Cathal Lombard, former EPO guy returns with good result

ghost wrote:

Pienso que algunos de los atletas espanoles tomaron productos, pero otros no tomaron productos. Entonces pienso que es peligroso y injusto decir que todos los atletas espanoles tomaron productos.

Las pruebas son siempre dificiles de probar, verdad?

Ghost in Korea

chris.moulton (www.gifle.go.kr)

My Spanish is a little rusty but I think it says this:

"I think that some Spanish athletes take drugs and others do not. I think it is dangerous and injust to say that all Spanish athletes take drugs.

The truth is difficult to prove, is it not?"

Ghost, why do you keep responding in languages that nobody else is using? On the other copy of this thread you responded in French to an english post.

Are you trying to impress us or merely to be obscure?

So, would anyone like to set out the all time men\'s 10,000m lists, omitting all altitude raised runners and also those who they think used PEDs to set their best times. Do we then get basically just a combination of the USA native and UK AT lists?

This is the stupidest post I have ever read, and that says alot.

I think the plum that wrote this is on drugs, recreational drugs!

the reason that so many irish athletes hate Lombard is the way in which he went around before the whole incident and denyed any involment with drugs. christ he threatened people who mentioned drugs in the media with court, gave these false interviews about how he trained so differently than past years and generally walked about like he was the golden boy of irish athletics.he took away mark carrols 10k national record with no remorse, took 20 grand from the olympic sports council of Ireland again with no remorse, won the irish national 5k with no remorse, let irish runners and more importantly inspiring young athletes beleive that he did all this though training again with no remorse. he lapped up so much lime-light, respect, money and belief from the irish athletic circle, and the whole time was laughing at us. ok, bring him back, let him run, but my god, i have no respect for the man, and no way as an athlete.

Everything you say is probably true.

I have spoken to a couple of people in Korea, and they are prepared to let Cathal run for them at a professional level provided he gets back to 30:00 level for 10,000. A couple of clubs in France, would also take him in a heartbeat. In Korea, the team is Samsung, with Lee Bong Ju at the head of the team (2:07 marathon guy). They are well organized and monitored, and Cathal could do some freelance proof reading and editing for Korean firms, in the remaining free hours. Cathal is an intelligent man, who made some poor choices in the past. He has learned from those, and is willing to move on, and stay above board.

Yes, if he lied, that was not good, but it will be very interesting to see how far Lombard goes in his new (post EPO) career.

If he comes to run and race for the Samsung team in Korea, perhaps he will show some good form. I do not approve of what he did, but I think we can give him a second chance to prove himself. This is a unique situation that would be a pity to pass up.

Ghost in Korea

c.moulton (www.gifle.go.kr)

Ghost, why give HIM this golden opportunity - talk about rewarding bad behavior.

I believe that people who have made bad choices can be shown the right way. And I am not religious (agnostic), but just human. Cathal is a human being.

Ghost in Korea

c.moulton (www.gifle.go.kr)

I know some spanish runners as well as other europeans have been busted (Baumann) and some french/north africans (the steeple guy - former wr holder). Now these are those who

are the least behind the kenyans and ethiopians. It must

be very discouraging to know that the gap would open if

the europeans would not use EPO. The africans are so much better and "we" will never catch up, because the africans are clean.

very interesting to see how far Lombard goes in his new (post EPO) career. - quote

His "new" (post EPO) career started two years ago, he has already done several races, probably his best being the Cork Marathon Relay, where he did just under 10 Miles in under 50, as far as I remember. Also he isn't any more eligible for a pro career in Korea than anybody else who is running 30', is he?

I have spoken to a few Koreans about the Lombard issue, and they (the Koreans) are willing to forgive and let Lombard get on with his new life. That is a healthy outlook, in my book - and the Asian mentality is more flexible in the sense that it recognizes the fallibility and fragile nature of humans. The Koreans in my entourage find it disturbing that Lombard continues to be the subject of hostility after he has done his time and served his sentence. There was a Korean soccer player who did the same thing, but he's back playing in the K. League, after having been revealed in Europe. No problems - he made a mistake, paid for it...and served his sentence. So did Lombard.

