This thread was deleted by a volunteer moderator. I certainly don't want a thread this big deleted so I've restored. THat being said, this thread has served it's purpose. I've closed it to new posts.
We have a new 2024 vaccine thread here. New people don't need to try to wade through 20,000 posts to figure out what is going on.
I am not sold that the bivalent booster is that much better than an original strain booster.
But any booster is better than no booster!
I enjoy that the discourse has shifted to "this updated booster may not be as effective as we hoped" away from "boosting is useless! Vax are mad! I am dumb!"
This is a good point. The critics have silently accepted that boosting is effective and worthwhile. Notice the tone shift. The window moves another jump toward the pro-vax side of things. Love to see it.
Wrong, as always. By far most people here didn't need * any * rona shots, let alone your $$ grab "booster."
Some got the shots anyway because of coercion, misplaced faith and the "saving.grandma" fraud. (Italian grandma never masked and took a cruise the first chance she got.)
Baby - toddler vax rate is 8.9% -- booster rate for % of older kids barely existent in most "cases."
Keep pimping your lies tho, every post is another bit of evidence of your fraud.
"Need" for boosters of any semi-healthy person who has rad any form of rona = ZERO.
This is a good point. The critics have silently accepted that boosting is effective and worthwhile. Notice the tone shift. The window moves another jump toward the pro-vax side of things. Love to see it.
Wrong, as always. By far most people here didn't need * any * rona shots, let alone your $ grab "booster."
Some got the shots anyway because of coercion, misplaced faith and the "saving.grandma" fraud. (Italian grandma never masked and took a cruise the first chance she got.)
Baby - toddler vax rate is 8.9% -- booster rate for % of older kids barely existent in most "cases."
Keep pimping your lies tho, every post is another bit of evidence of your fraud.
"Need" for boosters of any semi-healthy person who has rad any form of rona = ZERO.
Not a single word of useful contribution in your entire post. Please do better.
Pfizer quadrupling the price of the “updated” vax to $130 per dose? Talk about grift.
I’m in that super high risk over 50 crowd and somehow have managed to fight off Delta & whatever sub-lineage of Omicron I had with some very basic tools but zero vaccines. Neither were awful, but Omicron LGBTQRSTUV was extremely mild, because my body has produced lots of antibodies (& B cells & T cells) recognizing several viral antigens, including the nucleocapsid antigen, not just narrowly trained on the spike. But don’t try this at home…
1) Epic comedy with LGBT + Omicron mashup... that's excellent boomer humor.
2) You've spouting the antigenic diversity line for over a year no? Yet prior infection is worse (or at least no better) than double dose vaccine in preventing illness and demonstrably worse at preventing death... seems like facts =/= feelings for old Covidiocy...
3) Happy to have a thread about prescription drug prices... drugs and drug discovery are no where near as profitable as you think they are.
As someone who’s worked as an assay developer in the molecular biology field for years, I agree that the profitability of widely distributed tests or drugs is often widely misconstrued.
However, it’s laughably ridiculous that you would conflate the abnormally heavy subsidization of these vaccines with the burden of cost that a company normally bears in developing a drug. Are you just being lazy and hoping that no one notices, or are you really that stupid to suggest that the mRNA vaccines belong in a normal discussion on drugs and drug discovery? C’mon guy.
Wrong, as always. By far most people here didn't need * any * rona shots, let alone your $ grab "booster."
Some got the shots anyway because of coercion, misplaced faith and the "saving.grandma" fraud. (Italian grandma never masked and took a cruise the first chance she got.)
Baby - toddler vax rate is 8.9% -- booster rate for % of older kids barely existent in most "cases."
Keep pimping your lies tho, every post is another bit of evidence of your fraud.
"Need" for boosters of any semi-healthy person who has rad any form of rona = ZERO.
Not a single word of useful contribution in your entire post. Please do better.
Is that all you got to respond to him?
You lost. Just go away and save yourself further embarrassment.
1) Epic comedy with LGBT + Omicron mashup... that's excellent boomer humor.
2) You've spouting the antigenic diversity line for over a year no? Yet prior infection is worse (or at least no better) than double dose vaccine in preventing illness and demonstrably worse at preventing death... seems like facts =/= feelings for old Covidiocy...
3) Happy to have a thread about prescription drug prices... drugs and drug discovery are no where near as profitable as you think they are.
As someone who’s worked as an assay developer in the molecular biology field for years, I agree that the profitability of widely distributed tests or drugs is often widely misconstrued.
However, it’s laughably ridiculous that you would conflate the abnormally heavy subsidization of these vaccines with the burden of cost that a company normally bears in developing a drug. Are you just being lazy and hoping that no one notices, or are you really that stupid to suggest that the mRNA vaccines belong in a normal discussion on drugs and drug discovery? C’mon guy.
