From age 20 to up to age 22, Elliott lost around 10 times, at 800m/880y, 1000m, 2 Miles. This was the quote. Any comment to this? That he has not lost at 1500m/Mile as a senior is well known and was even a point in this thread before. Why do you bring it again, Dumb?
And what is your point about Elliott's WRs, Dumb? This also is well known and was discussed earlier.
He has lost around 10 times from age 20 up to age 22 while not racing internationally at all at age 21 - any comment to this?
Yes. You are an idiot. Elliott did not lose as many times as you claim as he very rarely ran his non specialist distances. But since you make that claim, list the races he lost.
Yes, stating facts which you don't like means stupidity for you. That's well known, Dumbstrong.
Elliotth has lost many races during his prime 1960 - 1962.
Against Albie Thomas in the 2 Miles.
Against Brian Hewson, Mike Rawson, Tony Blue (many times), Peter Snell, George Hack, Ron Delany and some more in the 800m/880y (AAA, regional champs...)
Against lesser knowns in the 1000m.
Jakob Ingebrigtsen definitely so far is the best at age 22 from 1500m to 5k. Who is just close to him? For me that's a solid basis to have a shot at his very umbigious goal as to become the GOAT in distance running. Extremely hard to be successful in this, but he has some serious chance.
Just over 4 years before Elliott's world mile record no one had run under 4 minutes. In 1958 he ran 3:54. In the same span the 1500 record was in the low 3:40's. Elliott ran 3:36, which he later reduced to 3:35. Jakob has been unable to beat world marks for those distances set a quarter of a century ago - even with the best drugs available today. As a 1500 specialist he isn't in the same class as Elliott and will never be the GOAT.
More than 15 athletes have run sub 4 before Elliott's WR.
Elliott improved the 1500mk/Mile WRs by big margins. Within a few years his record were also bettered by big margins.
Definitely, in the 1500m Ingebrigtsen most lekely will never become GOAT (almost impossible to better El Guerrouj's achievements). But nobody has said this. You are always arguing against nobody here.
The question is: will he become GOAT distance runner? Did you get this now - after it was told you maybe 20 times?
Also very hard to achieve, but possible. Golds and WR in the 5000m and 10000m would be enough for me.
Yes. You are an idiot. Elliott did not lose as many times as you claim as he very rarely ran his non specialist distances. But since you make that claim, list the races he lost.
Yes, stating facts which you don't like means stupidity for you. That's well known, Dumbstrong.
Elliotth has lost many races during his prime 1960 - 1962.
Against Albie Thomas in the 2 Miles.
Against Brian Hewson, Mike Rawson, Tony Blue (many times), Peter Snell, George Hack, Ron Delany and some more in the 800m/880y (AAA, regional champs...)
Against lesser knowns in the 1000m.
Jakob Ingebrigtsen definitely so far is the best at age 22 from 1500m to 5k. Who is just close to him? For me that's a solid basis to have a shot at his very umbigious goal as to become the GOAT in distance running. Extremely hard to be successful in this, but he has some serious chance.
BS. His prime was 1958-60, not 1960-62. You are an ignoramus. He is a documented to have lost only 3 races at a senior level by the end of 1958 - a 440, 880 and a 2 mile. None of them was his specialist distances. How many 440's and 880's is Jakob going to win? Elliott said his career basically ended after the Rome Olympics in 1960. He had achieved everything he'd wanted and needed to find a career to support a family and he only ran recreationally after the Olympics. From the ill-informed drivel you spout you were obviously not around any time near his era.
Just over 4 years before Elliott's world mile record no one had run under 4 minutes. In 1958 he ran 3:54. In the same span the 1500 record was in the low 3:40's. Elliott ran 3:36, which he later reduced to 3:35. Jakob has been unable to beat world marks for those distances set a quarter of a century ago - even with the best drugs available today. As a 1500 specialist he isn't in the same class as Elliott and will never be the GOAT.
More than 15 athletes have run sub 4 before Elliott's WR.
Elliott improved the 1500mk/Mile WRs by big margins. Within a few years his record were also bettered by big margins.
Definitely, in the 1500m Ingebrigtsen most lekely will never become GOAT (almost impossible to better El Guerrouj's achievements). But nobody has said this. You are always arguing against nobody here.
The question is: will he become GOAT distance runner? Did you get this now - after it was told you maybe 20 times?
