Yes her record is suspect, it is called roids.
God damn cheatin americans, how many american olympic champs and world record holders turn out to be drug cheats 75 %, Pretty pathetic.
Yes her record is suspect, it is called roids.
God damn cheatin americans, how many american olympic champs and world record holders turn out to be drug cheats 75 %, Pretty pathetic.
[/quote]
I would bang both of them in a THREE WAY[/quote]
No, they'd bang you.
[quote]whirledpeas wrote:
people like me, lifelong track people with some scientific training,
./quote]
Where does scientific training take place?
In a lab or in a gym?
Average_Joe wrote:
Former 5k Guy wrote:Then FloJo dies a few years later via natural causes at a very young age.
.
It is funny how falsehoods like this simply will not die no matter how many times they are corrected.
Florence Griffith Joyner died from asphyxiation caused by an epileptic seizure. That was the coroner's report. That is not "natural causes". She had epilepsy. It killed her. The end.
Really if you want to tell us how you think Flojo was dirty, be my guest. I do not care enough to try to spoil anyone's fun. But if you are going speculate about it, please to not continue to perpetuate myths.
So was FloJo a lifelong eplieptic? Funny we never heard anything about that when she was competing.
In and around 1988, there was a systemic failure in American track and field. While doping was hidden, and prevalent, it was also given tacit approval by USATF (or whatever the initials were back then). At the '88 trials, there were over a dozen drug positives that were hushed up, covered up, and manipulated in order to get those athletes "clean" in time for the Games. Most of the athletes were coached by Terry Crawford, the women's Olympic team coach. While it was obvious that many/most athletes coached by Kersee were suspect, he once said about drug testing, "our chemists are better than their chemists." The most shameful aspect of all this is that some genuinely nice people were put in situations were they were forced to make difficult moral situations. Before we all judge, think about having the 'carrot' of success dangled in front of you (the distance to the carrot always being skillfully manipulated by folks like Kersee, Crawford, Debus, etc.), and then being told ther is only ONE way to reach the carrot....use THIS....
USATF (or wahtever) leadership at the time could have been diligent in opposing durg use. They condoned it through benign neglect. And decades later, the sport tries to cram the toothpaste back in the tube. It's too late.
I used to know wrote:
In and around 1988, there was a systemic failure in American track and field. While doping was hidden, and prevalent, it was also given tacit approval by USATF (or whatever the initials were back then). At the '88 trials, there were over a dozen drug positives that were hushed up, covered up, and manipulated in order to get those athletes "clean" in time for the Games. Most of the athletes were coached by Terry Crawford, the women's Olympic team coach. While it was obvious that many/most athletes coached by Kersee were suspect, he once said about drug testing, "our chemists are better than their chemists." The most shameful aspect of all this is that some genuinely nice people were put in situations were they were forced to make difficult moral situations. Before we all judge, think about having the 'carrot' of success dangled in front of you (the distance to the carrot always being skillfully manipulated by folks like Kersee, Crawford, Debus, etc.), and then being told ther is only ONE way to reach the carrot....use THIS....
USATF (or wahtever) leadership at the time could have been diligent in opposing durg use. They condoned it through benign neglect. And decades later, the sport tries to cram the toothpaste back in the tube. It's too late.
Well said.
Intergalactic wrote:
[quote]wejo wrote:
I'm sure this has been discussed before but I wanted to open it up again. I'm working on the homepage and read how the Indianapolis track is getting destroyed and its where Flojo ran her 10.49 world record. I always knew people viewed the record as suspect (wind). But then I saw it was in the quarterfinals of the Olympic Trials.
Then I saw an actual video of it:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=usYdMLIXoPcI bet most of our viewers have never seen the race. She sure doesn't react like she thinks she just smashed the world record. Can some of the old timers explain how this record is still on the books? Or maybe one of the stat geeks.
They even show the wind gauge going off the charts immediately after her run.
I'm not trying to talk trash, but how could you not know this stuff? Might want to ease back on the poker and read up a bit more on the history of the sport if you want to claim to be a track and field journalist.
