This thread was deleted by a volunteer moderator. I certainly don't want a thread this big deleted so I've restored. THat being said, this thread has served it's purpose. I've closed it to new posts.
We have a new 2024 vaccine thread here. New people don't need to try to wade through 20,000 posts to figure out what is going on.
First it was not being vaccinated, then not being boosted, now not being updated. Gee, you sure about that Mr. Prez?
As I’ve been saying,
“Boosting with a new bivalent mRNA vaccine targeting both BA.4/BA.5 and an ancestral SARS-CoV-2 strain did not elicit discernibly superior virus-neutralizing antibody responses compared to boosting with an original monovalent vaccine. These findings may be indicative of immunological imprinting, although follow-up studies are needed to determine if the antibody responses will deviate in time, including the impact of a second bivalent booster.”
First it was not being vaccinated, then not being boosted, now not being updated. Gee, you sure about that Mr. Prez?
As I’ve been saying,
“Boosting with a new bivalent mRNA vaccine targeting both BA.4/BA.5 and an ancestral SARS-CoV-2 strain did not elicit discernibly superior virus-neutralizing antibody responses compared to boosting with an original monovalent vaccine. These findings may be indicative of immunological imprinting, although follow-up studies are needed to determine if the antibody responses will deviate in time, including the impact of a second bivalent booster.”
I am not sold that the bivalent booster is that much better than an original strain booster.
But any booster is better than no booster!
I enjoy that the discourse has shifted to "this updated booster may not be as effective as we hoped" away from "boosting is useless! Vax are mad! I am dumb!"
First it was not being vaccinated, then not being boosted, now not being updated. Gee, you sure about that Mr. Prez?
As I’ve been saying,
“Boosting with a new bivalent mRNA vaccine targeting both BA.4/BA.5 and an ancestral SARS-CoV-2 strain did not elicit discernibly superior virus-neutralizing antibody responses compared to boosting with an original monovalent vaccine. These findings may be indicative of immunological imprinting, although follow-up studies are needed to determine if the antibody responses will deviate in time, including the impact of a second bivalent booster.”
Super pro-mRNA vax proponent Paul Offit of the former FDA advisory committee sure isn’t on board with the bivalent booster. Wonder why.
It didn't do much for Walensky. The Omicron variant was more likely to infect vaccinated individuals than unvaccinated individuals. Many have suggested this was due to enhancement. Including mRNA particles from Omicron with the mRNA particles from the original Wuhan strain could be self-defeating.
Pfizer quadrupling the price of the “updated” vax to $130 per dose? Talk about grift.
I’m in that super high risk over 50 crowd and somehow have managed to fight off Delta & whatever sub-lineage of Omicron I had with some very basic tools but zero vaccines. Neither were awful, but Omicron LGBTQRSTUV was extremely mild, because my body has produced lots of antibodies (& B cells & T cells) recognizing several viral antigens, including the nucleocapsid antigen, not just narrowly trained on the spike. But don’t try this at home…
Pfizer quadrupling the price of the “updated” vax to $130 per dose? Talk about grift.
I’m in that super high risk over 50 crowd and somehow have managed to fight off Delta & whatever sub-lineage of Omicron I had with some very basic tools but zero vaccines. Neither were awful, but Omicron LGBTQRSTUV was extremely mild, because my body has produced lots of antibodies (& B cells & T cells) recognizing several viral antigens, including the nucleocapsid antigen, not just narrowly trained on the spike. But don’t try this at home…
1) Epic comedy with LGBT + Omicron mashup... that's excellent boomer humor.
2) You've spouting the antigenic diversity line for over a year no? Yet prior infection is worse (or at least no better) than double dose vaccine in preventing illness and demonstrably worse at preventing death... seems like facts =/= feelings for old Covidiocy...
3) Happy to have a thread about prescription drug prices... drugs and drug discovery are no where near as profitable as you think they are.
First it was not being vaccinated, then not being boosted, now not being updated. Gee, you sure about that Mr. Prez?