Also very hard to achieve, but possible. Golds and WR in the 5000m and 10000m would be enough for me.
More fabrications. You are a tiresome and ignorant jerk. You are completely unable to recognise the level of Elliott's achievements in his era and your figures are your usual fallacious and misleading bs.
The fact that cannot be altered is that as a 1500/mile specialist Jakob will never match the relative level of Elliott's career achievements - which rules out Jakob's aspiration to become the GOAT, which is the subject of the thread, not your fatuous claims about where he ranks as a "1500-5k runner at age 22". Those aren't the criteria Jakob is using - because they are irrelevant to whether he becomes the GOAT.
Furthermore, Jakob hasn't shown that he has what it takes to match Bekele or Geb for the longer distances, since he has only one championship title (over the 5k) and no wrs over the championship distances. Now go take a running jump, dickhead - the only thing you might be able to achieve.
This post was edited 38 seconds after it was posted.
There wasn't any doping in distance running in that era. So no E Africans.
Spot the racist.
You haven't been following the stream of Kenyan doping busts. It never ends. African running is rife with doping, as was E Bloc sport in the 70's and 80's. But they were white - so is that racist, too?
Elliott never lost at his specialist distances, whether against national competition or international competition. Jakob has. Especially in championship finals.
Extremely important to note that a runner who never lost as a senior never lost as senior in against national opposition. A pure Dumb.
In 1958 and in 1960 he has had some strong international competitions, in 1957, 1959 and 1961 not. There were also some good runners from down under at the time, But compare his "winning streak" with guys like
Edwin Moses - close to 10 years in the 400m hurdles (hey, Dumb, this means no Somali has beaten Moses in this period) Carl Lewis - 10 1/2 years in the long jump (hey, Dumb, no junior has beaten lewis in this period) Grant Holloway - 10 years in the 60m hurdles (hey, Dumb, no 40+ athlete has beaten Holloway in this period)
El Guerrouj has lost 5 1500m/Mile races out of well over 100 in the period 1996 - 2004 (since above three it's getting difficult for you: that's 9 seasons, Dumb). 1 after his fall in Atlanta. That's much more worth talking about than Elliott's "win streak". Elliott is famous for his records and his medals - not for his "winning streak" over two seasons and a little bit.
Elliott competed against the best in his era - and lost to no one over the mile/1500. No other runner in that event has had such dominance. In an era when it was only a recent feat to have broken the "4 minute barrier" he did it 17 times in 3 years. You know so little about the sport in your fixation in your irrelevant statistics that you understand none of this.
Yes, stating facts which you don't like means stupidity for you. That's well known, Dumbstrong.
Elliotth has lost many races during his prime 1960 - 1962.
Against Albie Thomas in the 2 Miles.
Against Brian Hewson, Mike Rawson, Tony Blue (many times), Peter Snell, George Hack, Ron Delany and some more in the 800m/880y (AAA, regional champs...)
Against lesser knowns in the 1000m.
Jakob Ingebrigtsen definitely so far is the best at age 22 from 1500m to 5k. Who is just close to him? For me that's a solid basis to have a shot at his very umbigious goal as to become the GOAT in distance running. Extremely hard to be successful in this, but he has some serious chance.
BS. His prime was 1958-60, not 1960-62. You are an ignoramus. He is a documented to have lost only 3 races at a senior level by the end of 1958 - a 440, 880 and a 2 mile. None of them was his specialist distances. How many 440's and 880's is Jakob going to win? Elliott said his career basically ended after the Rome Olympics in 1960. He had achieved everything he'd wanted and needed to find a career to support a family and he only ran recreationally after the Olympics. From the ill-informed drivel you spout you were obviously not around any time near his era.
Yes, 1958 to 1960, my mistake.
He has lost in 1959 despite not racing internationally. He has lost several races in 1960.
I only stated facts - for you that's drivel: Dumbstrong!
More than 15 athletes have run sub 4 before Elliott's WR.
Elliott improved the 1500mk/Mile WRs by big margins. Within a few years his record were also bettered by big margins.
Definitely, in the 1500m Ingebrigtsen most lekely will never become GOAT (almost impossible to better El Guerrouj's achievements). But nobody has said this. You are always arguing against nobody here.
The question is: will he become GOAT distance runner? Did you get this now - after it was told you maybe 20 times?
