Moroccan runner who specializes in the 1500 metres.
Editor's note: We changed the title of this thread after it became apparent (read the 7th post by Deanouk below) that Iguider ran this race from the wrong start line.
We also have written an article about the incident:
