Khalid Khannouchi: Legitimate Reason for not even attempting to compete for the U.S. in the WC Helsinki Marathon?

Questionable wrote:

Good thing you didn't exagerate the facts.

I can conclude 1 of 2 things from your statement:

1. You didn't watch the marathon on NBC.

2. You are an idiot.

I lean towards number 2.

I never denied he began the race. That is an instance of your own dishonesty crafted to suit your dubious purpose.

He did not finish the race.

Dan Browne entered the stadium and stopped because his gastrocnemius seized up. He stopped to massage this muscle on his knees then staggered several times and continued limping.

Any further dispute is semantics and you have obscured the point. Browne is tough and destroyed his body to finish. Khannouchi dropped out because of heat, and even THAT was not 100+ degrees as in Athens.

Qualifying round and the final.

Keept trying. I find it amusing that, in your attempt to prove someone wrong, you fumble all over yourself and screw up even your own argument.

I agree with 2 out of 3 of your arguments. However, Dan Browne ran the marathon because of the bonus from USATF. No other reason. Please don't try to turn that into something noble.

Elden Campbell wrote:

I can conclude 1 of 2 things from your statement:

1. You didn't watch the marathon on NBC.

2. You are an idiot.

I lean towards number 2.

I did watch and he stopped to stretch his calf, no crawling or colapsing (that would be your exageration). Every thread has to deteriorate to name calling, that's mature.

I love KK. Best of luck to him. KK, be an American, go for the easy $.

Questionable wrote:

Every thread has to deteriorate to name calling, that's mature.

It was no mature when you began it yourself then criticized anyone else who stood up for themselves.

I'm not quite what "dubious purpose" you think I am trying to serve. I am not a particularly big fan of Khannouchi. All I was trying to do was to point out certain exagerrations and misstatements that have been made in this thread, the main one being that Khannouchi has never run in the WC for the USA. Obviously he has--you must be the only person in the world who thinks that when someone dnf's, they did not "run."

I was not trying to say that Dan Browne is not tough. All of those people who ran the marathon in Athens are incredibly tough. But if you are really so concerned about strict accuracy (like whether dnf'ing is "running" the race), then surely it wouldn't be so hard to admit that your description of Browne's entry to the stadium was a bit of an exagerration.

Finally, yes, I was wrong about the number of laps that Geb, and everyone else in the Atlanta 10K final, ran on that track.

Cat Fancy wrote:

I like how you corrected me after I had already corrected myself. You, my friend, are really on the ball.

I'm waiting for someone about 20 posts after this to mention my typo as well!

Don't be so touchy. If you check the times on the posts, it will be clear that I started typing my response before you corrected yourself. I was merely correcting the date, but agreeing with your main point.

Funny how amatuer runners are always the ones griping about how KK should do it for the good ol' U-S-of A! Have we ever heard other US elites call him out for being weak, greedy, or unpatriotic? I can't recall that ever being the case.

I have to take exception quite a few arguments on this thread. First, he is a professional runner and his primary obligation is to bank money for however long his career lasts. In light of his recent injury troubles, why chance the last six figure payday of your career by doing a freebie?

Secondly, the marathon kicks the crap out of you and takes a long time to recover from. That said and referencing my first point, why jeopardize a big fall payday from Chicago just to represent in Helsinki?

Next, the WC marathon is a second tier event. While it is a championship race, the field is not stacked with A-list talent. It has neither the significance and cache of the Oly 'thon nor is it as deep as London, NYC, Chicago, or a host of other world class events. The WC marathon is a poor cousin compared to WC competition on the track.

Lastly, if Team Khannouchi keeps trumpeting their patriotic desires while doing nothing to acheive them, that is their choice. It may seem disingenuous but it hasn't hampered his ability to make coin from appearance fees and sponsorships. So far, only a handful of Internet posters seem pissed about his alleged "hypocrisy" and since KK isn't hurting for cash, that should strongly indicate how much some people's grousing really matters.

