Holy $&*$ America Jonah Koech runs 3:31 to win Rabat Diamond League

You’re cherry picking as well though. Koech was a far superior 800m runner to Mills. He also had clear strength (11th at NCAA XC, top 2 at Mountain Regional 2x) vs Mills barely breaking 30 in 10Ks as far as overdistance.

Those 3:37s were in uncompetitive wins in Europe. Revisit that 2024 stint in Europe and you see vibes of Hoeys end of 2024 and Nuguse’s end of 2022.

He won 6 straight track races after 2024 Trials including four 800s and the two 1500s by over 3 seconds each time. His final race he lost a 1000 in 2:15 as Arop went after the World Record. It was really his only high-level field he faced, so you wonder if he was in 1:43/3:33 type shape but stuck running and romping in C-level meets in Europe.

It sounds like we will get a big profile on Koech upcoming, but this is really a guy who was going to break out in both 2022 and 2024 with the right opportunities. In 2022 he goes under 1:45 at USAs and looks good in the Eugene heats. Unfortunate DQ and he wins the NACAC Champs and the Ed Murphey Classic under 1:45 beating training partner Festus Lagat who ran 1:44.3/3:34.6 that year. That was all he ran after. If he had gotten the opportunities Euro athletes get I bet it’s a whole lot different.

Are you serious? He's a veteran, he speaks English, and he's as American as anyone maybe even more than you

Yes, a true can of worms.

To be fair, he's behind Rekrunner and a few others for outright, unbending, blanket apologism. But then again, he's taken far more seriously than Rekkie and the others, so perhaps more dangerous.

Off the top of my head - he rigorously defended Katir right up until his suspension. He still defends Manangoi (and his brother), and makes excuses for the fact that he hasn't run faster than 3:36 since his two year suspension (one of which was during the lockdowns, and he continued to train his butt off with potato Tim at Rongei during those two years). He frequently denies that Kenyans or Moroccans are more likely to dope. He gets 'excited' over Wanyonyi, despite his coach having more athletes busted than any other athletics coach in history. etc. etc.

You mean Mills had never ran anything longer than a mile before 2023 and ran a 13:18 on his 5000m debut, the next year winning silver behind Jakob (and giving him a good race) at the European Championships.

Mills improved 4 seconds at age 23-24 after switching camps. He had career threatening injuries and was out for two years after winning the 800m at the European U18 championships. He's a European 800m U18 champion and European senior 5000m silver medalist.

This is quite a bit different to a Kenyan American who is almost 29 and trains in Kenya, suddenly jumping from 3:37 to 3:31. If you can't see that, then yes, you rival Rekkie as the number one doping apologist here.

You're referring to two 10K road races in Telford in late 2021. You don't even know how seriously Mills was 'racing' these. Koech hadn't even broken four minutes in the mile despite numerous races (and still hasn't).

Even Koech's 800m progression is 'unusual' to say the least.

He improved 0.11s between the ages of 21 and 24, then returned after the pandemic to run 1:45.48 at age 26, taking another near second off his pb the following year at 27. If you factor in the likelihood he was wearing super shoes in 2021 and give that 0.5 seconds, then he improved 1/2 a second between 21 to 26 years, and 1.26s between 26 and 28.

How is that fair? I have never apologized for athletes who intentionally dope, or intentionally commit any rule violations, or are negligent in their obligations to anti-doping.

Note Katir and Manangoi were banned for whereabouts failures (and Katir for manipulating documents). Athletes should respect their commitments to be tested.

What does any of this have to do with alleged doping? How can you apologize for something that may not have even happened? I think you presume too much.

The first comparison I thought of was Andrew Wheating, who jumped from 3:37 to 3:30.90 in one race.

It looks like Koech doesn't run the 1500m often, being more an 800m runner. He wouldn't be the first 800m runner to hang with the leaders, and beat them in the sprint.

