Shady MS Entries in Ohio - do I say something?

2:18 wrote:

Time to throw gasoline on this fire . Look at Gabby Jennings from Louisiana. She is doing well at Furman right now. She choose their after Arkansas had reduced an offer. She has the most state titles in the History of Louisiana . Yes it was louisiana and it was small schools. She is still talented. The chance to run in high school meets since 5th grade played a big part in her development .

I imagine in Louisiana it's allowed. Good for her. She played within the rules and killed it.

However... if she grew up in Ohio, it'd be against the rules. She'd have to crush competition in Columbus via youth running groups like Grasshoppers or New World, wait until 7th/8th grade to compete at the middle school level, and then wait again (gasp) until high school to run against 9-12 competition.

Different states.

I told you I have NEVER heard of this program before. All I am doing is giving other possibilities. I have NEVER said whether I think they are cheating the system or not.

If this middle school is NOT a member of OHSAA then they don't have to follow any of their rules. How hard is that to understand?

If these girls go to an OHSAA school in the future, then that would be the responsibility of OHSAA to investigate and decide if any punishment is warranted.

Just the facts ......... wrote:

I told you I have NEVER heard of this program before. All I am doing is giving other possibilities. I have NEVER said whether I think they are cheating the system or not.

If this middle school is NOT a member of OHSAA then they don't have to follow any of their rules. How hard is that to understand?

If these girls go to an OHSAA school in the future, then that would be the responsibility of OHSAA to investigate and decide if any punishment is warranted.

I live and coach in Columbus. This school is a K-8 school that is not part of OHSAA. Until this thread I had never heard of them either.

I get it: the OP is pissed that a sixth grade ran in a MS meet a few years ago. Honestly, who cares. The meets are not part of a tournaments and the results mean nothing. You all need to find a bigger fish to fry.

Blowthewhistle? wrote:

Logic wrote:

It's middle school, my guy. No one cares, nor should anyone care. It's kind of pathetic that you even noticed.

Then why have rules at all?

So parents like you can stew about how their kid is not getting a ribbon ?.

Logic wrote:

It's middle school, my guy. No one cares, nor should anyone care. It's kind of pathetic that you even noticed.

I agree. For most people, competitive running doesn't even start until 9th grade. My daughter ran in middle school and I couldn't have cared less about "Shady MS Entries".

I didn’t feel like reading all the responses but I’m from Ohio so thought I would respond. If someone said this already my apologies but holding kids back to do better at sports is common(especially in my area NEO) I know of kids held back 1-2 years so they are better at sports, I also know of kids that have been homeschooled and held back which makes it easy to hold them back. This is a major possibility especially if these girls parents are friends.

No im from central ohio and I actually used to go to the same school as one of these girls (im 3 years older than her) I can confirm that one of them is definitely in 8th grade. My guess is the coach just made a mistake.

You're wrong. St Michael's absolutely IS under the OHSAA umbrella. Just ask AD Matt Gregory at smwarriors.com.

I have to wonder what stake some of you have in this - those of you attacking the OP. Clearly something is amiss here.

Where in Columbus do you coach? Under a rock? St Michael's is as well known as Pickerington or Hilliard. All the Catholic diocese on the north side of Columbus (St Brigid in Dublin, St Michael's and St Peters in Worthington, and St Paul in Westerville) all compete for St Michael's as a combined team.

They routinely compete in middle school events in Central Ohio. I can see why the OP is calling for them to follow the rules.

SDSU Aztec wrote:

I agree. For most people, competitive running doesn't even start until 9th grade. My daughter ran in middle school and I couldn't have cared less about "Shady MS Entries".

Unless you're a coach and recognize a team faslifying information. What, they don't have eligibility rules in California?

JoggyHobber wrote:

No im from central ohio and I actually used to go to the same school as one of these girls (im 3 years older than her) I can confirm that one of them is definitely in 8th grade. My guess is the coach just made a mistake.

A mistake all year at every meet in 2016, with at least four different athletes? And then again at every meet in 2017, with those same four athletes?

