Good one!
Good one!
well that's interesting
S. Canaday wrote:
I'm very far from elite, but somewhat "national class" in the marathon and longer.
I assume the OP is mainly talking about track runners and events 10km and below (although the same applies to marathons and longer events).
My guess is that many elites/pros have trained so much over the years that it becomes easier to "manage and mask" the pain. They've done so many grueling workouts and pushed themselves so hard that racing is basically second nature. Races can be "easier" than the workouts in a sense. Being extra fit, one can recover super fast and look relaxed/happy like it was easy (even thought they may have been in quite a bit of pain/fatigue).
So there's that. Then some of them are probably doping so there's that too. Finally like one poster mentioned above that when a top athlete wins it means they were having a "good day" so that usually means things are clicking and there is the sensation of feeling "less pain" for a relative effort. The excitement of breaking the tape first and winning gives one a boost to not crumple at the line.
So you are “National Class” at the marathon and above? Isn’t that just code language for “I keep increasing the distance till I find a distance that there are so few people competing in that I can remain competitive and justify not getting a real job?
You need to see this video to find out!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_2MC_0tTcK8&feature=youtu.be
Ever been to a Crossfit class? It's crazy, people go down to the floor after an 8 min workout like they've been shot. I used to stand there and look around like seriously guys? Do more cardio bro.
Fast Jogger wrote:
Ever been to a Crossfit class? It's crazy, people go down to the floor after an 8 min workout like they've been shot. I used to stand there and look around like seriously guys? Do more cardio bro.
Interesting! I have had the same experience at CrossFit, where almost everyone except me was lying on the floor gasping for breath for minutes. I always assumed the reason was that they were going all uot and I wasn't because for them CF is everything and for me it was just a way to support running, but makes me think that maybe there's something to what you posit.
It's the lack of SNOW!
Nordic Skiers get a cooling effect from dropping down on the ground after the finish line. Runner's dont. Cyclist don't. Swimmers are already in cooling water when they finish.
Starting hosing runners down with ice cold water in the curve after the finish line and they will all throw themselves there faster than you can say "Semenya in wet T-shirt"! ;-)
Lactate? wrote:
Even when elite runners win, beat the WR or such, they don’t fall to the ground drowling - like I do when I run 5K in 17:59. Why is that?
because they want you to think it was easy to them
kj wrote:
My best races (13:54 at BU, 23:58 at AL) I finished feeling like a million bucks.
Half of it was that I was tremendously fit, but the other half was mental in that I knew I was having a transcendent performance hearing my splits and feeling great.
Very rarely was I wiped. I was wiped in races that had extreme weather conditions (mostly hot over 80-degrees and humid over 80%), but when I was on, I finished fresh (even though I wasn't) if that makes sense.
I know exactly what you mean. For example, I've run a half dozen 13.1s, and all but one of them was a really tough race where I needed a lot of time to recover afterwards. Like I was wiped. The one race where I felt brilliant from start to finish was the one where I was fittest, and ran a three minute PR.
I think it comes down to two things. The first is physical fitness having established a really deep "redline" where you can push your aerobic threshold farther than you used to. The second is having the mental position of knowing where that red line is, and being able to toe it, so you wind up running faster, farther, harder than you've done before, but since you don't cross the red line until the final mile or finishing kick, you can run seemingly indefinitely without suffering much for it.
Lactate? wrote:
Even when elite runners win, beat the WR or such, they don’t fall to the ground drowling - like I do when I run 5K in 17:59. Why is that?
They're probably elated from the win, but they are tired. I gave the male and female winners (both Kenyan) of a well-known half marathon a ride to the airport after the race. First, I had to wait around about 2 hours while they napped. Then on the way to the airport, they kept commenting to each other about how tired they were, as if they couldn't believe it. I said to them, "Well you should be tired, you ran faster than every other person"
Also, Ed Eyestone was announcing Bay To Breakers one year, and was asked if you really had to run fast enough that you should be puking at the end as one shoe company was advertising (I think it was Reebok). Ed seemed to agree that you might have to puke at the end by saying that if you run fast enough to win, you're not going to feel very good at the end.
So, I think elite runners are tired at the end, but you might not notice, because they are also elated that they won
More please wrote:
Bob Schul country wrote:
Because they arent taxing their aerobic systems at that speed. The nueromuscular system is the less efficient system.
And what does the neuromuscular system do? How is it fuelled?
