Kilian Jornet might be running something flat in the fall!!

Some fast road marathoners would do very well at mountain running and ultras....of course! Not all, but it sure helps to have sub 2:20 marathon speed/endurance and high mileage training. There can be a learning curve, but it depends on the individual and the type of course they are running on (i.e. how technical the trails are and how steep of a gradient the mountain race is). It's all about variable running economy. I bet a sub 2:10 guy would destroy some of these trail-mountain courses and the competition. Then again one year at the World Mountain Champs a 2:08 guy (Olympic Champ) only got 6th place. A lot of these mountain-trail running ultra guys could also throw down a decent road marathon as well. Maybe not sub 2:15, but around 2:20ish. I mean it's all just distance running. But to be world class at both (esp within the same year) I'd imagine would be very hard. So nobody is "amazing" at "every area of running" or whatever you are trying to say. The only real difference between high level road running and MUT is the depth of competition and the prize money is much greater at the top end.....there is also actual PED testing as well. In MUT one could be doped to the gills and probably almost never get caught. And this is coming from someone who has done 15 road marathons as well as races like Pikes Peak, Zegama, Mont Blanc Marahton, Sierre-Zinal, World Mountain Champs, ultras multiple times etc.

Dann wrote:

It's funny reading comments like "KJ can run close to elite lvl on the roads!" and "If elite runners couldn't dream of beating KJ on the trails." Like what? KJ is a amazing athlete but get real, he isn't amazing at every area of running.

He ran a 3x5K workout on a gravel road each 5K around 15flat.

RAAAAANGE

AT THESWOOSH wrote:

I see him running 2:16-2:17.

Not between 2:16 or 2:17, it has to be 2:16 flat or 2:17 flat.

Of course Kilian is beatable, he's been beaten before, and by runners he totally outclasses like Dakota Jones. The thing you need to remember about Kilian, though, is that most seasons he races waaaaaaay too much, and he's hardly ever in peak shape because of it. Also, he spends several months a year focused on alpinism or skimo, barely running if at all.

A guy that's competitive in short skyrunning races, vertical Ks and 100 mile ultras, plus some longer FKTs - that's range. A guy that's been at the top of the sport for the past 10 years, who won UTMB when he was 19 or 20. A guy that, because of his skimo racing, gets tested more in a yeat than all American ultrarunners combined.

You guys live in your niche of smooth runable races with watered down fields, and get slaughtered when you race abroad. Too much social media posturing, product pushing and online coaching, and not enough talent or comitment to the sport. Jim Walmsley is now exposing the general lack of talent over there.

As for Kilian on the roads, we'll never not what he could have done if he trained and developed as a road runner all these years. And who cares? He's a mountain runner.

I would love to see Kilian race some XC at the least. I've seen Sage, Joe Gray and also Jim Walms run XC. At least they compete and see how they could do in a competitive race. Kilian sticks to relatively low competition events and never leaves the long mountain scene distance. Sage, would you say Gray is the best mountain guy when it comes to XC?

Seems he excels over even Max King and I saw the results you have mentioned where Gray and you both were ahead of Jim in XC! I was impressed! Who wins between you, Gray, Walmsley, Kilian and King if you run 10k XC tomorrow??

bro dude wrote:

Also, I will say its going to be disappointing for him not to be at UTMB this year with the line up looking how it is so far. Basically a repeat of the other year minus Kilian and last time he had to drop fairly early on from bad reaction to bee sting medication.

I agree, it is looking like the strongest field ever in an ultra trail race. However, I don’t think Jornet’s absence will affect the outcome. He has not won UTMB since 2011. Last year, he clearly focused on training for short events. He has not been the top 100 mile MUT runner for years. I think he would finish third or fourth at best if he ran this year. If Capell has a race like last year, no one is going to touch him. It will be fun watching Walmsley going out with him and blowing up.

In May of 2019, he did a pretty flat 3 x 5K workout which could help predict his marathon/other flat course time:

1st 5K: 14:58

2nd 5K: 15:20

3rd 5K: 15:15

With 1K of rest between each series at 4min/km pace (so almost no rest).

The whole training session adds up to 17K straight in about 53 minutes (3:07/km pace)

It wasn't entirely flat too, as he accumulated 300+ meters in total.

