Yeah but it's just you. No kids, wife. See thread subject.
Yeah but it's just you. No kids, wife. See thread subject.
LP!! wrote:
Yeah but it's just you. No kids, wife. See thread subject.
Agreed. I would certainly depend on my wife to work and save if my income didn't increase.
Reality check223 wrote:
Then don't get a wife or a kid until you have enough money
Dude, if you tell me you never ever once in your whole life barebacked some broad without thinking it through, you are either a liar or Tim Tebow.
[/quote]
most GPs never make it to $300k, that's for surgeons and top docs who own their own practice.[/quote]
GPs/FPs are also the lowest salaried positions. It certainly depends on where you are (Florida here)! Places like Idaho probably start mid 100s. Though I have a female FP friend who was at 230k her 3rd year out! PS is the way to go to start at mid to high 200s (here) depending on your specific focus and advance quickly. Not uncommon to see 300s after 2-3 years!
What profession are you in?
brotastic wrote:
Reality check223 wrote:Then don't get a wife or a kid until you have enough money
Dude, if you tell me you never ever once in your whole life barebacked some broad without thinking it through, you are either a liar or Tim Tebow.
I'm neither of those things and I agree with this guy. Why do you have kids you can't afford? It's not rocket science.
who do you agree with? What are you agreeing to? Are you a man? If so, have you ever barebacked? (it was a question to answer, not a statement to agree with). If you have, you put the control in someone else's hands...and should not really be criticizing too hard.
my name is whaaa? wrote:
my name is whaaa? wrote:This is crazy talk. My parents had a combined income of $35k growing up and we were able to move OUT of the rural slums and get a decent house in town in WV. It helped that my dad was a carpenter so he did his own remodeling. We have a Subaru Forester, a Dodge Caravan, and an '87 Oldsmobile Cutlass Supreme with 114k miles on it.
You can do just fine on that kind of income. You won't be able to afford to go on many vacations and you will probably never leave the country, but you've got your comfy house, your satellite TV, your wi-fi internet with modem, and anything else the normal American household has.
Hell, back in 1950, 35k/year probably would have been more like 135k/year.
Did I mention we were a family of 8 as all this was happening? Two parents, six children.
First of all, you live in WEST VIRGINIA! No one wants to live there so of course it is cheaper. Secondly, why did your parents, who are low income, have 6 kids? Talk about not being responsible.
The sad thing is that parents like yours are rewarded for the irresponsible behavior. While other parents are responsible and have the number of kids they can afford, yours get all kinds of tax write offs, qualify for free health care, and free college educations for their kids through grants. No wonder the country is in the mess it is in. We reward the idiots and punish the achievers.
xxxx wrote:
We have 3 children and live on just over $50,000 a year. We do not go on vacations. We buy our vehicles used and keep them for 8 to 10 years. We have no debt other than our house payment. Our house is nice but is near a railway so it was a bargain. My husband does all the work on our cars and all home improvements. We try to buy the best quality goods that we can afford as we find that this saves us money in the long run. I do not have a cell phone and my husbands is provided by his company.
We save a lot of money by not accepting the logic of a lot of our friends that they have to provide their kids with a bunch of junk and extra activities to give them a great childhood. Instead we take advantage of parks and beaches. It is always free to go on a family walk.
I admit that due to the rising cost of groceries, utilities, and gas is making our budget very tight. We always have to keep in mind what is a need and what is a want when shopping.
Also our kids will have to work through college and pay their own way as our own retirement savings comes first and there is just no money left to pay for college. I really think that this will make them decide much more carefully the best way to pursue a future career. My 16 year old is already weighing her options and is careful to take the right courses and get good grades put herself in the best possible position at graduation.
We do have great wealth beyond measure. We live in a safe community and have 3 healthy children. We have a good marriage and a wonderful extended family. Plus I get to run everyday and have a little bit of running talent. I would not trade any of these things for money.
Your kids won't have to pay their way through college. Because you had three kids you can't afford, the government - meaning taxpayers - will be paying for your kid's education. The only young adults that have to pay for their own education are the ones with bright, educated, successful parents.
brotastic wrote:
who do you agree with? What are you agreeing to? Are you a man? If so, have you ever barebacked? (it was a question to answer, not a statement to agree with). If you have, you put the control in someone else's hands...and should not really be criticizing too hard.
I'm agreeing with the guy who said not to get a wife or have kids if you can't afford them. They make condoms for a reason. Don't blame someone else.
Get rid of all debt to start with. This changes the perspective.
areusure? wrote:
most GPs never make it to $300k, that's for surgeons and top docs who own their own practice.[/quote]
GPs/FPs are also the lowest salaried positions. It certainly depends on where you are (Florida here)! Places like Idaho probably start mid 100s. Though I have a female FP friend who was at 230k her 3rd year out! PS is the way to go to start at mid to high 200s (here) depending on your specific focus and advance quickly. Not uncommon to see 300s after 2-3 years!
