50+ Masters Training and Racing Open Forum

And any comments on the Hartshorne Mile results from the previous week?

http://www.fingerlakesrunners.org/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/Hartshorne_2015_Results.pdf

Happy February!

I had a good week of running covering 44.4 miles over 6 days. I'm really enjoying mixing track workouts with my usual road runs. Since my spring goal race is a 10k in March a week after indoor nationals, I'm trying to maintain my endurance while trying to improve my speed - my big weakness. The highlight of the week was making my goal times in my ladder which I thought were pretty aggressive.

Sun: 6.2 (track: 2 sets 4 X 800)

Mon: 11.5 easy

Tue: 6.3 easy

Wed: 5.4 (track ladder: 400,600,800,1200,800,600,400) stadium stairs

Thu: off

Fri: 6.7 moderate

Sat: 8.3 lots of hills

Total 44.4

I've been thinking about using an online coach and wonder if any of you could give me some pointers. I like the flexibility of creating workouts and I don't want to spend money needlessly but I wonder if having a longer term plan would be beneficial. Have you used coaches and if so was it worth it?

I forgot to comment on Coreen Steinbach's great performance in the Hartshorne Mile. I'd sure like to have an age graded performance like hers. Between Coreen and Kathy Martin, the 60+ ladies are a tough age group to be in!

Co56: I was going to tell you about a guy asking some XC skiing/running related questions....but I see that you were right on that (

http://www.letsrun.com/forum/f...ad=6307292

).

Read more:

http://www.letsrun.com/forum/flat_read.php?thread=4064465&page=205#ixzz3QVxZGURK

I was on it but got my chops busted by someone implying something I didn't say. This guy must have my number for whatever reason because that's the third time in a year or so.

Indeed stretching is not emphasized in XC skiing, and may well be counterproductive. All I was saying was that when the weather was bad we'd do some yoga or pilates with the kids, and 25 years ago there was a modicum of stretching at USST dryland camps as we warmed up for circuit training.

About the skiing-running thing, I agree with the woman who said she ski raced in college, that a mix is the best thing. I had a hard time emphasizing that to the kids, but learned that 3X a week of running during ski season made the transition back to running easier. And a bit of cross training in the off season actually could help with running.

Another thing, skiing, even a little bit, seems to make you slow in the short term. After returning at the beginning of the month from 17 days in Alaska (where I skied about 14 of those days) I've been skiing 3 times, my Sunday distance days. But it takes several days to get my running legs back each week. With USATF coming up, I'm just going to put in an easy 10 miler run today.

Ran a 4 mile XC in Boulder yesterday. Was hoping to scout out age group competition but the local 55s were no shows. Nevertheless, had a good outing and it was a treat to watch Laura Thweatt run hard, with a (former) Fairbanks girl in 2nd, and I caught some glimpses of the lead men's pack with Joe Gray and Sean Quigley battling it out. (there's a LRC thread today on the race).

I ran fairly three evenly paced loops (but the plan was for progression!) and was 24th overall, 1st in 50+, and 5th masters. So a pretty good outing/tune up for next week. I scouted the course after the race. It's flat, but a nice setting.

I just finished the NE Assoc Championships. There is prize money for 1st and 2nd age grading for both men and women. I just may have scooped up both 1st and 2nd for the women. Not sure about that, but I ran two blistering races in the 60 and the 60m hurdles. Finally everything pulled together - the start, the drive phase, the execution, the finish. I'm still stunned - happy as heck - -but stunned. Like my body aged back 10 years. We left before the meet was over to prepare for Super Bowl festivities, but the meet director said he'd be in touch. It was a wonderful morning.

All the best to you guys - let's enjoy the game!

This stuff only happens to us old guys, right? I went to Colorado this week and tried to downhill ski for the first time in my life and did ok...a little sore, a few hard falls but nothing significant. Got back to flat Nebraska and tripped on a sidewalk and fell on my first run out the door, landing with my ribcage on top of my elbow. Sharp pain in the ribs but finished the run and have been off since then...lots of pain when breathing deeply. I'm guessing bruised ribs. After a few days off, seems to be getting better so it just adds to my lousy month leading up to Boulder.

One guy who seems to be ok is my LRC teammate Brian Kelley who is coming back to Boulder to defend his 55-59 championship. He ran 29:25 for 5 miles last weekend (age 56 = age-graded 24:30). Brian is a former bike racer who is relatively new to running. My excuse when he kicks my butt is that he's got "fresh" legs compared to mine with almost 40 years of wear on them. May be something to that, I think. Could be (and I know this to be fact) that he is just a far superior runner.

Congrats Spikez!

Nice week lucKY.

My week:

Mon = 3, easy, road

Tue = 4, hard, greenway 5K@7:26 pace, windy

Wed = 3, easy, road and trail

Thr = 3, easy, road and trail

Fri = 2, easy, road

Sat = 5, hard, windy Imperial track: 6:42, 6:37, 6:39 w 1 lap walk between

Sun = 5, easy, 4 mile medium hike, 1 mile easy run

Total = 25

A good week where the weather was the primary adversary; the wind, specifically. I was getting bored with doing the same old 5K workout on the same old track so I changed it up. I switched to an old Imperial track where 4 laps is an actual mile. I know this is a little bit risky for me given my injury history but I really just had to do something different. It felt really good to turn the legs over a little bit faster.