O11O wrote:

In May of 2019, he did a pretty flat 3 x 5K workout which could help predict his marathon/other flat course time:

1st 5K: 14:58

2nd 5K: 15:20

3rd 5K: 15:15

With 1K of rest between each series at 4min/km pace (so almost no rest).

The whole training session adds up to 17K straight in about 53 minutes (3:07/km pace)

It wasn't entirely flat too, as he accumulated 300+ meters in total.

yeah...but it didn't happen

Sounds like he'll probably do the Golden Trail Series again.....all 42km and less distances for that (plus he doesn't have the points for UTMB anyway). Carpenter's record at Pikes Peak is safe though...nobody is ever going under 3:20 again the way the course is nowadays IMO. I think the 2017 UTMB field was about the same (all the same guys really). So without him it's hard to say the line-up is "more competitive" this year. Was that 3 x 5 km workout documented on Strava or Movescount? Doesn't matter, anyone that can run a sub 2:30 at Sierre-Zinal is very, very fit (and fast).

Hey Sage. Knowing what you do about your Hoka teammate Jim, do you think if he goes into the Trials tapered and brings his A game do you think it’s possible he can lay down a 2:12 ?

won't risk exposure wrote:

He won't. There is too much risk in running a legitimate, measured course. Heads will explode when they find out that KJ is a 17 minute 5ker.

If you believe his posts from pre-Sierra Zinal he ran a VK in a morning and a 31 minute 10k after taking a break in between to run a bit.

Not sure about that wrote:

won't risk exposure wrote:

He won't. There is too much risk in running a legitimate, measured course. Heads will explode when they find out that KJ is a 17 minute 5ker.

If you believe his posts from pre-Sierra Zinal he ran a VK in a morning and a 31 minute 10k after taking a break in between to run a bit.

I don't believe his posts. I'll believe an officially timed track 10K. Or 5K, or marathon, or any official distance in a real race. Or a legitimately measured and timed time trial. Why in his entire life hasn't he ever done a legitimate race?

This morning I did 8x200 in 22, a 3:54 mile, a vertical kilometer in 2:35, then did my normal 25 mile run with 12,000 feet elevation gain. I should put this info on my website to make it official.

won't risk exposure wrote:

Not sure about that wrote:

If you believe his posts from pre-Sierra Zinal he ran a VK in a morning and a 31 minute 10k after taking a break in between to run a bit.

I don't believe his posts. I'll believe an officially timed track 10K. Or 5K, or marathon, or any official distance in a real race. Or a legitimately measured and timed time trial. Why in his entire life hasn't he ever done a legitimate race?

This morning I did 8x200 in 22, a 3:54 mile, a vertical kilometer in 2:35, then did my normal 25 mile run with 12,000 feet elevation gain. I should put this info on my website to make it official.

Yeah I see your point, he could be making up all of his times and posts, show how he loves doing outdoor mountain things of all sorts, relocate to make it easier for him to do all of what he loves, go out and break a whole bunch of records and actually beat other fast people but be cleverly lying in those posts to stroke his ego or boots his following or sponsors.

I'm not being facetious. It seems a bit far fetched, but sure, totally possible. The guy really has nothing to prove to us anyways, he's won steep, long, short on feet and skis. Just hasn't done a regular old road race. Sure will be fun to see what happens given the amazing base and v02 etc and if he can sharpen that (and technique) for the road.

I'm not saying that he isn't good; he obviously is a tremendous runner. But until he gives a measured time on a measured course, it is all rumor. Maybe I'm just used to the days when guys like Ovett and Shorter would enter any type of race anywhere against anyone just because they were runners and liked racing.

Until he gives a measured time on a measured course? WTF are you talking about. He destroyed Jim Walmsley and the likes at Sierre Zinel and UTMB races. Also 1st place at Pikes Peak Marathon in Colorado twice I believe. Not everybody runs circle lap track 10,000m races and tarmac 42km only.

TrailGrind wrote:

Not everybody runs circle lap track 10,000m races and tarmac 42km only.

Almost every runner does at least once in their career. KJ is about the only one who refuses to ever run a single normal road or track race in his lifetime. I guess that since I've never run UMBT, people can claim that I would run it in 6 minutes and destroy everybody by many hours. There is no evidence that I can't. Sometimes I run repeat laps through the woods which are about 2 miles or about 4 miles or something in about 15 minutes.

only 18 days until we find out .....

FKT on this race is 27.53