What profession are you in?[/quote]
Healthcare investment banking.
I know how much docs make. Don't throw out outliers like it's the norm.
It is extraordinarily uncommon for any doc to make $300k, much less after 3 years. Does it happen? Yes. Is it anything approaching the norm? No.
And I do not for one second believe you know anyone who made $200k+ straight out of medical school, unless they do what I do for a living.
1. Home paid off - 3000 sq ft - 5 bdrm 3 bth - one acre - in suburbs. House isn't a luxury deal - but it is very nice and nicely appointed.
2. NO other debt - $.00 credit card
3. 3 cars - all paid for Honda Civic (2000 - running great), Chevy Prism (2001 - running great), Lexus Sedan (2002 w 48k miles and running great). The Civic is a daughter's - we paid for, Other two we (wife and I) share. We only on occasion use the Lexus. Had a used motor home - we sold.
4. We've purchased cars (used) for each of our kids and a nice (new) computer or laptop at HS graduation. In fact we paid for insurance and upkeep and would occasionally fill up with gas.
4. Have many of the so called 'toys' - no 'big ticket' items like boats - no fancy cars - no 'other home' - but have shopped for used big screen (nice) yet getting a new one this week. My son built my computer - has lots of very excellent components. Always look for top rated stuff then save to get prob a step below.
5. We have a strict budget. My wife does coupon thing - get lots of things for 'free' and others for very very cheap - she is not, however, a fanatic. Continually monitor and evaluate budget - tighten up when we can.
6. Rarely eat out - but when we do we are very good tippers ... very good, based on waiter(ess') service. We think this is important. (but never beyond budget - do have to give something up later)
7. Very often had kids friends over for dinner (that costs).
8. We often 'gave stuff' away to less fortunate - not junky stuff either. We thought that was important too - kind of "Pay It Forward" philosophy.
9. Tough one for me, but still 'pay it forward', to my kids; was buying their running shoes - jheez - I used to get em free. Running shoes and athletic gear - heck clothing was a big expense
10. Getting - Giving - Saving ... 50-60k, some years more, early married yrs less
Our kids have become educated consumers and know how to budget / save for 'things' they want. And discipline themselves to attain those.
Answer to OP - its very possible - and has been realized by my family.
just say no wrote:
I'm agreeing with the guy who said not to get a wife or have kids if you can't afford them. They make condoms for a reason. Don't blame someone else.
Come on bro, be a bro. I never disagreed with the bro. I just asked the question, "u never smushed sans protection?" ANd I am now asking you, assuming your a man, if you ever have? If you have, try to be less condescending, imo, bro. If you have not, well, I am impressed. But, answer the question...stop dodging.
cheep peep wrote:
1. Home paid off - 3000 sq ft - 5 bdrm 3 bth - one acre - in suburbs. House isn't a luxury deal - but it is very nice and nicely appointed.
2. NO other debt - $.00 credit card
3. 3 cars - all paid for Honda Civic (2000 - running great), Chevy Prism (2001 - running great), Lexus Sedan (2002 w 48k miles and running great). The Civic is a daughter's - we paid for, Other two we (wife and I) share. We only on occasion use the Lexus. Had a used motor home - we sold.
4. We've purchased cars (used) for each of our kids and a nice (new) computer or laptop at HS graduation. In fact we paid for insurance and upkeep and would occasionally fill up with gas.
4. Have many of the so called 'toys' - no 'big ticket' items like boats - no fancy cars - no 'other home' - but have shopped for used big screen (nice) yet getting a new one this week. My son built my computer - has lots of very excellent components. Always look for top rated stuff then save to get prob a step below.
5. We have a strict budget. My wife does coupon thing - get lots of things for 'free' and others for very very cheap - she is not, however, a fanatic. Continually monitor and evaluate budget - tighten up when we can.
6. Rarely eat out - but when we do we are very good tippers ... very good, based on waiter(ess') service. We think this is important. (but never beyond budget - do have to give something up later)
7. Very often had kids friends over for dinner (that costs).
8. We often 'gave stuff' away to less fortunate - not junky stuff either. We thought that was important too - kind of "Pay It Forward" philosophy.
9. Tough one for me, but still 'pay it forward', to my kids; was buying their running shoes - jheez - I used to get em free. Running shoes and athletic gear - heck clothing was a big expense
10. Getting - Giving - Saving ... 50-60k, some years more, early married yrs less
Our kids have become educated consumers and know how to budget / save for 'things' they want. And discipline themselves to attain those.
Answer to OP - its very possible - and has been realized by my family.
Wow, all of that and you never ONCE sated your family size or combined household income. I could run around listing shit and not disclose that I make $300k annually. Big deal.
Also, if you paid off all your housing and schooling by making $50k annually in 1987, I am duly unimpressed because that would be like $80k in 2011 money.