Lombard has probably suffered more, from others, in the past two years than most of us will in a lifetime.

There are criminals living in Spain who committed crimes in the UK who are living the 'high life' and many know about their past, but they are not being treated like Cathal is. Their quality of life has not deteriorated like Cathal's.

Also, I don't condone what Cathal did, but he was essentially commmiting a fault which did not directly affect others. Some people say he took trips away from other people, but sorry, hardly any Irish in recent years have been running up to the IAAF minimum standards (13:30/28:00) anyway.

Yes, he received training money from Irish Athletics and BLE, but he was forced to return that money. After that, he is no longer being supported by his former employer in Dublin, who initially supported him, but had to back down, because of the adverse publicity. I checked their website and Cathal is no longer on their list of solicitors or employees. It is not easy for him to make ends meet now. Personally, I think he should write a book, and that would be very therapeutic and instructive. We could also learn about the modus operandi of EPO users. A fascinating portrait, it would be.

Believe me, I think Cathal has paid dearly for his mistake, and will continue to do so, as long as all these people continue to bear grudges against him. A bit of compassion and understanding would go a long way.

Ghost in Korea

c.moulton (www.gifle.go.kr) Apply now, we are always looking for new teachers.

In todays Irish Times, Irelands biggest daily newspaper, and a spreadsheet at that:

Lombard has no place in the sport

Sat, Feb 09, 2008

Ian O'Riordan On Athletics:

All this US election coverage takes me back to 1992, my sophomore year at Brown University. In between classes, and running, a group of us living in a five-storey house off campus spent hours debating the merits of George Bush snr, Bill Clinton, and Ross Perot, who was obsessed with deficit-reduction.

We had it all worked out, that Clinton had to win. This, after all, was the Ivy League, the cream of higher education - though some say "as in rich, and thick". I wasn't rich and hopefully wasn't thick but somehow fitted in, and carry a great fondness for those years. Like the line from Bob Dylan's Dream, "We longed for nothing and were quite satisfied, talkin' and a-jokin' about the world outside."

Running, however, was always the priority, and this time of year also takes me back to the Heptagonal Indoor Championships - commonly known as the Heps - where we faced off against the other seven Ivy League colleges. Competition was intense, though hardly the most daunting, and typically ended with us all getting along at some post-Heps party. Most of those old acquaintances are long forgotten, although every so often I come across one, such as Weldon Johnson. He ran for Yale University the same time I ran for Brown, and as far as I can recall never beat me. Johnson, however, could run circles around me when it came to politics. His father, Clay Johnson III, was the old fraternity brother of George Bush jnr, and followed him all the way to the White House.

Johnson hasn't gone into politics, not yet, remaining largely devoted to running. Eight years ago, along with his twin brother, Robert, he founded the website letsrun.com, which is now practically required reading for running enthusiasts all over the world. It's not just an accumulation of daily news stories; the message board - billed as "world famous" - is an inexhaustible source of insights and commentary.

It was reading letsrun's message board earlier this week I discovered Cathal Lombard was back racing. Lombard, you may recall, rocked Irish athletics in 2004 when he tested positive for the endurance-boosting drug erythropoietin (EPO), just two weeks before he was due to run the 5,000 metres at the Athens Olympics. It followed a ridiculously swift rise from mediocrity to excellence, and those who watched his career a little closer always doubted his legitimacy.

Lombard denied any drug use, including to me, face to face, when I met him. In fact, he was ordering EPO on the internet, and injecting himself with regular doses. It was only after the Irish Sports Council intercepted an order that their sting operation busted him.

Realising he had no escape, Lombard admitted using EPO, initially suggesting it was to have an equal chance with everyone else though later stating Irish athletics "is generally a clean sport".

Incredibly, this seemed to win the Cork athlete some sympathy, yet for those most loyal to the sport, his subsequent two-year ban didn't go far enough.

Anyway, last Sunday, Lombard ran a decent 24:46 in a five-mile road race in England, and is apparently training for a marathon. When this result appeared on letsrun it sparked a lengthy series of responses, but unlike the Democratic race in the current US election, opinions on Lombard aren't quite running neck and neck.

