Kids like this won't make it in college. They don't have time for kids who don't do what they're told.
Kids like this won't make it in college. They don't have time for kids who don't do what they're told.
Realism wrote:
Running coaches can be insufferable jackasses.
But really who kicks a 4:03/sub-9 guy off the team for something so trivial? I'd let that kid get away with anything but 1st degree murder!
Which is why you're not a good running coach. Ever consider that RUNNERS can be insufferable jackasses too? Had myself plenty of those...
The Donger wrote:
Kids like this won't make it in college. They don't have time for kids who don't do what they're told.
Which is why kids are better off to run their own in college, and not for some insufferable jackass.
Oh right, when you use the insufferable jackass multiplier his mile time comes out to 4:17.9 which isn't nearly as impressive...
Give me a break, unless he hazed a freshman, punched the coach in the face, or skipped practice to smoke pot everyday, the coach is letting their pride get in the way. If you want your team to do well at a state/divisional meet, you want this kid on your team.
and IF he is a huge douche, get over it, he's graduating in two months.
ccrunner627 wrote:
Oh right, when you use the insufferable jackass multiplier his mile time comes out to 4:17.9 which isn't nearly as impressive...
Give me a break, unless he hazed a freshman, punched the coach in the face, or skipped practice to smoke pot everyday, the coach is letting their pride get in the way. If you want your team to do well at a state/divisional meet, you want this kid on your team.
and IF he is a huge douche, get over it, he's graduating in two months.
It's telling of you that you go straight to "if you want your team to do well at a state/divisional meet" instead of "if you want to mold young men".
Here is the issue with coaching HS kids. You have ages 14-18 on your teams, you need to have rules and have some order in order to make it work and to continue to develop the program. You expect more out of the seniors than you do out of the underclassmen. You expect even more out of the stars, they need to be responsible and demonstrate that to the younger members of the team. They need to set the example, if they want to do their own thing, get rid of them and let them do it on their own. No place for selfish attitudes on a team.
So let me ask another question seeing as nobody answered the first....
Why do coaches pay big money to go see Bill Aris talk? What is the message that he puts out there? His teams are successful because the kids have a stake. They buy in. they don't make sacrifices they choose a lifestyle. all the top programs do it. If you're willing to sacrifice your principles and the team concept to score a few more points at the state meet then you're really not much of a coach.
Bill Aris never coached a superstar.
All his top girls were/are 4:50-5:00 minute milers and top boys 9:00-9:15 2-milers.
He's the best at taking normal, motivated kids and developing their abilities and getting them to race their best when it counts the most. In all the years he coached, no one stands out; they all seem like interchangeable parts. So yes, he's the ultimate team coach.
But, he's never created a Mary Cain, an Alexis Efraimson, a Grant Fisher . . . or, a Matthew Maton.
There's never been more drama with a hs runner that with Mary . . . and, we'll likely never know what actually happened with the falling out she had with her hs coaches her last couple years at Bronxville.
When you're that good . . .and you even have professional coaches calling your home . . . well, that's the age we live in.
Maton is likely looking at what he can do to break 4-minutes this spring while beating his future Stanford foe Fisher in the process. He also was likely seeing that his Summit hs schedule and training weren't going to get him there.
A little bird on my shoulder is telling me he was getting outside coaching advice . . . channeled through his mom, yes? . . . and the Summit coaches found out and were none too pleased.
The above "you're off the team" scenario makes far more sense than the jumping jacks story.
When college athletes get too good for college competition, they turn pro.
Within the past few years, when high school athletes get too good for hs competition, they turn pro (Cain, Efy, now Whitney) and/or drop off the team to run unattached with an outside coach.
Lessons Learned: is Maton looking out for himself? Yes. Is he doing what is best for his athletic development? Yes. Were the Summit coaches right in kicking him off the team? Yes.
Doesn't matter whether the coach is William Aris or William Shatner, the superstar athlete deserves, and gets, special treatment.
The superstar athlete can earn that respect and special treatment, not just by running fast, but by having class. No one deserves anything, earn it.
And, how do you know he is doing what is best for his athletic development? Did Efy do what is best? How has it worked for her?
spock... wrote:
The superstar athlete can earn that respect and special treatment, not just by running fast, but by having class. No one deserves anything, earn it.
And, how do you know he is doing what is best for his athletic development? Did Efy do what is best? How has it worked for her?
First it isn't clear he doesn't have class and isn't liked by his team. He seems like the typical HS kid. Goofs off sometimes, but clearly he is working hard and takes his sport seriously. This to me is the most important thing an athlete brings to a team. Hard work is catching.
This article seems to shed light on things
http://www.runnerspace.com/gprofile.php?mgroup_id=44531&do=news&news_id=331955It sounds like a final grab to control the kid. I also wonder if that contract also mentioned who could coach him. I think the above poster was on to something with that.
I'm happy to see he will still be running the races that matter NB/Brooks etc.
It seems that while running for the Summit team he was pretty successful, a 4:03 mile and 3rd at Footlocker as a jr.. Then he goes supposedly with some behind the back coaching and comes in 19th at Footlocker as a sr. and who knows what track will bring.