As I’ve been saying,
“Boosting with a new bivalent mRNA vaccine targeting both BA.4/BA.5 and an ancestral SARS-CoV-2 strain did not elicit discernibly superior virus-neutralizing antibody responses compared to boosting with an original monovalent vaccine. These findings may be indicative of immunological imprinting, although follow-up studies are needed to determine if the antibody responses will deviate in time, including the impact of a second bivalent booster.”
Super pro-mRNA vax proponent Paul Offit of the former FDA advisory committee sure isn’t on board with the bivalent booster. Wonder why.
It didn't do much for Walensky. The Omicron variant was more likely to infect vaccinated individuals than unvaccinated individuals. Many have suggested this was due to enhancement. Including mRNA particles from Omicron with the mRNA particles from the original Wuhan strain could be self-defeating.
Didn’t do much for my mother either. She got her fourth dose and now has her first symptomatic, very bad case of Covid. But I actually think it’s the Paxlovid that’s making her feel awful.
Pfizer quadrupling the price of the “updated” vax to $130 per dose? Talk about grift.
I’m in that super high risk over 50 crowd and somehow have managed to fight off Delta & whatever sub-lineage of Omicron I had with some very basic tools but zero vaccines. Neither were awful, but Omicron LGBTQRSTUV was extremely mild, because my body has produced lots of antibodies (& B cells & T cells) recognizing several viral antigens, including the nucleocapsid antigen, not just narrowly trained on the spike. But don’t try this at home…
1) Epic comedy with LGBT + Omicron mashup... that's excellent boomer humor.
2) You've spouting the antigenic diversity line for over a year no? Yet prior infection is worse (or at least no better) than double dose vaccine in preventing illness and demonstrably worse at preventing death... seems like facts =/= feelings for old Covidiocy...
3) Happy to have a thread about prescription drug prices... drugs and drug discovery are no where near as profitable as you think they are.
1) Thanks. Just joking around. I’m not a boomer bro. Check your years.
2) Yep, and I’m sticking with it. Nothing I’ve seen that is extremely robust has convinced me that the vaccines are better at thwarting Covid than natural immunity, particularly for a sub-category such as myself with no comorbidities.
3) No, I get it. I’ve worked where you are. 2/3rds of drug company profits alone are used for taxes or pushed back into R&D to elicit maybe one amazing drug in the pipeline. But MRNA and PFE have gotten very rich. People accusing others of “grift” would do well to look at just HOW profitable these drugs have been, especially when the government “has their back.”
3) No, I get it. I’ve worked where you are. 2/3rds of drug company profits alone are used for taxes or pushed back into R&D to elicit maybe one amazing drug in the pipeline. But MRNA and PFE have gotten very rich. People accusing others of “grift” would do well to look at just HOW profitable these drugs have been, especially when the government “has their back.”
I mean, we are talking about a new booster that doesn’t work better than the old booster, could likely be worse for myriad reasons, and has no really good data in humans supporting it. That’s a grift if I’ve ever seen one.
The thing is, you’re a scientist right? Sort of? If you really want to eradicate Covid, we need a nasal vaccine that elicits the very primitive, secretory IgA response in the mucosa. Not just more jabs in the arm that eventually elicit negative efficacy. Can you really not see this? This whack-a-mole approach w one highly conserved antigen, no matter how good it is, is just madness.
And, by the way, we are not going to eradicate it…
it’s a massive grift now. Sad
It was always a Hoax. If only it was about grift, mere greed, No this is intentional genocide, planned depopulation, along with economic destruction and loss of civil liberties, for sinister 2030 goals with mankind enslaved with "vaccine" passports linked to CBDCs, "you will own nothing and be happy."
United Kingdom – A Suffolk radio dj died of a suspected heart attack while presenting his morning show on Monday. Tim Gough, 55, died while broadcasting from his home studio. No problems with booster shots (Pfizer and Moderna...
No problems with booster shots (Pfizer and Moderna) in our family and immediate friends, aside from the odd slightly sore arm for 36 hours. I say get your booster done asap, and enjoy your cheese and wine… I mean talking about work whilst at work and following the rules. — Tim Gough (@Tim_Gough) December 21, 2021
A grieving mother from Texas is searching for answers and justice following the sudden death of her 18-year-old daughter who died in her sleep. On September 8, 18-year-old Kayla Rose Lumpkins went to sleep and never woke up....
