How to run sub 2 minutes in 800m

[quote]not the marathon wrote:

Some great advice on these threads! BUT.......this is only a 13-14 year old athlete who has not physically matured yet. Much of the advice given is solid but much too complex and advanced for an athlete of his age. Once in high school, college, and professional the MPW, time of season, primary event all will dictate specific workouts.

Key Points-

1) Identifying primary race distance (400-800-1600-3200-5000m???)

2) Natural talent is the priority over workload (This slowly shifts as he matures).

3) Running X-C is a great. 1.5-2.0 mile XC races are great. Low mileage training includes hills and strength endurance.

4) 'Speed Work' only involves 100m (x 10-15), 150m (x 8-10) 200m (x 2-5) strides at various speeds (post training sessions or incorporated with a low mileage fartlek run).

5) Junior High athlete mileage should not exceed 15-20 mpw MAX!

The simple formula is to "Train" the body to process race pace (60 seconds). Again, this is done through a series of workouts that involve 60 sec pace workouts (ie..5 x 100m @ 15 seconds w/100 walk/jog rec). This can be increased to 10, 15, or 20 x 100 depending on the athletes ability.

At the end of the day you can get only so much out of a young teenager. Sub 2:00 min may not be in the cards at this age. Don't force something that is not natural.....Be patient!!!

Happy Running!!

Agree. Running sub 2 minutes for a 15 year old who has good endowment of good basic speed and endurance can accomplish this. As stated my athlete who has run 1:57 'only' has run 56.1 for but probably can run 54 now but nothing special but he also has the endurance to run a 4:23 mile. The journey of helping athletes and finding what works for them is always the fun part of coaching. For those interested our session in 97 degree weather here today will be 2x200 in 32-33 with 1 min recovery, 3x400 in 64-66 with 90 seconds recovery 3x200 in 28 with 90 seconds recovery all with 3 minutes btw sets. Nothing special but what we do on all the other days.....isn't either. Good luck!

waltertompatton wrote:

Joe Newton said that it's like building a pyramid. If you have a wide base you can build a higher peak.

But variety is important.

Other than Sage, did he ever have a runner succeed at a high level beyond high school?

I went from a 1:59 in HS to 1:50 in college and my mileage increase was negligible (40 miles in HS to 50 miles/wk senior year in college. Granted looking back now five years later, high mileage would have been an added benefit, but clearly it wasn't necessary to run quick. Main difference was a massive increase in plyometrics and supplemental training (mid-distance specific), tempos early season followed by an intense stint of consistent intervals/speed-esque w.o's exceeding lactate threshold (i.e 600, 800, 1200, 800, 600) and high-speed 200/300 workouts (i.e 8x200 or 6x300).

That, and I matured considerably in terms of knowing when to rest my body or hold back on easy days. Would've been way too caught up in mileage or 'being a leader' by winning every workout in high school.

Thank you. Appreciate that That's what I thought, but that was what 50 years ago?

Some things just don't change.

So you must be close to 80? Good to hear from you!

Atavist wrote:

What's your 200 time? If you can't run a 200 in under 25 seconds with a running start you have no hope of breaking 2 no matter how good your aerobic fitness is.

Wrong

12 x 200 is good for speed, but it is important to do workouts where you hold that speed over longer intervals.

This is a cool thread, enjoyable reading to see this enthusiasm for breaking 2:00.

We're all talking about the workouts. What about race strategy? Again, it depends on your endurance/speed mix.

It's also cool that this thread applies to the ladies as well as the lads. Although few lassies will break 2:00 than lads...

not the marathon wrote:

I'm a junior in high school and have a few goals for track season this year. I ran 2:08 last year in a 4x8 relay and think I can run a sub 2 minute 800 since that wasn't my main event last year. That is if I decide to focus on it over the mile this year. My 5k dropped significantly during xc this year. Is there any sure sign of being able to run sub 2 minutes. Any general advice for doing it other than running fast and lydiard because that almost always seems to be the first response on any thread.

Any advice and help is appreciated

You have given nothing to go off

EX RUNNER -

I did go to the brianmac website for the 800 training.

The specific training phase looks pretty simple and pretty sound with 3 necessary paces.

1. 5% faster than 800 goal pace with distances of 100 to 300 and 5 to 10 min. recovery (about 400 pace)

2. Goal 800 pace with distances of 300 to 600

3. 5% slower than 800 goal pace with max distance 1200 and :30 to :90 recovery (about 1500 pace?)

Hi U.N.O. im a big fan of your advice and posts on these boards. I was wondering would it be possible to contact you via email for some specific advice. I would be very grateful for your help

Regards from Ireland

I ran a 54 second 400 after an 800 race just this past week but my 800 pr is only a 2:03. Should I be able to break 2?

As a 16 year old, I ran 400 in 57 and 800 in 2.09

A year later doing interval training, I could do 400 in 52 and 800 in 1.57

My best times for 100 was 11. 3, 200 was 22.9, 400 was 47.8 and 800 was 1.46.2.

I was unable to break certain marks until I had a change in attitude, nothing to do with how fast I could run. I saw a flick of Dave Wottles Olympic gold and the penny dropped.

My first breakthrough was getting under 1.55 for 800. That was simply running even 200 splits of 28.5 sec or thereabouts. Once I had done that, I could run 1.55 no problem. Next milestone was 1.52. That was done by even splits of 28 sec per 200.

The next leap was huge, and that was a sub 1.48 by running 27 sec 200s.

If you want to run any time for 800m, simply run 200m at the same speed 4 times. Sounds silly, but it works for me. Endurance is important if you want to outlast the opposition but if you're hunting 800m times, I would suggest doing even 200m splits. Easiest way to work out what you could run 800m in is do a standing start 200m time test at 80% effort (make sure you run on the ball of your foot, don't run on your heels) after you've done a hard training session. Whatever that time is, will be the time you can reasonably expect to run 800m. Don't fool yourself by running more than 80% effort. Be focused and disciplined. Don't run erratically. Regards, Stephen

ThatAverageRunner wrote:

This isn't true. While it would be easier the faster you are, you don't need to be under 25 for a flying 200m to break 2.

I knew a guy who could (MAYBE) just barely break 25 in a flying 200m and he ran 1:57 in the 800m.

Maybe you don't have to quite break 25 with a flying start but there is a cutoff somewhere around there. I personally never ran with someone how broke 2:00 who wasn't significantly faster than that over 200m and I one doesn't even hear anecdotes about people with 26+ 200m times breaking 2-flat in the 800m. It just doesn't happen. Realistically 200m speed does limit your 800m.

Wow, I'm in the same exact boat. I'm junior, last year my 800 PR was 2:08 (in open 800 though) and my Mile PR is 4:56, and i took significant time (4:01) off my 5K

rudisha ran 80km-100km per week off season training dude so his aerobic capacity is fking crazy

ThatAverageRunner wrote:

This isn't true. While it would be easier the faster you are, you don't need to be under 25 for a flying 200m to break 2.

I knew a guy who could (MAYBE) just barely break 25 in a flying 200m and he ran 1:57 in the 800m.

That's correct. World class distance runners (3k-10k) can run 1:47-1:48 just off their great aerobic fitness. They might not run the first lap that fast, which is highly anaerobic, but don't drop much time in the second lap. Once they get going at a solid speed they just keep it up.

Drew Hunter ran 1:48 off 51s 400m speed in HS. Ingebrigtsen is around the same. These people just have phenomenal stamina due to threshold/CV training to make up for their lack of natural speed.