David Torrence Responds To John Bingham: The blaming of the elites has to stop

It's sad but this is probably where things stand:

quote]Flagpole wrote:

I agree with Torrence that elites are not to blame, but I disagree with him that television is. There simply IS no blame here. Americans don't like running. That much is clear. The vast majority who do participate in a marathon do so as a charity thing or a bucket list thing, and once that's over, they don't care about it any more.

The other sports in our country benefit because for the most part they are FUN; they are GAMES. It's fun to play a game is it not? Running is not a game. Running is hard. MOST people hate it. And, unless you are already a fan of distance running, it doesn't really lend itself to being a spectator sport.

Distance running in The United State will NEVER again be popular as a spectator sport. We just have TOO many other things that compete for our sporting entertainment attention compared to the 70s for example. Professional soccer is here. The X Games. MMA. Football (both college and pro) is bigger than ever. NASCAR is HUGE compared to the 70s.

We could start our own network, put ONLY running on it, and even then the popularity of or sport would not come back. It is what it is...a niche sport for sure, and when you consider how many people actually participate in cross country and track in high school, and yet they don't continue to be interested in it beyond high school, it's apparent that our sport is dead...that is DEAD as a spectator sport here in the US.[/quote]

It's true running can be inherently less interesting than other "game-like" sports, but adding an on-screen stat display to marathon broadcasts and cool-downs with elites at track meets would be really cool things to do and really simple to implement.

bigndgindigbdniogbd wrote:

THE BLAMING OF TELEVISION HAS TO STOP.

TV should be blamed because it is lousy because the coverage is lousy in the US. Most of the announcers are dull, passionless and don't know the sport. There are exceptions like Ato Bolden but for distance running the coverage is terrible. They ignore all of the big stories and rivalries, get the athletes wrong, etc. Getting a good crew of announcers and adding some technological sophistication are both part of the solution to improve the situation.

This is much more of an issue than elites interacting with regular runners, which, as others have pointed out, they do already, at least the American ones do.

Guys like Krupicka and Jurek hang around and cheer on the slower finishers. Geoff Roes would never have hung on to his Olympic berth while injured. The ultra and trail cultures are egalitarian in the way that road racing hasn't been for a long time. I once finished a marathon and there was Bill Rodgers in the tent fraternizing with the rest of us. I'd bet that neither Bill nor Jurek uses the term elite. Commodified running is pathetic.

We are fans of David Torrence. See his BBTM bio and newsfeed below.

http://bringbackthemile.com/athletes/detail/david_torrence

Torrence was right on with everything he said in his email.

TV coverage in america IS horrible. Here's a simple example.

Elite marathon. Women have just finished. Men are at mile 19 and making moves. Every time, coverage just follows the women's winner after she finishes for 5-10 minutes while missing the key part of the men's race.

Solution? SPLIT SCREEN. Show both simultaneously. Maybe make one big, one small so your announcers can jaw off about the one they want to focus on. So easy yet they fail to do it every time. The same thing goes for watching pole vault in the middle of a 5k. Split screen it. Piece of cake.

Just one tiny example of easy things tv coverage gets wrong. It seems like nobody calling the shots has any knowledge of what's going on.

I have been at races where elites are glad to take pictures and sign autographs on their cool downs or at races they are invited to. Not just track or elite marathons or company sponsored events.

I have met and talked with Leo Manzano at Texas Independence Relay which has zero elites, but having a pro runner at the start helps motivate you on the next 20-30+ hrs of running.

Brent Vaughn and Simon Bairu stopped their cool down to take a quick pic with me at SA RnR.

I even have pictures with Oswaldo Lopeez(which I helped crew), Hal Koerner and Karl Meltzer at a 100 mile race.

These elite athlete are very humble and welcoming to any fan that recognizes them and appreciate to sit and talk. I have been around and I have been lucky to get a few of these runners talk and take pictures with me and that has motivated me to keep going.

I was once a front of the pack runner and now a mid-pack guy, but I still support my local, commercial and just for kicks races. I have even organized a few myself to help fund raise and market running.

The media does have quiet a bit to do with it, every time I post I am watching track, xc or any major road race, my friends ask where, what channel, and what events. And many haven't ran a lick since high school and some didn't even finish running in high school, but they ask and they wonder how they can watch, but the media hasn't locked into this demo because it doesn't pay millions.

I have written so much about this subject for years that all I do now is repeat myself. So, hear we go.

There is a host of problems affecting the profile of running/track & field. A lot of the problems are not track & field's fault, it is just how things evolved. It is not track & field's fault that the NFL and the NBA has grown like is has or that kids are now playing soccer, lacrose, ruby or playing video games. I am sure swimming and tennis for example are dealing with the same problems.

One of the biggest problems and one that can be fixed is the disconnect between the star athletes and the public. No disrespect to David, but most elite runners in the prime of their career seem to almost have a distain for recreational runners/their fans. The 'elites' will only interact people in the early part or in the twlight of their careers. I see this all the time, Galen, Hall, Shalane, etc., will do what their sponsors ask them, but that is about it. I am sorry to name names, but I am calling it like I see it. When I cocahed H.S. track, I practically had to beg a profesional athlete to speak at a banquet even after paying their expenses and a small speaking fee. Sad, but true. We can't do anything about the faceless and nameless Kenyans who all seem to have same last names, but fans need to know the backstory and be able to identify with the stars in any sport.

rojo wrote:

As for my thoughts? I'm reminded of the famous Rodney King line, "Can we all just get along?"