If it ain't broke, don't fix it. Shoulda stayed with what was working.
is it really for the best?? wrote:
It seems that while running for the Summit team he was pretty successful, a 4:03 mile and 3rd at Footlocker as a jr.. Then he goes supposedly with some behind the back coaching and comes in 19th at Footlocker as a sr. and who knows what track will bring.
If it ain't broke, don't fix it. Shoulda stayed with what was working.
And how do you know when and even if he started getting this supposed coaching? He was in excellent form at State in November. I always assumed he was sick at Footlocker but didn't want to make excuses...
Unless you live in the area where Summit HS is, this reflects most poorly on the Maton family. Why? Because nobody really knows or cares about the Summit coach.
Now Matthew looks like a problem child and his mother looks like she's enabling him to be that problem child, even if that isn't the case at all. You can bet that his college coaches will subconsciously be affected by this and the slightest thing that could be interpreted as him being a problem child will start to raise doubts, whether they are conscious of it or not.
It sounds like they made an emotional reaction and they only needed him to stay on the team for another 8 weeks to make it through the end of HS without having this smear on him. Now he's tarnished his reputation and that's hard to clean up. It's very unfortunate.
this doesn't look good wrote:
Things didn't go my way.
well there ya go wrote:
This article seems to shed light on things
http://www.runnerspace.com/gprofile.php?mgroup_id=44531&do=news&news_id=331955It sounds like a final grab to control the kid. I also wonder if that contract also mentioned who could coach him. I think the above poster was on to something with that.
I'm happy to see he will still be running the races that matter NB/Brooks etc.
[quote[Maton and his mother, Michelle, met with Turnbull and other school officials in order to find a resolution to the matter.
In order to return to the team the school asked of Maton that he sign a contract with stipulations about his conduct at practices and meets.
Maton declined to sign it.[/quote]
Good for Maton.
The coach is most definitely a jackass and apparently the school administration as well.
this doesn't look good wrote:
Unless you live in the area where Summit HS is, this reflects most poorly on the Maton family. Why? Because nobody really knows or cares about the Summit coach.
Now Matthew looks like a problem child and his mother looks like she's enabling him to be that problem child, even if that isn't the case at all. You can bet that his college coaches will subconsciously be affected by this and the slightest thing that could be interpreted as him being a problem child will start to raise doubts, whether they are conscious of it or not.
It sounds like they made an emotional reaction and they only needed him to stay on the team for another 8 weeks to make it through the end of HS without having this smear on him. Now he's tarnished his reputation and that's hard to clean up. It's very unfortunate.
I would agree with you except he isn't the first to leave the program(not run track ) senior year. It seemed to work out ok for Travis. He is having a nice redshirt freshman year at Oregon(after surgery /injury) last year.
I also get not wanting to sign some lame ass contract that gives these folks even more control over him. Yes I will do my jumpin jacks just so, reporting for duty sir!
I haven't read anything that has made me think Matthew is any sort of "problem child" or is hard to deal with. I certainly don't see his reputation tarnished.
The only thing running-wise he loses is some more state records/championships which big picture aren't that big of deal...
Hopefully it all works out well for him.
So Bill Arris hasn't coached a superstar, you say...do you think Joe Newton would put up with this crap? Some talented kid thinking he's exempt from what the other 250 guys on the team do, and every darned superstar coming through the program did before him? I think not!
I don't think so wrote:
this doesn't look good wrote:Unless you live in the area where Summit HS is, this reflects most poorly on the Maton family. Why? Because nobody really knows or cares about the Summit coach.
Now Matthew looks like a problem child and his mother looks like she's enabling him to be that problem child, even if that isn't the case at all. You can bet that his college coaches will subconsciously be affected by this and the slightest thing that could be interpreted as him being a problem child will start to raise doubts, whether they are conscious of it or not.
It sounds like they made an emotional reaction and they only needed him to stay on the team for another 8 weeks to make it through the end of HS without having this smear on him. Now he's tarnished his reputation and that's hard to clean up. It's very unfortunate.
I would agree with you except he isn't the first to leave the program(not run track ) senior year. It seemed to work out ok for Travis. He is having a nice redshirt freshman year at Oregon(after surgery /injury) last year.
I also get not wanting to sign some lame ass contract that gives these folks even more control over him. Yes I will do my jumpin jacks just so, reporting for duty sir!
I haven't read anything that has made me think Matthew is any sort of "problem child" or is hard to deal with. I certainly don't see his reputation tarnished.
The only thing running-wise he loses is some more state records/championships which big picture aren't that big of deal...
Hopefully it all works out well for him.
Personally, I agree with you. I just worry he'll be treated unfairly, though not consciously, for this and it's sort of his mom's or parents fault for not seeing that. He's in HS and doesn't need a private coach considering he'll be going to a big school next year where he can't retain that private coach.
Woo! Go Jeff.
Don't feel as bad losing to a guy wearing a T-shirt now.
"But, he's never created a Mary Cain, an Alexis Efraimson, a Grant Fisher . . . or, a Matthew Maton."
Nope, only their parents did that. Coaching is way overrated. As in medicine, the first rule should be, "Do no harm."