Why are you arguing with people here? Either do it, or don't. If you're a troll, it's a great effort. If you're serious, but a coward, send this link to everyone concerned. If anyone else cares as much as your anonymous a$$, something will begin to happen. Problem solved or not, at least you won't be wasting your time asking for advice and then arguing with people who give it.

a non-ymous wrote:

Why are you arguing with people here? Either do it, or don't. If you're a troll, it's a great effort. If you're serious, but a coward, send this link to everyone concerned. If anyone else cares as much as your anonymous a$$, something will begin to happen. Problem solved or not, at least you won't be wasting your time asking for advice and then arguing with people who give it.

Yo OP. Follow all the advice on this thread to contact the coach and /or AD, politely. Then STFU here, until you hear back from the coach or AD. While we are talking middle school, it's OK to draw the line here (if indeed it is cheating), as long as your not losing it like you're starting to here.

Let us know how it goes, and why you find out.

Why not wrote:

SDSU Aztec wrote:

I agree. For most people, competitive running doesn't even start until 9th grade. My daughter ran in middle school and I couldn't have cared less about "Shady MS Entries".

Unless you're a coach and recognize a team faslifying information. What, they don't have eligibility rules in California?

It's middle school! If I was a coach, I would want my kids to enjoy running and hopefully continue into HS. If another MS coach wants to age-cheat or whatever I don't really care. It's not like when that 14-year old pitcher got busted in LLWS.

Has anyone checked to see is St. Michaels isn't a Kenyan satellite school? Maybe they are just practicing faking their ages? Do they drive themselves to the meets?

An ohioan wrote:

You're wrong. St Michael's absolutely IS under the OHSAA umbrella. s.

You can look up all the members here. I couldn't find St Michaels listed. Maybe you can have better luck.

Looks like they are gearing up to try and win that state dodgeball championship!!!

http://smwarriors.com

I live and coach in SE Ohio. The current coach at St. Micheals has been doing this for a few years. They had some boys who competed more than two years in middle school last year. They were listed as 8th graders for more than one year. They also have used kids who do not attend their school on their teams in the past. We became aware of this and confirmed their participation for our upcoming invitational and made them eligible for individual awards , but they could not win any sort of team awards. We were trying to support the kids but disallow all-star teams or skating the rules of years of middle school participation. We felt the other attending teams deserved that all follow the same rules. They declined attending once they could not win team awards. I also know the coach has tried to undermine the high school coach at a Columbus catholic school where at least one of the boys now attends as a freshman. The coach has been feeding the AD things about the high school like they don't train hard enough or race enough among other things. Of course the AD knows nothing about the sport so he listens. It appears he is trying to get the current coach removed so that he can take over. It is a mess. I am friends with one of the ex-assistant coaches of the high school.

Enlightening post. Thanks for confirming what I'd suspected. I think you handled it the right way regarding your invitational. It's too bad - I assume you're referring to Latshaw and Kubatko at Watterson. Those kids are talented runners; they deserve a coach who will advocate for them within the guidelines of OHSAA.

Same goes for the St. Michael's girls.

To the previous poster who just wants me to stfu and move on - I came to this board to seek advice regarding how to handle an obvious violation of rules, not to debate whether or not those rules actually had been broken. It's interesting that some of the more emotionally defensive - or attacking - posts have come from people who live close to Columbus and claim to have never heard of St. Michael's.

In the end, hopefully this thread will bring some awareness to the issue and the coach at St. Michael's will begin following OHSAA rules as they're set forth in the rule book. His athletes deserve such.

To those who care, I've decided on a simple email to the coach with a link to this thread.

It's a big deal to the 11 and 12 year-olds, though. They want to compete against their peers. If someone is cheating and winning, it takes opportunities to win away from those who are following the rules.

Er... wrote:

Okay, okay. I agree with you: lying is wrong, cheating is wrong. But I also agree with the guy above that it's not really a big deal that some 11 year olds raced some 12 year olds. So maybe shoot the coach an email and say, Hey, I noticed this and it looks strange. You might not want to do that again.

Blowthewhistle? wrote:

Should it matter that they are deliberately falsifying registrants? Where do you draw the line? Do you even asknowledge a line?

Lying is wrong. Cheating is wrong. Deception is wrong.