Sir... this is a very dangerous place to say something so sensible. It is generally forbidden and I fear that you will be attacked for it. In an effort to take some of the attention of your own rational sentiments I will add some of my own:

SO... did anyone consider that KK is probably responsible for the financial well-being of a LOT of his relatives back home? I have no doubt that he supports many close and distant family members, and I PERSONALLY feel that it is a good judgement to put the well-being of his family AHEAD of pleasing his office-chair critics at letsrun.com.

What a load of crap! "KK did it for the childrens" "boofukinhooo"

BJP wrote:

SO... did anyone consider that KK is probably responsible for the financial well-being of a LOT of his relatives back home? I have no doubt that he supports many close and distant family members, and I PERSONALLY feel that it is a good judgement to put the well-being of his family AHEAD of pleasing his office-chair critics at letsrun.com.

Because who would wish to paint themselves as someone who attacks others at the elite level?

Culpepper, Meb, and Browne are all mild, well-mannered people who have overcome their own setbacks. They will not be taking on Khannouchi, though I am all but CERTAIN they have considered the same things about why he is not running the big championships.

Because it is a bloody CHAMPIONSHIP RACE! If you are an elite runner, how can your dream and your focus NOT be the Olympics?

Who else do you know who would toss out such nonsense? "Why not go for the money? After all, he's been injured and won't be paid for the Olympics."

NONSENSE. To satiate your financially oriented mind, have you considered the BATTLE between shoe companies that would ensue following an OLYMPIC GOLD MEDAL by an American distance runner?

So? That's the price of a well-run RACE.

Apparently you aren't "getting" the fact that a championship, because of its infrequency and its attraction of the BEST runners IN THE WORLD has INTRINSIC value that, for any champion hopeful, EXCEEDS the monetary value of a fall marathon.

Do you remember who the winner of the 1991 Chicago Marathon was, or the 1983 Boston Marathon, or the 1994 London Marathon, or the 1979 Rotterdam Marathon?

Probably not.

But you almost surely remember (speaking of the generic racing aficionado) that Shorter won in 1972, and that Plaatjes won in 1993, and that Meb won the silver in Athens.

Ha!

Let's take a look at the last 2:

2001 (Edmonton);

GEZAHENGE ABERA (Olympic Champion, 2:07 marathoner, outkicked Tergat in London)

SIMON BIWOTT (2:07:42 marathoner)

STEFANO BALDINI (OLYMPIC CHAMPION, even before 2001 was World Half Marathon CHAMPION, bronze medals in 2001 and 2003)

TESFAYE TOLA (Ethiopian, trains with Gebrselassie and Jifar, OLYMPIC BRONZE MEDALIST)

TESFAYE JIFAR (New York City Marathon WINNER and COURSE RECORD HOLDER (2:07:49))

ABDELKADER EL-MOUAZIZ (New York and London WINNER, beat Tergat, 2:06:52 marathoner)

That's ONLY Edmonton.

Now 2003 (Paris);

BALDINI (See above)

SHIGERU ABURAYA (2:07:52 marathoner, consistent performer at championships (5th at Edmonton))

IAN SYSTER (2:07:06 marathoner)

JAOUAD GHARIB, JULIO REY, and MICHAEL ROTICH are all solid, FAST marathoner with a lot of credentials I do not care to look up at this time.

As for your premise that the WC's lack "A-list talent," I suppose if A-list talent excludes OLYMPIC and major marathon champions and a host of 2:06-2:09 marathoners, then sure, there's no A-list talent (except for some of the best in the world).

But Khannouchi SKIPPED the Olympic marathon!

Wrong, wrong, so very wrong.

First, several hundred world class athletes would disagree with you.

Second, Khannouchi IS A MARATHONER. Would you have him hop into the 10,000 and get PUMMELED by Bekele and Gebrselassie?

AND THEY ARE BEING TAKEN TO TASK FOR IT.

