What happens to so many high school phenoms?

Someonewhoknows wrote:

Nope. Horter didn't really decline until COVID. Jha just got better as a sophomore as he was able to tolerate more training then than he ever had. Horter's issues are all COVID-related.

As defensive as you are of Horter, you must be mom, dad, or Horter himself. Whoever you are, you should be a politician because you're a lot like some of the politicians that we have now that are trying to rewrite history.

I'm only looking at the facts and data. Prior to covid, a lot of the guys that were in his HS graduating class that he was beating in high school in state and national meets, and in his freshman year of college, Jha included, started beating him in his 2nd year of college running and this is before covid. Obviously covid has played a part in recent performances but facts are facts and those guys were beating him and surpassing him before anyone even knew what covid was. This is not an attempt to disparage Horter and I believe the intent of this thread is to figure out why some guys that look invincible in high school become average. Nothing more and nothing less.

Your defensive nature is very telling.

The next level is full of talent. Think about it. In High School there is 1 state champ. At the next level there is 5 years worth of state champs from each of the 50 states plus international runners that are usually even better.

That’s 300 to 350 runners at or close to the same level. Then add in another 50 to 100 runners that are late bloomers. You’re looking at 400 to 450 very talented runners that the former standout has to complete against.

Nothing “happens”. The competition is just way tougher. It’s the same in every sport.

plumb pudding wrote:

The next level is full of talent. Think about it. In High School there is 1 state champ. At the next level there is 5 years worth of state champs from each of the 50 states plus international runners that are usually even better.

That’s 300 to 350 runners at or close to the same level. Then add in another 50 to 100 runners that are late bloomers. You’re looking at 400 to 450 very talented runners that the former standout has to complete against.

Nothing “happens”. The competition is just way tougher. It’s the same in every sport.

I believe OP is referring to youth runners that set national or even world records then disappear. So at a young age they were the best. But I still think your argument carries weight. It's one thing to break "age" records when you have little to no competition. I believe in most cases track and field athletes break records when pressure is minimal and competition is manageable. So many of these kids run comfortable, relaxes races and have incredible performances. But once they go to the next level where everybody is nearly as talented and every race is a competition the pressure mounts and it's incredibly difficult to perform at your best when you are stressed.

Most talented kids crumble at the first sign of competition because they likely have never had competition at any level prior.

Talented kids do not crumble at the first sign of competition. They'll race just as hard as they did in HS, but they won't be winning races. Some have already physically matured and/or will be hindered by injuries.

Typing something doesn't make it true. Can you name a HS phenom that meets your profile?

The answer is honestly simple.

The top dogs in HS go to college, and everyone they're now competing against were all the top dogs at their respective high schools. Competition gets tougher.

When you go off to college you typically leave the safety nest of your parents' home, and even in the relatively sheltered environment of a college dorm setting you're still on your own having to make a lot of everyday decisions on your own, including the important to your recovery decisions on what to eat.

Basically, it gets harder after HS. Phenoms still have a lot of hurdles to clear before they have a chance at being the best in the world. The progression is rarely if ever linear.

Breakfast In Bed wrote:

The answer is honestly simple.

The top dogs in HS go to college, and everyone they're now competing against were all the top dogs at their respective high schools. Competition gets tougher.

When you go off to college you typically leave the safety nest of your parents' home, and even in the relatively sheltered environment of a college dorm setting you're still on your own having to make a lot of everyday decisions on your own, including the important to your recovery decisions on what to eat.

Basically, it gets harder after HS. Phenoms still have a lot of hurdles to clear before they have a chance at being the best in the world. The progression is rarely if ever linear.

This is it ^^^. Every young phenom is a big fish in a small pond. Nothing wrong with it.

I was not a phenom, but I set all my high school records - still standing today - and won several state championships.

At college, I arrived and immediately started running with guys who were from other countries, and had just run in the Olympics. On "workout" days, they essentially killed me. Other days, they didn't show up, and I'd run with others like me, who were busy trying to impress one-another.

A coach never asked me about my background. Never asked how I was doing. Never said a word to me, in fact. I simply showed up, and ran.

Three years in, when I was still improving incrementally, the Olympians had moved on, and we had a new crop of fast guys. Things never changed. The injury bug hit me, I was off a year, I came back on my own, the coach CALLED ME to see if I'd turn up for my final XC season, but I had a job, and I could see that we didn't have enough guys to make it to NCAAs, so I turned him down. By track season I'd already checked out and was running marathons.

plumb pudding wrote:

The next level is full of talent. Think about it. In High School there is 1 state champ. At the next level there is 5 years worth of state champs from each of the 50 states plus international runners that are usually even better.

That’s 300 to 350 runners at or close to the same level. Then add in another 50 to 100 runners that are late bloomers. You’re looking at 400 to 450 very talented runners that the former standout has to complete against.

Nothing “happens”. The competition is just way tougher. It’s the same in every sport.

The first "club" race of my redshirt freshman year I looked down the row at the starting line and recognized the guy who had won state, in my state, four years earlier, when I was a high school freshman.

Now, he was a college senior, running club just like me. I beat him. And that opened my eyes a little bit.

This is the “moment” 99.99% of those who’ve ever run competitively have had at some point. Maybe it happens in hs, or maybe college for the talented 1%, or maybe after college for the really special talents with luck to avoid injury. Enjoy the ride for as long as it lasts, move on to focus on other things when it’s time. Knowing the right moment is a blessing.

Doesn't this happen with professionals ? Most top tier runners perform well in circuit meets or trials but tighten up in the biggest races. So why wouldn't that be the same for kids?

Hell i can even think of my sister's kid who was the best soccer player on her u7 team then when she was moved up to play with u8s it was like she didn't know how to play. Even though she was still clearly one of the best she said she was afraid.

The answer is because the age of "10th graders" typically ranges from 14-16.

As anyone knows, there can be a huge maturity level gap physically at this age range.

Id guess most, if not all, HS sophomore records are held by 16 year olds.

SDSU Aztec wrote:

Does this former 25mpw HS runner competing in college really exist? If he was that unmotivated in HS, why would he want to compete in college?

The fastest guy on my team when I was in college probably was doing 25 mpw in high school. He said that he would skip practice most days and when he did show up, he would just go out a mile, go into a fast food restaurant and hang out, eventually splash some water on himself, and then run back to school, making it look like he did a full run.

In HS this kid was by far the best in his area and won state titles. Evidently, he didn't see a need to try harder since he was already the best. But once he got to college, he realized if he wanted to win he would have to start training a lot harder and clean up his personal life. The guy competed at XC and track nationals multiple times in college, so the jump in dedication payed off.

where are your facts, bruh? wrote:

Doesn't this happen with professionals ? Most top tier runners perform well in circuit meets or trials but tighten up in the biggest races. So why wouldn't that be the same for kids?

Hell i can even think of my sister's kid who was the best soccer player on her u7 team then when she was moved up to play with u8s it was like she didn't know how to play. Even though she was still clearly one of the best she said she was afraid.

I don't believe at all that it happens with professionals. The ones that lose in big races do so because they're less talented than the top runners and not because they tighten up.

You're using an 8-year old soccer player as an example?

Sorry, but no way. Going for a 6-8 mile overdistance run is remarkably easy. In what state could a guy when titles off of a 1-mile run to MacDonalds? I would be surprised if a guy that pathologically lazy could even graduate from HS.