Way Back When wrote:
bored troller wrote:
+1
Yes, but remember that his apparently legitimate 4:25 at Boston was a long time ago, when he was still in his late 50s, I think. There is no way he's capable of that 12ish years later.
Oh, I agree! When I wrote that he “could” run 4:10 to 4:30 I could have added “back in the day” or “at his best.”
Too much time on my hands... wrote:
maybe this wrote:
#201, the overall women's winner and 42 years old, ran her final 6.5 miles at 6:53/mile. She appears in pictures with FM at the bandstand, which means she gapped him by 2:36 in the last 2.44 miles. If we assume metronome-like pacing, that suggests a pace of 7:57/mile for FM from the bandstand to the finish line. FM and #135 don't appear in pictures together, but to judge by the sequence, FM is still leading #135 at the Pergola. If we assume the separation at that point is minimal, it means that #135 gapped FM by 2:18 in the last 1.63 miles. Compared to #135's average pace of 6:34 over the final 6.5 miles, that again points to an average pace of around 7:58/mile for FM over the last few miles on the course.
I love it when you talk stats, baby. Thanks, MaybeThis. And thanks for diving deeply into this as well. I don't think any rational person has remaining doubts about Frank being a cheat, but it's interesting to dissect the evidence anyway.
On a more personal note, while I don't feel too sorry for Frank in light of his continual doubling down on the lies, I do have to wonder if, in addition to narcissistic reasons, Frank misses actually being able to keep up with the kids he coaches. I have little doubt that he was a runner of basic talent at an earlier age, and my coach used to tell us that he would never have us do a workout he couldn't do. We called him on it once, and he kicked our asses. So, I bet Frank could run with his kids at one point. Hell, in my case, my kids' high school coach had me show up on occasion to put the hurt to the young whippersnappers to teach them pacing and maybe a little respect for their elders. But as the years add on, I'm realistic about my ability to keep up with the kids. Maybe Frank couldn't let that one go. Kinda like the old sled dog axiom--if you're not the lead dog, the view is always the same. I don't wish Frank any ill will. In fact, had LAM disqualified him quickly, I probably wouldn't have cared at all. But Ed Whitlock is a hero to me and probably most older runners, and I don't want his legacy to be in any way marginalized by someone like Frank.
I almost hate to say this but I personally know HS coaches who are so paranoid about their credibility that if they even overheard a fast kid say, “Why should we listen to him? He’s never been good,” they could be tempted to pull a Meza at least once.
Whether the desire to cheat the first time was just to BQ, to BQ with his son, to prove himself to his athletes or some of each, I honestly don’t think it took the careful, soul-searching consideration that we would think. It was probably seen as a victimless “crime” for him just like for so many other BQ cheats.
NotPossible wrote:
Here's the problem...If you look closely at Frank Meza's results, you will find cause for suspicion. Ten years ago, he was running marathons in the 3:02 - 3:05 range. Ten years later, he's now running ten minutes faster??? And running these marathons within weeks of each other at times?
So dig a little deeper...search for pictures of Frank on the course. Other runners near his finishing times often have DOZENS of photos. These speedy runners are near the front of the race and often running alone and thus are easy for the race photographers to catch on camera. But guess what, Frank just does not appear or appears only near the finish in many of his "record breaking" marathons"!! Just search the race photos for Long Beach, LA, Phoenix/Mesa. Why so few pictures? Why doesn't he appear in the frame with other runners of his speed? There is NOT ONE still photo of him on the course in the most recent LA Marathon...just a few images of him crossing one timing mat.
So how does he beat the system...after all, his bib crossed all the timing mats??? The bib is being worn on a belt...easy for someone else to run with on his/her back side then to pass to Frank late in the race. I know someone who reported seeing Frank walk off the course at the midway point of LA a few years ago...then saw his name in the results with a sub 3 hour time.
Hmmm.
Not Possible, this was your first post on this thread. Page 1, just a few posts after MI’s first post. You were right all along. My gut says I know who you are. No need to tell me if I’m right.
How do you know? wrote:
LoLoyla wrote:
doubler has a snitch on the Loyola coaching staff? nice!
Derek’s latest story is an interesting development. However, he doesn’t give a source. Did he get this presumably from one of the coaches? The administration? A parent?
Like he's going to say who his source is lol.