Why are the markets so down on MRNA then? mRNA vaccines have been worked on for 15+ years with billions spent before the heavy subsidy. A one-off pandemic product doesn’t make a stable money stream. I am confused what your point it? The government should keep subsidizing COVID vaccines (almost all vaccines are?) MRNA vaccines are inherently profitable moving forward? I don’t get it.
Megyn Kelly is joined by Robert F. Kennedy, Jr., author of "A Letter to Liberals," to talk about the truth about how many lives COVID vaccines saved and lost...
And Doctors may be punished in California.10 vaccine doses for every EU citizenMEP Mr. Cristian Terheshttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=beEfo7c_Weg&t=23sUrsula...
Not a single word of useful contribution in your entire post. Please do better.
Is that all you got to respond to him?
You lost. Just go away and save yourself further embarrassment.
That which is asserted without evidence can be dismissed as such.
When you want to bring facts and data -- I invite it. When you want to just reply to me under different names because you're butthurt... well, I can handle that too.
This is a good point. The critics have silently accepted that boosting is effective and worthwhile. Notice the tone shift. The window moves another jump toward the pro-vax side of things. Love to see it.
Wrong, as always. By far most people here didn't need * any * rona shots, let alone your $ grab "booster."
Some got the shots anyway because of coercion, misplaced faith and the "saving.grandma" fraud. (Italian grandma never masked and took a cruise the first chance she got.)
Baby - toddler vax rate is 8.9% -- booster rate for % of older kids barely existent in most "cases."
Keep pimping your lies tho, every post is another bit of evidence of your fraud.
"Need" for boosters of any semi-healthy person who has rad any form of rona = ZERO.
There are 300k (and climbing) dead Americans who sure could have used a 'rona shot.' Instead, they listened to the propaganda that you amplify and are now dead. Feels good?
1) Epic comedy with LGBT + Omicron mashup... that's excellent boomer humor.
2) You've spouting the antigenic diversity line for over a year no? Yet prior infection is worse (or at least no better) than double dose vaccine in preventing illness and demonstrably worse at preventing death... seems like facts =/= feelings for old Covidiocy...
3) Happy to have a thread about prescription drug prices... drugs and drug discovery are no where near as profitable as you think they are.
As someone who’s worked as an assay developer in the molecular biology field for years, I agree that the profitability of widely distributed tests or drugs is often widely misconstrued.
However, it’s laughably ridiculous that you would conflate the abnormally heavy subsidization of these vaccines with the burden of cost that a company normally bears in developing a drug. Are you just being lazy and hoping that no one notices, or are you really that stupid to suggest that the mRNA vaccines belong in a normal discussion on drugs and drug discovery? C’mon guy.
The financials of vaccine programs have always put them in a distinct class in (bio)pharma. Before COVID, vaccine research was abysmally slow because the profit potential was just not there (for many reasons).
I find it hard to argue that the injection of $$$ into vaccine R&D pipelines has been anything but a tremendous positive for the world and the companies willing to bet on COVID vaccines should be handsomely rewarded.
This NBER paper estimates around $55,000 spent on vaccines per life saved. Given that we rate 1 quality-adjusted life year at 100k under the most conservative metrics -- we see easily 10:1 payoffs from the vaccine (even assuming the average life saved only had 5 more years to go. Obviously wrong especially in the Delta wave).
Probably among the most cost effect public health interventions of the last 50 years. The companies have earned these profits.
And before the protests of “they would have died in a yearor less” come, i will point out that if that were true then we would not be seeing anything close to the excess deaths numbers that we have seen in 2021 and 22
The thing is, you’re a scientist right? Sort of? If you really want to eradicate Covid, we need a nasal vaccine that elicits the very primitive, secretory IgA response in the mucosa. Not just more jabs in the arm that eventually elicit negative efficacy. Can you really not see this? This whack-a-mole approach w one highly conserved antigen, no matter how good it is, is just madness.
Remove the unsubstantiated nonsense about 'negative efficacy' and I mostly agree. MRNA vaccines were amazing for reducing the risk of severe disease by a ton -- and continued boosting should be recommended for high risk populations, but there is clearly a window here to actually fund, research, and develop nasal vaccines for coronaviruses that would pay dividends far beyond just this pandemic. Early evidence suggests they have enormous potential.
Well it’s not unsubstantiated nonsense, but replace NE with immunological imprinting. Another very hard thing to assess but it is absolutely occurring. This bivalent booster is ill conceived, not tested in humans, and a massive pharma grift because the data simply don’t support it. Notwithstanding all the other reasonable platitudes about big pharma and vaccines, this is why people are cynical. Justifiably so.
The vax mob mafia will, of course, claim that the Covid-19 urban/rural death rate difference did a 180 degree reversal in 2021 because of the mRNA goop uptake.
"Age-adjusted COVID-19 death rates were highest in the most urban areas."