The point of the OP's, or at least my new found point is that a couple of say 30 years of age, with a new born, that makes $50k/yr combined, is not doing jack shit in today's world.
that isn't comfortable wrote:
A family of four living in a 2 bedroom apartment? Wow, that sounds miserable. Where are you going to find a 2 bedroom apartment in a good area for $700/month? My daughter's very small one bedroom apartment runs $900/month and my son's 2 bedroom apartment at college runs $1260/month.
$150/month for gas? Do you mean for one person or the entire family? Do you live like 5-10 miles from work and never drive anywhere else? Guess what? When you are raising a family, kids need transportation to friends homes, activities, school events, etc. You will spend considerable more than that.
As far as 150/month for a family to have cell phones/internet/cable - who is your provider? I would love to have that rate for my family.
$400/month for a family of four for food???? Have you been grocery shopping for a family of four? Are you talking about just eating rice/beans every day?
As far as those monthy miscellaneous expenses, just our medical insurance is over 400/month(company group plan). Both kids have chronic medical issues - just out of pocket prescription cost is 220-250/month. Car insurance for my wife and two college aged kids is $1900/every six months.
There is no mention of saving for retirement, college educations, supporting elderly parents, paying childcare when kids are small. How about saving for a vacation, furniture, electronics, repairs? Most people will also have car payments at some point and if attend college will likely have student loan payments.
Your figures illustrate you certainly don't have a family and have zero idea how many expenses are involved.
You are right about gas probably costing more, but some of your other numbers are way off. I live in Chicago in a nice 3 bedroom apartment rented for $900/month. It's not in an amazing part of town, but it's not a terrible part either. I'm on a family cell phone plan that has 5 lines for 129/mo (sprint, most families don't need this many lines), no cable and internet is $27 a mo. If you are careful about buying when things are on sale, $400/mo is more than enough for good food for a family of 4; this isn't going to be eating steak every night, but it isn't eating beans and rice either.
Insurance for both health care and cars and loans are what hurts. The best things for families to do is to try to get rid of all debt before having kids. Also, if families are very careful, and if they don't mind driving old cars, it is possible to to not take out car loans. You just have to buy used, and start saving small amounts each month planning ahead 9 years or so for the next car purchase. (the initial car purchase might involve a loan, but after a person is able to get established after school, they should always try to pay the full balance for the car) For a family making 50k, their kids shouldn't expect to get a whole lot of support for college. There's nothing wrong with students paying for the majority of their own schooling.
For anyone trying to manage their money better, I'd highly recommend mint.com This works best if you use credit or debit cards to make all of your purchases, and if you have a card that gives you cash back, then it's actually better to use cards anyway.
Would you not round it up to $170k unless of course you are made of BS
Good luck trying to make it with 50k in California in a big city, not out in the boonies...
Rent for a 2 bedroom apartment is around $1,800 where I live. I currently live in a one bedroom with a baby on the way so we have to get a 2 bed soon. My wife will stop working and we will be living off of my 50k for a while until she starts working again, part-time probably.
Expenses per year for family of 3:
Rent: $21,600
Utilities: $1,200
Family Health Insurance (half paid for by my company):$2,640 (+co-pays, so roughly $3,000 total)
Gas and toll bridge : $5,000
Food: $6,000
Entertainment: $1,000
Travels: $3,000
------------------------------
$41,800
After taxes I make $42,000
So it is possible even in Cali!
gamecock wrote:
Additionally, more people in this income bracket tithe or at least give significant portions of their income.
Yeah that is nuts.
Say there's a pastor of a church, tax free, no property tax, with congregations of 300 people. That's 300 x $50,000 x 10 percent, this guy gets $125,000 a month just for making sure people keep giving him money, while they're starving to death and losing their homes.
If that's not craziness then I don't know what is.
Azaleas wrote:
cell phones are pretty much a necessity for most professionals.
NOT so. I was a professional with my own business for many years. One time an associate was hyping cell phones and trying to get me to use one. He said what if you're out on a long run and someone wants to call you? I said, they'd be out of luck hahaha. End of discussion.
Please.. wrote:
Student loans are around $350. Cable and internet around $100. Cell phone is $80. Gas/electric is about $140. Food is about $160. Car is $220. Insurance is $60.
After going out to lunch a few times, I end up with about $350. I try to put $100 into savings and pay probably another $100 in gas. That gives me about $150 for whatever.
If I were making $50k, and had an extra $1000 a month, I wouldn't have any debt!
Granted I'm not supporting a family, but still...
Student loans = $0
Any other loans = $0
Cell phone = $0
Gas & electric = $6 each
Car = $0
Car insurance = low rate (don't recall exactly)
Going out to eat = $0
Gas = don't know but I don't drive much anymore
Food = not that much; go shopping once a week.
Usually I do all shopping the same day, which might be 6 to 8 stops, taking each stop in order.
I go to the longest stop first, so the car gets warmed up well and uses less gas. I keep the battery charged, so the alternator is rarely used, which helps gas mileage more.