What's up with LA wrote:
Most Runners and Non-Runners can see that he cheated based on the available evidence. A time trial isn't going to convince the people with a personal connection to Frank who still believe him.
You say that but the frustrating part is the LA Times didn't say he cheated even though he's been DQd twice. LA hasn't DQd him even though it's obvious.
What's up with LA wrote:
I liked the Rossi challenge, there is no upside to this one. Worst case scenario is he drops dead during the trial, and Letsrun is all over the news as that website that bullied a 70 year old man to run himself to death.
How are we bullying him. WE're asking min to run 3 miles at marathon race pace. That should be easy. No way he even attempts it.
No follow through wrote:
"Derek: We’ve decided to take a different tact: Next time Frank runs one of our races there will be an official observer in place. This is a great opportunity for him to confirm his past performances and end the conversation.
Pending any additional information, this is the best solution for all. Appreciate your efforts. Best. "
Did LA Marathon not follow up? He ran their race in 2017, 2018, and 2019, yet no observer ran with him? Did he sign up late so they didn't have someone stick to him? Didn't they flag him that if he sign up, they would have someone following him?
I was told he signed up like the day before the race this year.
rojo wrote:
What's up with LA wrote:
I liked the Rossi challenge, there is no upside to this one. Worst case scenario is he drops dead during the trial, and Letsrun is all over the news as that website that bullied a 70 year old man to run himself to death.
How are we bullying him. WE're asking min to run 3 miles at marathon race pace. That should be easy. No way he even attempts it.
Whether your bullying him or not is irrelevant, it would definitely be spun by other media outlets in whichever way they feel would produce the most outrage clicks.
"Meza Addresses The Loyola Track Team
On Saturday morning, Frank addressed the Loyola HS Track Team at practice. Frank denied that he cut any courses..."
Source: marathoninvestigation.com
FMD Frank, what are you on?, do you really believe the kids aren't reading marathoninvestigation.com and letsrun.com?, FFS, this is 2019, they're probably reading this post.
If nothing else they only need to read the last twenty or so pages of this thread since you spoke to them and see the amazing feat of three world class age group marathons in short time and all the sequence photos from 'Too much time on my hands...' and all the other stuff to know you cheated and have no doubt about it in their minds.
It's over, the only way now is to come clean.
rojo wrote:
What's up with LA wrote:
Most Runners and Non-Runners can see that he cheated based on the available evidence. A time trial isn't going to convince the people with a personal connection to Frank who still believe him.
You say that but the frustrating part is the LA Times didn't say he cheated even though he's been DQd twice. LA hasn't DQd him even though it's obvious.
What's up with LA wrote:
I liked the Rossi challenge, there is no upside to this one. Worst case scenario is he drops dead during the trial, and Letsrun is all over the news as that website that bullied a 70 year old man to run himself to death.
How are we bullying him. WE're asking min to run 3 miles at marathon race pace. That should be easy. No way he even attempts it.
Rojo, you're right, "No way he even attempts it" especially now:
"Shortly after telling his team that he would be running in Chicago he addressed the coaches separately, and contradicted what he told the team. He told coaches that he was diagnosed with a heart condition and that his running days may be over."
Source: marathoninvestigation.com
IMHO I think the best think you can do is write up a front page article on Meza, similar to the ones you did on the Philly cheater, with input from Derek Murphy outlining Meza's cheating and why exposing cheaters/dopers, etc matters to maintaining the integrity of the sport.
Just sayin'.
The truth hurts, but sometimes it's the only way. wrote:
"Meza Addresses The Loyola Track Team
On Saturday morning, Frank addressed the Loyola HS Track Team at practice. Frank denied that he cut any courses..."
Source: marathoninvestigation.com
FMD Frank, what are you on?, do you really believe the kids aren't reading marathoninvestigation.com and letsrun.com?, FFS, this is 2019, they're probably reading this post.
If nothing else they only need to read the last twenty or so pages of this thread since you spoke to them and see the amazing feat of three world class age group marathons in short time and all the sequence photos from 'Too much time on my hands...' and all the other stuff to know you cheated and have no doubt about it in their minds.
It's over, the only way now is to come clean.
plus they are on summer break now also, for sure the kids are reading this thread, they got nothing but time. All it takes is one and it would spread like wildfire. Anywho, are Chicago entries up yet? It's not like he could just sign up for in on a whim right. Also happens during high school cross country season so I doubt he would have done it either way.