"In 2020, the age-adjusted death rate for COVID-19 was highest in the most urban areas (large central metropolitan) (97.7 per 100,000), which was 30% higher than in medium metropolitan areas (75.0), where the rate was the lowest."
As someone who’s worked as an assay developer in the molecular biology field for years, I agree that the profitability of widely distributed tests or drugs is often widely misconstrued.
However, it’s laughably ridiculous that you would conflate the abnormally heavy subsidization of these vaccines with the burden of cost that a company normally bears in developing a drug. Are you just being lazy and hoping that no one notices, or are you really that stupid to suggest that the mRNA vaccines belong in a normal discussion on drugs and drug discovery? C’mon guy.
The financials of vaccine programs have always put them in a distinct class in (bio)pharma. Before COVID, vaccine research was abysmally slow because the profit potential was just not there (for many reasons).
I find it hard to argue that the injection of $ into vaccine R&D pipelines has been anything but a tremendous positive for the world and the companies willing to bet on COVID vaccines should be handsomely rewarded.
This NBER paper estimates around $55,000 spent on vaccines per life saved. Given that we rate 1 quality-adjusted life year at 100k under the most conservative metrics -- we see easily 10:1 payoffs from the vaccine (even assuming the average life saved only had 5 more years to go. Obviously wrong especially in the Delta wave).
Probably among the most cost effect public health interventions of the last 50 years. The companies have earned these profits.
When did I say that the vaccines weren’t a good return on the public’s (taxpayer’s) investment? Did not say or imply that.
I’m simply responding to the extremely misleading, perhaps intentionally deceiving statement 2600 bro made that “drugs and drug discovery are nowhere near as profitable as you think they are” as if the economics of classical pharmaceutical R&D investment apply in this situation—they don’t. 2600 bro, don’t think that typing such a rebuttal makes people think you understand the industry and therefore are credible; if anything, it demonstrates your ignorance.
The financials of vaccine programs have always put them in a distinct class in (bio)pharma. Before COVID, vaccine research was abysmally slow because the profit potential was just not there (for many reasons).
I find it hard to argue that the injection of $ into vaccine R&D pipelines has been anything but a tremendous positive for the world and the companies willing to bet on COVID vaccines should be handsomely rewarded.
This NBER paper estimates around $55,000 spent on vaccines per life saved. Given that we rate 1 quality-adjusted life year at 100k under the most conservative metrics -- we see easily 10:1 payoffs from the vaccine (even assuming the average life saved only had 5 more years to go. Obviously wrong especially in the Delta wave).
Probably among the most cost effect public health interventions of the last 50 years. The companies have earned these profits.
When did I say that the vaccines weren’t a good return on the public’s (taxpayer’s) investment? Did not say or imply that.
I’m simply responding to the extremely misleading, perhaps intentionally deceiving statement 2600 bro made that “drugs and drug discovery are nowhere near as profitable as you think they are” as if the economics of classical pharmaceutical R&D investment apply in this situation—they don’t. 2600 bro, don’t think that typing such a rebuttal makes people think you understand the industry and therefore are credible; if anything, it demonstrates your ignorance.
?? This global public investment and a good chunk demand has waned for the COVID vaccines, mRNA vax production and R&D is not cheap, therefore prices must go up. If they want to keep these programs going they can’t just sell the vaccines at cost to governments anymore. Again I don’t really get your argument. Pharma and therapeutic development is a risky business you have to grab money where you can to fund future efforts.
Professor Norman Fenton has obtained contract details for the EU member, Slovenia. It protects Pfizer from any claim of adverse effects (Emergency Use protocols) whilst the Slovenian government exposes Slovenia’s people to al...
A renowned physician and researcher who was respected at one time now finds himself being shunned and humiliated because he dared to challenge the global elitist narrative about COVID-19 vaccines. Dr. Spiro Pantazatos, a clin...
Dr. Spiro Pantazatos, a clinical neurobiologist and researcher at Columbia University who is now on leave, was a true believer in the vaccines prior to their release, vowing to remain on self-imposed lockdown until they were available to the public. But then he did what researchers are supposed to do: He started looking at data once the shots became widely available, and he found a disturbing connection between higher mortality and vaccinated people.
Notes the Rair Foundation: “While life insurance companies began screaming from the rooftops in the late spring of 2022, Dr. Pantazatos was well ahead of the game, producing a paper that demonstrated this link in October 2021. But nobody wanted to read his findings, and no medical journal would publish the paper.”
He told Dr. Drew Pinsky during a recent podcast: “It was diplomatically rejected by many editors at medical journals.”
In other words, the fix is in, and Western globalist elitists are going to continue pushing this vaccine regardless of its adverse health effects, for some reason.
Pantazatos noted that he did not have to look hard for the data to come up with his conclusions, because all of it was/is publicly available. “The number of deaths in each state correlated with the number of vaccinations administered in the previous month,” he said.