[quote]
Agreed. I'd say that even a casual fan would know the basic history of this race. For what it's worth, I was sitting in the home stretch that day and don't remember it being super-windy during that race. Although, in real terms, 'windy' conditions aren't that windy at all. Also, why would an old-timer be better suited to explain this record being on the books? Would you need to be a baseball fan in 1961 to 'explain' Roger Maris's asterisk? Track and Field journalist? That's a fraudulent claim.
f***! wrote:
lol yea here legs just implodes...I think Flo-jo could have been good without PEDs-probably about 10.9/21.8
FloJo was the Olympic silver medalist in the 200m in 1984 to VBH. So her being "good" without PEDs is not all that much of a stretch.
To go back to the original post...the evidence of the numbers on the runners blowing pretty stealthily plus the fact that the wind reading was nil should have eliminated this from the books. We're to believe that a wind, which is demonstrated on video as being fairly strong, died down to the point in which it was completely still for the length of the race while at the same time the TJ is being blown all over the place?
The record should have been struck.
Wilma Rudolph
Nice call wrote:
FloJo was the Olympic silver medalist in the 200m in 1984 to VBH. So her being "good" without PEDs is not all that much of a stretch.
So, wait--you thought that was a clean silver medal?
hahahahahahahahahahahahaha
I received the following email from Frank Soder and he said I could share it with you:
Weldon, I was at that Meet and I can verify that the wind was under the verifiable limits. I sat directly across from the wind meter - and there were no shenanigans whatsoever. It was a legitimate run. The wind factor was weird that day, swirling, changing directions, stopping etc. Every run gave different readings. It was very warm and ideal for a sprinter. That run was beauty in motion. I don't know whether she was clean or not - her coach was enough to make one suspicious but no one will ever run like that again.
As you know, I attended almost every Meet and Trials race for years and years up until two years ago. So this isn't a newbie talking.
Happy New Year guys. Keep up the good work.
well case closed, back to talking about other things
the fact that it wasn't wind-aided only leaves one explanation for that impossible time: shenanigans
Short course!!!!
I was there in 1988 as an observer and I can tell you the weather was weird - over 100 degrees. But one other factor to consider - the timing and wind readings were done by Omega, not an American-based company, which made the IAAF much less questioning of the result. Did Omega simply mess up? We will never know for sure, but it is more plausible than the conspiracy theories out there if indeed the wind reading was wrong.
As for doping and USATF (then TAC) turning a blind eye, consider this: USATF in 1988 held hearings on coach Chuck Debus and suspended him for life. And in 1989 after the Ben Johnson scandal, it instituted the first out-of-competition testing program before the IAAF, IOC, or USOC did so. The fact is that in 1988, nobody had out-of-competition testing, and without that, anti-doping efforts were inevitably weak.
Coach Kersee has always been suspected by some folks because of his once being Chuck Debus's assistant but folks who make accusations never seem to have any evidence to back it up. And accusing Terry Crawford of anything because she was Olympic coach is plain dumb. The Olympic coach is largely an honorary position - it does not include having any control over the training of Olympic athletes.
It's well known (now, but not at the time) that the Omega wind gauges at the time essentially needed to "warm up." When turning them on, often times it would take quite a while for them to be able to work correctly (register wind readings). Which is why even though it was clearly windy for that quarterfinal race, it was read as null wind. There was another race after it I believe that had the same reading. Then once it had kicked into gear, the subsequent races all had correct wind readings that were significantly over the allowable.
"The fact is that in 1988, nobody had out-of-competition testing"
Not quite true, Norwegians began years before that. But agree with the main point about doping controls being weak and they remained so for years, arguably remaining so today.
Idiots e. Ir just isn't plausable that USATF wouldn't have the machine "warmed up" for the sprints. That makes no sense at all. But we all believe what we want to.
Maybe its an illusion but the flag behing held behind the runners just before the gun appears to show a headwind, not a tailwind... Makes one wonder if the wind was blowing all directions and FloJo caught a big tailwind gust at some point during her run. Keep in mind the wind meter can only make measurements so fast and is probably displaying an average of some sort. That might explain how a (functioning) meter reads 0.00 on a gusty day. Anyone know the specifics of how these meters make measurements and report results?