Also very hard to achieve, but possible. Golds and WR in the 5000m and 10000m would be enough for me.
More fabrications. You are a tiresome and ignorant jerk. You are completely unable to recognise the level of Elliott's achievements in his era and your figures are your usual fallacious and misleading bs.
The fact that cannot be altered is that as a 1500/mile specialist Jakob will never match the relative level of Elliott's career achievements - which rules out Jakob's aspiration to become the GOAT, which is the subject of the thread, not your fatuous claims about where he ranks as a "1500-5k runner at age 22". Those aren't the criteria Jakob is using - because they are irrelevant to whether he becomes the GOAT.
Furthermore, Jakob hasn't shown that he has what it takes to match Bekele or Geb for the longer distances, since he has only one championship title (over the 5k) and no wrs over the championship distances. Now go take a running jump, dickhead - the only thing you might be able to achieve.
If he will not achieve it, for sure it doesn't rule out his aspiration as to become GOAT distance runner, Dumb. Let's wait what he will achieve in the 5000m and 10000m.
And maybe later on the road.
Just the fact that this guy has this enormous ambition to become the best distance runner ever has hit you hard, Dumb, It's just his goal, you understand? Definitely not. Any top athlete has his goals, Ingebrigtsen's are extremely high. Very unlikely that he will be successful - but he has some chance. And ANY, definitely ANY distance running fan will look with much interest how he will do in the season to come. For sure this group doesn't include you, Dumbhater.
Extremely important to note that a runner who never lost as a senior never lost as senior in against national opposition. A pure Dumb.
In 1958 and in 1960 he has had some strong international competitions, in 1957, 1959 and 1961 not. There were also some good runners from down under at the time, But compare his "winning streak" with guys like
Edwin Moses - close to 10 years in the 400m hurdles (hey, Dumb, this means no Somali has beaten Moses in this period) Carl Lewis - 10 1/2 years in the long jump (hey, Dumb, no junior has beaten lewis in this period) Grant Holloway - 10 years in the 60m hurdles (hey, Dumb, no 40+ athlete has beaten Holloway in this period)
El Guerrouj has lost 5 1500m/Mile races out of well over 100 in the period 1996 - 2004 (since above three it's getting difficult for you: that's 9 seasons, Dumb). 1 after his fall in Atlanta. That's much more worth talking about than Elliott's "win streak". Elliott is famous for his records and his medals - not for his "winning streak" over two seasons and a little bit.
Elliott competed against the best in his era - and lost to no one over the mile/1500. No other runner in that event has had such dominance. In an era when it was only a recent feat to have broken the "4 minute barrier" he did it 17 times in 3 years. You know so little about the sport in your fixation in your irrelevant statistics that you understand none of this.
Yes, he was great. And he dominated in the 1500m/Mile. But just in two seasons against the best of the world. To point on his win streak again and again is laughable.
Herb Elliott was a great athlete, any track fan knows this. He was dominant in his main event.
But just for a very short period. In his 2nd (3rd) event he lost many races. Just facts. Whatever your problem is with pure facts: you are the letsdumber number 1 for a reason.
b = Outdoor World Championship gold medals (800-marathon)
c = Outdoor world record (only counting 800, 1500, steeple, 5000, 10000, and marathon)
d = Number of years the outdoor world record remained world record
e = Did the athlete ever get stripped of medals or banned by WADA (h = 1 for NO, h = 0 for YES)
*note that this scoring system only works for athletes who competed after 1983 when outdoor world championships started
GOAT quotient =
(e)[(a)+(b/3)+(c)(d/12)]
Example scores:
Bekele - 7.33
Mo Farah - 6
Guerrouj - 5.33
Rudisha - 3.83
Kipchoge - 2.42
Jakob - 1.66
Centrowitz - 1
Athletes' scores can keep going up after they retire, so long as their world record(s) remain unbroken. So every passing year that Guerrouj's 1500m record stands, he will go up and up, surpassing Bekele in 24 years time. Your GOAT score can also drop to zero if you get busted for doping, even after you retire.
If you want to collect medals and records, it's best to specialize in the 5K/10K because those events are similar enough that they're a natural double. So if Jakob wants to be GOAT, he should switch to a 5K/10K specialist as soon as Paris olympics are over.