The fast people (I hate the word elite) should recognize that getting off the couch and even starting to run is a truly incredible accomplishment for many struggling with high BMI's and a lifetime of inactivity. Fast people, you are not better than someone simply because you are faster, you may just be naturally way more talented.

John Bingham is rightly famous for saying there is no litmus test to being a runner:

"If you are a runner, it doesn't matter how far or how fast. It doesn't matter if today is your first day or if you've been running for twenty years. There is no test to pass, no license to earn, no membership card to get. You just run."

Is there a "john bingham" of football, basketball or baseball? Could you imagine some joker going on about how he can't make a free throw or dribble the ball, but that doesn't mean Lebron James has more of a claim to the word basketball player than he does?

If John Bingham wants to be called a runner then he should call Mo Farah, and anyone else who makes a living doing it a professional runner.

I'm guessing there are more recreational runners (hobby joggers) active then there are these other sports: Baseball, football, etc.

Basic stuff wrote:

TV should be blamed because it is lousy because the coverage is lousy in the US. Most of the announcers are dull, passionless and don't know the sport. There are exceptions like Ato Bolden but for distance running the coverage is terrible. They ignore all of the big stories and rivalries, get the athletes wrong, etc. Getting a good crew of announcers and adding some technological sophistication are both part of the solution to improve the situation.

This is much more of an issue than elites interacting with regular runners, which, as others have pointed out, they do already, at least the American ones do.

This is part of it. It would be a big improvement to hire European announcers who follow track. The difference in announcing is striking. The European announcers know strategy, tactics, and how the athletes have done in recent races. They also talk faster. That might not sound like a big deal, but they can provide more information.

Horse racing is exciting. Why? Because of the announcer. Most viewers wouldn't know squat about what was going on in the Kentucky Derby without a great announcer.

TrackCoach wrote:

When I cocahed H.S. track, I practically had to beg a profesional athlete to speak at a banquet even after paying their expenses and a small speaking fee. Sad, but true.

Of course it's true! Outside of being friends with the coach, or the athlete went to that HS, when have you heard of professional athletes routinely doing this for free?

RobertELee wrote:

I'm guessing there are more recreational runners (hobby joggers) active then there are these other sports: Baseball, football, etc.

Maybe. There a lots of adult age group leagues for soccer, basketball, softball, etc., not to mention pick up basketball on any blacktop court in the country.

Does Torrence have a blog? I want to follow it if he does.

I love everything he says and think he's spot on.

been a huge fan of torrence ever since this..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cfPJ-Hh_Bi8

his commentary here is basically spot-on too

I can confirm what david said about running the road race at falmouth just to interact with people. My buddies (all high school runners) and I all had an awesome time running and chatting with him for a few miles, couldn't have been a nicer guy.

ScottAtOSU wrote:

He's not the only one saying things that help create the divide between the "fast" and the "slow."

You might have noticed RoJo himself mocking the back of the packers in the WSJ article:

"If you're going to get just as much praise for doing a four-hour marathon as a three-hour, why bother killing yourself training?" asked Robert Johnson, a founder of LetsRun.com, adding that, "It's hard to do well in a marathon if your idea of a long session is watching season four of 'The Wire.'"

I mean, let's be fair, both sides need to try to be a little more supportive on this issue. Personally, I don't give a rat's how fast you are as long as you're out there trying.

Scott, clearly you didn't read my my first post here. Please go back to page one and re-read it as I express great respect for the masses and like you believe both the fast and slow should be respected as I wrote, "The fast people (I hate the word elite) should recognize that getting off the couch and even starting to run is a truly incredible accomplishment for many struggling with high BMI's and a lifetime of inactivity. Fast people, you are not better than someone simply because you are faster, you may just be naturally way more talented."

I knew the way that my quote was presented in the WSJ people would think I was anti-elite as he took one quote from a 25 minute conversation and then long email.

My sentiment is the opposite of that in actuality as was my first post here. I'm honestly at times more impressed by 65 year old finishers than I am 22 year old.

Please read my entire email to the WSJ guy which appears here:

Regardless if you read the whole thing or not, I don't know how you think I was knocking the masses. All i said is if you don't traing, you aren't going to run fast. How is that mocking people? I also think everyone is acting logically.

Overall, I'm with flagpole. Running isn't inherently as fun to watch as many other sports. I do think it can be presented way better with better commentators.

But it takes great announcing to overcome the sports problems. It takes a lot of knowledge to follow it properly. Today I stopped by the college xc meet in Bosotn as I was in town. There were several nationallly ranked teams. Foot locker champ Edward Cheserek won his college debut.

I had no idea cheserek was winning or even in the race. I guess I knew Oregon was competing but didn't know who they were running. I was mainly focused on my old cornell guys but it just shows it's really hard ot follow the team stuff without paying a ton of attention.

What other sporting event do you find out who won - way after the fact? If I walked to a random soccer match in Boston, I could easily know who won without having to be told 20 minutes after the fact.