Have a great week everyone.

Congratulations, Spikez! I hope you'll be in Winston-Salem to repeat!

M: rest.

T: 7 miles easy.

W: 11 miles progression.

R: 7 miles easy.

F: 8 miles progression.

SA: 7 miles easy.

SU: 16.7 miles.

This was a scheduled "cut back" week. (I insert one of those every 3-4 weeks, even if I am not feeling exhausted.) Another rainy Sunday for my long run. And it was a bit of a struggle even though the distance was shorter. I attribute that to not eating enough on Saturday. I try to cut back my food consumption a little bit to match the lower mileage, but I probably overdid it.

Week 191: 3 hours 2 minutes in 3 runs, of which one was on the treadmill. I believe I am ready to transition from rest days to easy days. Rtype and Spikez are my guides.

I added downstairs running every day: 4x (walk up 100 steps, run down), 2 minutes walk in between. My left calf was screeching at me the first few days, but running was fine, and it has settled down to a mild ache.

@lucKY2b - what pace do you retro-run?

I age graded over 98% for the best female age graded performance... $150 check coming my way! My husband has already voted to spend it on dinner after we watch the New Balance Indoor Grand Prix meet next Saturday - sounds like a plan!

Spikez wrote:

I age graded over 98% for the best female age graded performance... $150 check coming my way! My husband has already voted to spend it on dinner after we watch the New Balance Indoor Grand Prix meet next Saturday - sounds like a plan!

98 percent is really amazing!

To reach 98 percent for my event I would need to run a 4:38 mile or a 15:52 5000 ....only in my dreams.

Alan please be careful. Running downhill is not something to jump right into. That is a huge impact stress.

Here is how I progress:

Downhill walking carefully with small steps progresses to a faster longer pace which comes about naturally as I loosen up over months of training then on day it just seems ezr to run downhill. After a few months I am still not running much downhill but my hips knees and ankles have a much better range of motion so another month and then I will run a bit.

Fantastic! And a paycheck to boot! Wonder how much all that "overdistance" stuff that you've been doing has helped; certainly hasn't hurt! Here's to much continued success!

And yes, SCgal, Coreen S. was quite the standout; although not nearly as deep, the women had the more impressive runners at Hartshorne.

And Co56, my old HS coach back in Wisconsin, who is a lifelong Nordic Skier/Runner, has really limited the amount of static stretching that both he and the distance runners that he coaches do, opting more for dynamic warm-ups and some light stretching (as needed) afterwards. When it was first suggested to him, he was quite skeptical, but says that when he stopped having his XC runners do static stretching, the injury rates have gone way down. And on a side note, it takes him about a month to get his running legs back after the XC skiing season, too. And good luck in at XC Nationals! Likewise, tbirdxc, I hope that your ribs heal up for Boulder!

I didn't know the answer to this until you asked, so I made a crude measurement. I ran forward at a pace I know fairly well (~8:20/mile by feel), and timed it between two light poles, then did the same running my retro-pace: I got 14.7s forward, and 17.2s backward.....so that would mean the backward pace is about 9:45 pace. But again, I must stress that I only do this for about 100 steps per foot; it is pretty tiring even at that.

And for completeness, here's a little more information on the stair climbs I've been doing the past few weeks. Each flight has ten steps (and 2 flights per story), but I take them 2-steps-at-a-time both going up and coming down. As a such, there are 5 foot strikes per flight and I make sure that the odd flights start with the right foot and the even ones start with the left foot. I'm careful to take four walking (not jogging) steps on each landing, and I pay special notice that the last foot plant on the landing is completely square with the next flight of steps....it's extremely important not to apply force while the knee is still twisted. I can't stress this enough.

I echo Charlie's concerns about delving into this stuff carefully and with full awareness.

Nice weeks, Rtype, SCgal, Running Formula Reader (I should note that your cut-back week is about my max week since turning 50 5+ years ago!)

Cheers!

nope--pain could be broken ribs...not sure what you would do otherwise

Charlie wrote:

Alan please be careful. Running downhill is not something to jump right into. That is a huge impact stress.

Don't worry, I am the king of less is more. But the recommendation for eccentric work is every day and it is supposed to hurt. Plus I work on the 4th floor so I did not start from zero. Anyway I timed myself today: 4x 100 steps: up average 69.95 seconds (cadence 86/minute), down 39.43 (152), interval 91.60 (133). So "running" down is hardly at breakneck speed.

lucKY2b wrote:

the backward pace is about 9:45 pace.

Good, thanks. I just wanted to verify they are not at 5K race pace!