You assume that they use all the O2 they are getting in.....they carry more than they need so they dont go into oxygen debt like hobby joggers do
Run007xx wrote:
S. Canaday wrote:
I'm very far from elite, but somewhat "national class" in the marathon and longer.
I assume the OP is mainly talking about track runners and events 10km and below (although the same applies to marathons and longer events).
My guess is that many elites/pros have trained so much over the years that it becomes easier to "manage and mask" the pain. They've done so many grueling workouts and pushed themselves so hard that racing is basically second nature. Races can be "easier" than the workouts in a sense. Being extra fit, one can recover super fast and look relaxed/happy like it was easy (even thought they may have been in quite a bit of pain/fatigue).
So there's that. Then some of them are probably doping so there's that too. Finally like one poster mentioned above that when a top athlete wins it means they were having a "good day" so that usually means things are clicking and there is the sensation of feeling "less pain" for a relative effort. The excitement of breaking the tape first and winning gives one a boost to not crumple at the line.
So you are “National Class” at the marathon and above? Isn’t that just code language for “I keep increasing the distance till I find a distance that there are so few people competing in that I can remain competitive and justify not getting a real job?
I would of done exactly what Sage does when I was young if people were into sharing reel to reel. Ya jealous?
Idk man I've been watching some races in the last days and the women finish line always looks like a graveyard. Check Amsterdam 2016 5k (the one that got won by spanish Fila, who I think was busted for doping), they all collapsed at the end
Found a link
Run007xx wrote:
S. Canaday wrote:
I'm very far from elite, but somewhat "national class" in the marathon and longer.
I assume the OP is mainly talking about track runners and events 10km and below (although the same applies to marathons and longer events).
My guess is that many elites/pros have trained so much over the years that it becomes easier to "manage and mask" the pain. They've done so many grueling workouts and pushed themselves so hard that racing is basically second nature. Races can be "easier" than the workouts in a sense. Being extra fit, one can recover super fast and look relaxed/happy like it was easy (even thought they may have been in quite a bit of pain/fatigue).
So there's that. Then some of them are probably doping so there's that too. Finally like one poster mentioned above that when a top athlete wins it means they were having a "good day" so that usually means things are clicking and there is the sensation of feeling "less pain" for a relative effort. The excitement of breaking the tape first and winning gives one a boost to not crumple at the line.
So you are “National Class” at the marathon and above? Isn’t that just code language for “I keep increasing the distance till I find a distance that there are so few people competing in that I can remain competitive and justify not getting a real job?
This is what Centro Jr did once he realized he'd never beat Bolt over 200m.
No, most elites adhere to the the philosophy of moderation in training. If they were to bang out every workout at full intensity, they'd be out of the pro field within a year from all the pressure, pain, and whatnot. Remember, this is a career for them--they cannot afford to risk injury or a terrible race. Eliud Kipchoge never goes more than 80% in his workouts. Train don't strain, and race even better.
It's been mentioned that elites are more energy efficient, they use less energy to do the same thing. However, in a race scenario wouldn't your objective be to be efficient but instead do more with the same energy expenditure? As some coaches might say, "leave it all on the track." Races aren't a contest in saving energy but traveling the farthest in the least time.
Exactly, so the question is more, what was actually their limiting factor as to why they weren't faster in that specific race?
Most times I PR in the mile it doesn't hurt that bad and I don't grab the knees after. Straight into a "whoop" and jog. After the bad ones a bit more pain. I notice that when I have more miles under me in training I am less likely to collapse and am never incoherent after a race.
fit people recover fast wrote:
I'm far from elite, but I recover really quickly too when I'm really fit. If I'm out of shape and finishing a minute off my PR, it takes a few minutes after the finish to get my breath back. When I'm setting a PR while in great shape, the pain of the race is gone within a few seconds of finishing and I can just take a brief moment to collect myself and then jog off.
Not me. It doesn't matter whether i run terrible or PR, I'm absolutely wiped after a race. Heck I'm usually on the ground after long runs and workouts too.
Lactate? wrote:
Even when elite runners win, beat the WR or such, they don’t fall to the ground drowling - like I do when I run 5K in 17:59. Why is that?
Ritz collapsed a lot in his high school footlocker wins but his aerobic engine was less developed at that time.
Also, running at max speed doesn't mean you're running at your max fatigue level. Those elites are running as fast as they can move their legs but their aerobic engines are not fully maxed out. If they collapsed it would suggest that they couldn't have run that fast because they would have been too out of breath to continue.