I am not sold that the bivalent booster is that much better than an original strain booster.
But any booster is better than no booster!
I enjoy that the discourse has shifted to "this updated booster may not be as effective as we hoped" away from "boosting is useless! Vax are mad! I am dumb!"
This is a good point. The critics have silently accepted that boosting is effective and worthwhile. Notice the tone shift. The window moves another jump toward the pro-vax side of things. Love to see it.
1) Thanks. Just joking around. I’m not a boomer bro. Check your years.
2) Yep, and I’m sticking with it. Nothing I’ve seen that is extremely robust has convinced me that the vaccines are better at thwarting Covid than natural immunity, particularly for a sub-category such as myself with no comorbidities.
3) No, I get it. I’ve worked where you are. 2/3rds of drug company profits alone are used for taxes or pushed back into R&D to elicit maybe one amazing drug in the pipeline. But MRNA and PFE have gotten very rich. People accusing others of “grift” would do well to look at just HOW profitable these drugs have been, especially when the government “has their back.”
1) You are free to believe things with zero evidence because they confirm your priors. Nobody can stop that.
2) On a QALY-adjusted basis $130 for a covid vax is excellent value. Could they be cheaper? Sure. I'm glad we don't live in communist Russia feel free to chalk this one up to the 'evils' of capitalism and I'll allow it.
The thing is, you’re a scientist right? Sort of? If you really want to eradicate Covid, we need a nasal vaccine that elicits the very primitive, secretory IgA response in the mucosa. Not just more jabs in the arm that eventually elicit negative efficacy. Can you really not see this? This whack-a-mole approach w one highly conserved antigen, no matter how good it is, is just madness.
Remove the unsubstantiated nonsense about 'negative efficacy' and I mostly agree. MRNA vaccines were amazing for reducing the risk of severe disease by a ton -- and continued boosting should be recommended for high risk populations, but there is clearly a window here to actually fund, research, and develop nasal vaccines for coronaviruses that would pay dividends far beyond just this pandemic. Early evidence suggests they have enormous potential.
Tens of millions of US citizens were given a “COVID-19 decree violation” score as a result of a data harvesting program conducted during the first lockdown by voter analytics firm PredictWise.
“These Covid-19 decree violation scores were calculated by analyzing nearly two billion global positioning system (GPS) pings to get “real-time, ultra-granular locations patterns.” People who were “on the go more often than their neighbors” were given a high Covid-19 decree violation score while those who mostly or always stayed at home were given a low Covid-19 decree violation score,” writes Reclaim the Net’s Tom Parker.
1) Epic comedy with LGBT + Omicron mashup... that's excellent boomer humor.
2) You've spouting the antigenic diversity line for over a year no? Yet prior infection is worse (or at least no better) than double dose vaccine in preventing illness and demonstrably worse at preventing death... seems like facts =/= feelings for old Covidiocy...
3) Happy to have a thread about prescription drug prices... drugs and drug discovery are no where near as profitable as you think they are.
1) Thanks. Just joking around. I’m not a boomer bro. Check your years.
2) Yep, and I’m sticking with it. Nothing I’ve seen that is extremely robust has convinced me that the vaccines are better at thwarting Covid than natural immunity, particularly for a sub-category such as myself with no comorbidities.
3) No, I get it. I’ve worked where you are. 2/3rds of drug company profits alone are used for taxes or pushed back into R&D to elicit maybe one amazing drug in the pipeline. But MRNA and PFE have gotten very rich. People accusing others of “grift” would do well to look at just HOW profitable these drugs have been, especially when the government “has their back.”
3) I don’t think most people would say MRNA is in an awesome position right now. Vaccines are not a big money maker long term especially without without public/NGO funds. I’m not too bent out of shape about the pricing in a 1st world country.
2) Even if I agreed that infection driven was just as good as vaccination - doesn’t the fact we 1M+ dead from COVID tilt the needle toward vaccination still? You’d have to argue that infection driven immunity is MUCH better at preventing deaths or the vaccines are just as harmful as COVID… both a very uphill battle even for the most blindly dogmatic.