LoLyola wrote:
Also happens during high school cross country season so I doubt he would have done it either way.
You're forgetting something, Frank is persona non grata when it comes to coaching at Loyola High, they've scrubbed him.
In fairness if he has to give up running marathons for health reasons his excellent self diagnostic skills mean that he took this advice over a decade ago so in a sense nothing has changed.
LoLyola wrote:
The truth hurts, but sometimes it's the only way. wrote:
"Meza Addresses The Loyola Track Team
On Saturday morning, Frank addressed the Loyola HS Track Team at practice. Frank denied that he cut any courses..."
Source: marathoninvestigation.com
FMD Frank, what are you on?, do you really believe the kids aren't reading marathoninvestigation.com and letsrun.com?, FFS, this is 2019, they're probably reading this post.
If nothing else they only need to read the last twenty or so pages of this thread since you spoke to them and see the amazing feat of three world class age group marathons in short time and all the sequence photos from 'Too much time on my hands...' and all the other stuff to know you cheated and have no doubt about it in their minds.
It's over, the only way now is to come clean.
plus they are on summer break now also, for sure the kids are reading this thread, they got nothing but time. All it takes is one and it would spread like wildfire. Anywho, are Chicago entries up yet? It's not like he could just sign up for in on a whim right. Also happens during high school cross country season so I doubt he would have done it either way.
"member of the press:, Letsrun, Derek Murphy: How about a call to the Chicago Marathon: "Hi, Chicago Marathon: Is a Dr. Frank Meza or Frank Meza, MD from south Pasadena, CA registered for the 2019 Race?
The truth hurts, but sometimes it's the only way. wrote:
It's over, the only way now is to come clean.
It's over except for the DQ and that will shut the door.
As for come clean? Everyone is innocent in Shawshank.
ExpertKipWatcher wrote:
In fairness if he has to give up running marathons for health reasons his excellent self diagnostic skills mean that he took this advice over a decade ago so in a sense nothing has changed.
+1
Frank: "I will no longer be running marathons due to health reasons."
LA Times Reporter: "So, no change to your lifestyle then?"
Frank: "Um ... No Comment"
There is precedent that with Rossi who claimed a 3:11:45, the goal was a sub 20 5K. This guy is claiming a 2:52 - the goal should be tougher - at least 19 min as a 2:52 guy should be able to break 18. Or a 39 min 10K. I agree with a previous poster that he is in generally good shape for a 70 yr old.
Of course he said "to the boys" he is running Chicago - sub 3:05. LRC can proctor it and there will be a pace group (can you imagine that scene?)
Of course, he wont accept any challenge and likely will never race again - the usual punishment for cheating.
Great sleuthing by 'too much time' and by whoever did more Oakland pix.
Derek's next article will probably be very interesting.
Not Waiting any longer wrote:
Elaborator wrote:
No. No. No.
It must be way more complicated than that with accomplices and outfit changes, etc,
No, it's really that easy. He did it alone on a bike or with someone driving him. That's it.
Outfit change?? Yeah, when he's in the vehicle between mats.
Frank is laughing at you guys making a mountain out of a molehill. He cheated and the video proof is simply icing on the cake and nothing more.
HE WILL NOT RACE AGAIN------GUARANTEED! Something will be made up that won't allow him to train properly....wait for it as I GUARANTEE YOU IT'S COMING. I said this pages ago and it got no traction. He'll pull the Oscar Miranda and Rosie Ruiz lie...I can't run anymore. Excuses will be coming as he knew what he'd say if he ever got caught.
Wait for it;)
THIS^^^^ You nailed it dude!
FrankMezaTrump wrote:
Donor Doc wrote:
I'm guessing he's a big donor to the XC and track programs. Separating themselves from him might mean his annual contributions go away.
Now we're getting to the root of why Diaz is going to the end's of the earth to defend this guy and This is the only reason he was permitted to speak to the team. $$$. I went to their site: I've never seen such a robust high school athletic program. The money at stake must be large.
Pure speculation, and I'm guessing you're wrong.
Based on what I've read about FM, and his desire to help those that are less fortunate, if he's donating money to anything, it's probably the Aztlan Running Club, which actually seems to be doing a lot to help peoples in need.
He’s not registered for Chicago. He better start fundraising.