This doesn't take into account (1) World Bests or even other world records (2000 m) (2) any indoor world records/world bests or even indoor world champ golds (3) amount of wins on the circuit at the time (Grand Prix, Golden League, Diamond League) (4) Amount of wins in the Final on the circuit (Grand Prix, Golden League, Diamond League) (5) Lastly, no road running records or championships? Flawed GOAT formula.
b = Outdoor World Championship gold medals (800-marathon)
c = Outdoor world record (only counting 800, 1500, steeple, 5000, 10000, and marathon)
d = Number of years the outdoor world record remained world record
e = Did the athlete ever get stripped of medals or banned by WADA (h = 1 for NO, h = 0 for YES)
*note that this scoring system only works for athletes who competed after 1983 when outdoor world championships started
GOAT quotient =
(e)[(a)+(b/3)+(c)(d/12)]
Example scores:
Bekele - 7.33
Mo Farah - 6
Guerrouj - 5.33
Rudisha - 3.83
Kipchoge - 2.42
Jakob - 1.66
Centrowitz - 1
Athletes' scores can keep going up after they retire, so long as their world record(s) remain unbroken. So every passing year that Guerrouj's 1500m record stands, he will go up and up, surpassing Bekele in 24 years time. Your GOAT score can also drop to zero if you get busted for doping, even after you retire.
If you want to collect medals and records, it's best to specialize in the 5K/10K because those events are similar enough that they're a natural double. So if Jakob wants to be GOAT, he should switch to a 5K/10K specialist as soon as Paris olympics are over.
This doesn't take into account (1) World Bests or even other world records (2000 m) (2) any indoor world records/world bests or even indoor world champ golds (3) amount of wins on the circuit at the time (Grand Prix, Golden League, Diamond League) (4) Amount of wins in the Final on the circuit (Grand Prix, Golden League, Diamond League) (5) Lastly, no road running records or championships? Flawed GOAT formula.
To add on, you don't even include silvers or bronze medals which can change these results as well.
I got banned on another device for the username "[deleted] is a butthead" whereas Armstronglivs still appears to be in good standing after calling someone a "dickhead." Go figure.
I got banned on another device for the username "[deleted] is a butthead" whereas Armstronglivs still appears to be in good standing after calling someone a "dickhead." Go figure.
He insults people every day but somehow he doesn't get banned.
I got banned on another device for the username "[deleted] is a butthead" whereas Armstronglivs still appears to be in good standing after calling someone a "dickhead." Go figure.
He insults people every day but somehow he doesn't get banned.
That must be because what you think are insults are factually correct descriptions.
I got banned on another device for the username "[deleted] is a butthead" whereas Armstronglivs still appears to be in good standing after calling someone a "dickhead." Go figure.
Elliott competed against the best in his era - and lost to no one over the mile/1500. No other runner in that event has had such dominance. In an era when it was only a recent feat to have broken the "4 minute barrier" he did it 17 times in 3 years. You know so little about the sport in your fixation in your irrelevant statistics that you understand none of this.
Yes, he was great. And he dominated in the 1500m/Mile. But just in two seasons against the best of the world. To point on his win streak again and again is laughable.
Herb Elliott was a great athlete, any track fan knows this. He was dominant in his main event.
But just for a very short period. In his 2nd (3rd) event he lost many races. Just facts. Whatever your problem is with pure facts: you are the letsdumber number 1 for a reason.
You remain factually wrong as well as having no understanding of the sport. It's like trying to discuss history with a grade schooler.
BS. His prime was 1958-60, not 1960-62. You are an ignoramus. He is a documented to have lost only 3 races at a senior level by the end of 1958 - a 440, 880 and a 2 mile. None of them was his specialist distances. How many 440's and 880's is Jakob going to win? Elliott said his career basically ended after the Rome Olympics in 1960. He had achieved everything he'd wanted and needed to find a career to support a family and he only ran recreationally after the Olympics. From the ill-informed drivel you spout you were obviously not around any time near his era.
Yes, 1958 to 1960, my mistake.
He has lost in 1959 despite not racing internationally. He has lost several races in 1960.
I only stated facts - for you that's drivel: Dumbstrong!
You are a liar and just make sh*t up. He didn't lose ever over the mile/1500 in his senior career. No one matches that. Jakob cannot.
This thread has descended to a tantrum by posters who cannot bear to hear that a great runner from the past is better than Jakob ever will be and that he will never be the GOAT, as much as he vainly asserts that he will be.