There are those who say he served his time and deserves his second chance. Yet most people seem to think otherwise, that Lombard's remorse was staged, that he was well funded while resorting to drug use, and would have lived happily ever after as an Irish Olympian had he not been caught. I too question Lombard's remorse, mainly because I met him a few months after he was caught, and offered a casual "how's it going?" - to which he replied: "I didn't like what you wrote about me," before turning his back. Lombard has done little to make amends, whether that be to advocate drug-free sport, or talk about his mistake. Instead he seemed to think he could walk back into the sport, and we'd all welcome him with open arms.

The reality is Lombard cheated a lot more people than just himself. Three years ago I wrote a book with Catherina McKiernan, whose former coach Joe Doonan had since taken over Lombard's coaching - unaware of his illicit drug use. Unfortunately, a whole chapter on McKiernan's disgust with Lombard was cut out for "legal reasons". Some of that missing chapter included her reaction to the news: "It really hit me . . . Suddenly I was shaking, and this horrible, sick feeling came over me. Nothing that had ever happened in my running had left me feeling this sick." And her enduring anger at his actions: "The worst part of it was the damage Lombard did to Irish athletics. I don't think he was even nearly lambasted enough."

If this were 16 years ago and I were back in that house off campus, and it was Lombard we were debating I've no doubt what we would have concluded. Lombard has no place in our sport.

© 2008 The Irish Times

hear, hear. a great article. well done Ian. what Ian has said captures in words what many of us were trying to say. Lombard lied to so many people thoughtout that whole suituation and the little remorse he showed on front of the camera was a total act.

Irish Times wrote:

Lombard has no place in our sport.

Does Geb? Does Asafa? Does Wariner?

ghost wrote:

Believe me, I think Cathal has paid dearly for his mistake, and will continue to do so, as long as all these people continue to bear grudges against him. A bit of compassion and understanding would go a long way.

.

Paid dearly? By having awards he won while cheating stripped away from him? By not being trusted in the sport after being a demonstrated cheater and liar? If paying dearly means suffering the consequences of your willful deception, here's hoping he continues to pay dearly for the rest of his running career.

But he can take consolation in the fact that he'll always have apologists such as yourself willing to excuse any behavior.

Maybe more people should be open like Vinny is about how ridiculous it is that Cathal is welcomed back with open arms. As referenced above the guy cheated people out of Irish vests, sponsorhip money, grant money and a lot more. And the guy was an a - hole doing it.

I think a lot of people thought he was a twat before the sub 28's and the 13.19.....the drugs and the arrogance just confirmed it....

Yes, it is sad for the people who feel they missed out on trips etc. (Vinny Mulvey, Seamus Power, et.al) but you could hardly say that Cathal has been "welcomed back with open arms" - quite the opposite - judging by the reactions here.

The man has not yet found a club and is running unattached.

It does not seem civilized to castigate him to the extent that this is happening. What about Chambers and others who took products - their treatment in no way matches that which is being doled out to Cathal.

Ghost in Korea

c.moulton (www.gifle.go.kr)

Apply now, new jobs starting April. 2008, good benefits and conditions.

reality is fun wrote:

Irish Times wrote:

Lombard has no place in our sport.

Does Geb? Does Asafa? Does Wariner?

Yeah, but Geb smiles. It's okay to be doped to the gills as long as you smile.

Cathal believes he can return to very respectable form in the 5000/10,000, and then move to the marathon. I think 14:00/29:00 and then a move to the marathon, where he might run between 2:13-2:16 would be a good chance for a second career as a marathon runner, and why not with an Irish vest, when all is said and done.

People comment that Cathal is very muscular for top class running, but his body fat content is low, and he moves very efficiently with low knee lift and good economy.

He has a decent future, if we can move on from the past and move to the future. His window of opportunity is in the next few years, and it would be a pity to miss out on that.

Ghost in Korea

c.moulton (www.gifle.go.kr) Apply now, new jobs in April, 2008. Good remuneration, conditions + benefits, with 8 weeks paid vacation per year + local holidays (10 weeks total, paid). Don't use an agent.