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Week 192

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Salutations, semicentenarians! The weather continues to vary wildly day-to-day around here; coupled with another busy academic week, it has made it difficult to plan ahead. I missed a few opportunities to get out the door as a result, but still managed to hit 20 miles on 4 days of running...but no stairs, unfortunately. Here's the week's log:

Sun: off (weather turned kinda nasty, needed a day anyways)

Mon: 4.2 @7:22 steady pace (cold and windy)

Tue: 4 treadmill (1.5% grade, some acceleration in the middle)

Wed-Thur: off

Fri: 5.2 @7:18 fairly steady pace (felt good!)

Sat: 7.1 @7:43 avg pace (some unplanned speed in the middle brought down the average.)

So I didn't get to the stairs this week, on the other hand, I did inject a bit of pace into all my runs. On Tuesday's treadmill run, I did the first mile at 8:00-pace, then cut off about 20s/mile for the next four halves. The 6:40-pace half felt pretty good and I was considering trying for 6:20-pace for the 5th half, but I was sweating pretty good, and the lack of a fan on the treadmill made me reconsider, so I ended it back at 8:00-pace for the fourth mile. Really pleased with how I felt on Friday's run (taking Wed., and Thur. off helped, no doubt), especially given that the first mile was 7:50. I was going to just run 8:00-pace on Saturday, but a young, faster kid came up on me around mile-3 and slowed to chat with me. We naturally started picking up the pace (7:15-ish) for the next couple miles before I told him I was going to cut him loose....I was a bit spent for the last couple miles home. My original plan to do stairs to finish up, but the mid-run pace nixed that idea. iN addition, I have lost a couple pounds (now at 171-172) over the course of the week, hopefully, we'll continue to lose weight over the coming month and also get back up to 30+ miles/week soon. Things are looking up!

I was awed to watch Bernie in the NB Indoor 3K at 40 years of age; the ageless one continues to battle well against the youngsters.....one master's record down....many will follow, to be sure.

Would love to hear some reports from the USATF XC Championships!

http://www.usatf.org/Events---Calendar/2015/USA-Cross-Country-Championships/Results.aspx

Libby James continues to impress at age 78! I'd forgotten that Colleen De Reuck has now joined the ranks of 50+.

Hope you all are doing well, and look forward to reading your reports!

Allt the Best!

Sounds like a solid week lucKY2b. Keep it going.

Me gots in another 50 miles highlighted by my new structured tempo sessions designed to build a better aerobic tank while just touching some date pace 1500m feel. Like 8 x 200 @ 38/39 with 200 jog on Tues then 4 x mile @ 6:17 with 60 secs jog on Fri then 120 mins LSD today.

Well done all ye XC Altitude Champs. I see my Bowerman teammates got nipped for the title by one man, one point. Wow! Exciting & well done for sure.

Gotta say double wow in our new masters guru Kip Lagat. Dang if my watch through the TV was right Bernard matched my masters 800 PR with his last 4 laps in 1:58. He's a good dude too. I remember talking with him long ago at Drake Relays when he gladly agreed to snap a photo with us masters milers.

My training is chugging along with adding more aerobic volume to my little tank. A well laid out weekly mileage and tempo plan & NO racing in the horizon --- which is a challenge in itself.

Be well folks.

KP

I had the extreme pleasure of spectating at the NB Meet. My friend said watching on TV said she saw my husband and me in the crowd right before the women's 1000m! We had excellent seats only a section away from the finish line. The whole meet was "WOW." Not enough superlatives can describe the experience. There was so much talent and a lot of drama. The crowd was on its feet. My husband was clapping and cheering, and he is MUCH less of a trackie than I am, so you can imagine what I was doing. Then we went out with good friends to a steak dinner afterward. It was one of the most fun evenings I have had in a long time.

OK - training! Coming off last Sunday's NE Indoor Championship meet I took a couple of days off. Well-timed, because the snow came down, the subways were snarled, and work generally sucked. Made it to an indoor track workout on Wednesday, lifted Thursday, did a strong interval workout on the treadmill yesterday (6x45 secs @ 80% effort with 1 min rest) and will do the same workout this afternoon. I was planning on going to Hahvahd's indoor track for a workout this morning during open hours of 7:00 a.m. to 9:00 a.m. but once again, it snowed and the streets are slick. Ugh. Thursday morning I'm flying out to sunny Palm Springs for their Senior Games meet, plus a visit to family members living in the area. It will be a much-needed "sun-break,"

Congratulations on good training, and post some XC reports! I bet they're epic.

I had a rather tough and humbling week. Monday after running I felt unusually tired. By evening it was clear I had acquired a serious head cold. I was too sick to run the rest of the week until yesterday. This morning I went out for 5 miles. I now am 5 weeks away from racing a road mile. Due to past achilles problems I have not done any real speed work since 2010, other than a few periodic strides at times. This morning I ran a 2 mile warm up to my nearby HS track. I then ran 3x100 and a 400 time trial on the track. My 400 was 1:22. This was not so great compared to being able to run a 1:07 five years ago off fairly regular speed work. But now I do have a very modest baseline to work from. My aerobic base for this year has been off to a good start, but I clearly have neglected speed work and need to build that aspect back into my training. So, it was 13 miles for the week and a reminder of the need for regular speed work.