Well you can see your bias. Mills must’ve been jogging. Who cares about Koech’s mile times?
And then you say he improved .11s between the ages of 21 and 24 when the truth is the stagnation was between ages 19 and 22 while as a collegiate. His breakthrough came after he went pro, which again is not super-unusual and he got better each year he was healthy as pro. He ran the 1:45 at age 24 not 26. Just how are you this bad at simple arithmetic?
Here is Gaults article by the way: https://www.letsrun.com/news/2025/05/how-american-jonah-koech-sprung-one-of-the-biggest-upsets-in-diamond-league-history/

No I'm not - I didn't bring George Mills into this - you did. And what do their relative 800m times have to do with anything? If anything the 1500m is not longer in the era of the 800/1500m runner - it's now a 1500/3000/5000m runners domain - exactly what George Mills is. Who cares what Mills 10k PR is? Bizarre attempted connection there man.

Once again and for the second time - my input in this thread was simply pointing out that if Koech didn't have any American connection and say "lived in Spain" then went out and won a DL 1500m, ripping 6 seconds off his PR after "training in Kenya" the narrative would be very very different on this messageboard. And don't tell me I'm wrong here because I'm not.

I also don’t understand calling someone almost 29 when he is in fact 7 months from 29. What are you talking about, he’s closer to 27 than 28!

Well I pointed you to Brian Komen, who some people think doped, other people don’t. His story came out a bit more., but it wasn’t a Ramzi type reaction when he won in Doha - it was mostly who is this guy and why is he somewhat old.

Youre missing the boat on the 800m thing, which surprises me. Your era point is correct at the top of the 1500m pecking order, but Elliott Giles, Andreas Almgren, Mills, Georgia Hunter-Bell, Lewandowski, Koech etc. are all evidence that if you take a strength-based 800m guy/gal and train them for endurance they’re a factor in the 1,500 and some even translate above that. None of the above guys were world-beaters at 800, and they moved up to be more competitive. Most 1:43-1:44 guys nowadays who aren’t 46 type runners in the 400 surely could look at the 1500. In a 3:30-3:34 type race, watch out.

Classic Rekkie. Claims he's never defended a doper or even a "rule-breaker", then in the next sentence claims for the 115th time that we mustn't call Katir or Manangoi dopers.

Did Rekrunner forget he had logouted and in again here (and your next post about Koech's age!!)?

You're seriously comparing Koech's numerous b-level mile times to a couple of 10K training runs from Mills four years ago? BTW, Mills was almost just 21 then, and had last raced in July, so presumably he was coming back from injury. Just 2 or 3 years before that he had had two years wiped out from career threatening injuries, so I can imagine he would have been reluctant to go for the 10K road WR on his return.

So we can be reassured that Koech is not doping, despite coming from a country that has had 400+ doping busts and improving his 1500m pb by over 6 seconds at almost 29...I mean almost 27, because Mills ran a couple of slowish 10K training runs coming back from injury four years ago in his first ever races longer than one mile.

You're definitely not wrong, but to be fair, he could be a Kenyan Moroccan living in Spain, and both Rekkie and ThoughtsLeader would still defend him. At least they are consistent, lol!

I liked the interview with him. I almost turned it off right away, I was like I thought the guys said his English was decent but this might not be bearable, I’m glad I didn’t because it got better and he’s funny. I really want to see him make the team now, if I was him I guess I’d run the 8? Excited to see him run one soon and see what he can do.

Classic Coevett reading comprehension fails. WADA calls all rule violations "Doping", so if you feel the need to call Katir and Manangoi "dopers", be my guest. For example, WADA defines Katir's changing dates on travel documents and submitting them to the AIU as "Doping", as it violates the rule of "Tampering".

Note again that I don't apologize for, or otherwise justify, Katir's and Managoi's whereabouts failures or Katir's falsifying travel documents. Athletes should honor their commitments to be available for testing, and cooperate and be honest with anti-doping authorities.

Huh? Uh, no.

Defend him from what?

I would consistently point out accusations without basis, regardless of nationality or residence, but would never defend any intentional doping.