Now I see. Moral legitimacy depends solely on ability to cash sponsor checks and "make coin." Pretty trashy motto. I would love to see you at the end of life counting bills adorned with fat presidents and considering what a "success" you were.

Wow. QUITE an exceptionally IDIOTIC referendum. Ask Wejo to poll about this on the front page and we will see.

It is tough to dicuss these things with someone whose ideological PINNACLE is money and nothing else.

I best go pop out a few million, return, and then earn your respect.

Not.

That doesn't answer the basic question. If Khannouchi did not/does not intend to represent the USA in international competitions, why make such a big deal of his desire to do so? He might very well have significant family commitments in Morocco, but, if making money is his primary goal, why even bother becoming a citizen? He already had his premanent resident status by marrying Sandra, so why spend the money to become a citizen?

Representing the US as a runner would not improve his chances of becoming a citizen, he was a virtual lock as soon as he married Sandra. It might have accelerated the process, but why worry about the timeframe if you aren't trying to meet the Sydney deadline anyway?

Representing the US as a runner evidently does not affect his income from NB and/or the major marathons. He hasn't represented the US very effectively and he seems to still be under contract to NB and receives top dollar both from London and, more significantly Chicago (who might conceivably benefit most from him being a US Olympian).

The one thing Khalid has achieved as a US citizen is being the US record marathon holder, which is about as significant as being the tiddly-winks world champion. There's probably more cachet (note to Sir Lurkalot) to being the Morrocan record holder.

So the question remains, why make such a big thing of wanting to run for the USA?

The answer is simple. The show companies will pay a whole lot more for an American they think is going to win the gold medal in the Olympic Marathon than a Moroccan. I'm sure he was laughing all the way to the bank.

That's exactly what I was going to say. Nike would hardly consider sponsoring KK if he was representing Morocco (in fact, that is regardless of whether or not he was running in the World Championships, Olympics, etc). By being a US citizen he is able to "be" the elite US marathon runner that his sponsors were looking for.

The good news for the KK haters and the self-proclaimed mr dufus is that his sponsors WILL be LESS inetersted in him as Culpepper, Meb, etc start to step up. Of course, that only makes it a MORE rational decision for him to focus on the big-money races now.

Dufus, I hardly see the need to waste any "cyber ink" on a response to your rant, but I will. If your aunts, uncles, grandparents, etc were dependent on YOUR paycheck would you really go running races for free (and/or less than you could make elsewhere)?

Elden Campbell wrote:

I really want to hear a real answer about this, not someone's spiel against Khannouchi.

I have seen no USATF official call Khalid out about this; how can he be training looking towards Chicago in early October yet not be working towards representing his own country in the MOST IMPORTANT marathon of the year, the World Championships in Helsinki?

Elden,

The "real" answer that you were looking for with your very first post is simply this:

The world championship marathon does not matter enough to Khannouchi to run it. Chicago and the payday he gets matter more to him than a world championship medal. He obviously believes that the money he's guaranteed to get from Chicago (plus the money he might earn if he wins/places) will total more than the money he might get IF he medals at the WCs.

The sentiments he posts on his website are public relations, nothing more.

While I'm a fan of expressing sentiments you don't mean, in the end I have no problem with any of this.

Average_Joe wrote:

While I'm a fan of expressing sentiments you don't mean,

That should have read:

"While I'm not a fan of expressing sentiments you don't mean"

You people really need to chill out. You're getting upset about comments that were made FOUR years ago. If that's the most important thing in your life right now that you have to make a post about it, well you need to make changes.

Elden Campbell wrote:

I really want to hear a real answer about this, not someone's spiel against Khannouchi.

I have seen no USATF official call Khalid out about this; how can he be training looking towards Chicago in early October yet not be working towards representing his own country in the MOST IMPORTANT marathon of the year, the World Championships in Helsinki?

The bottom line is that we should all be PROUD that we work tirelessly for nonprofit organizations promoting the good of this beautiful country. This, of course, is rather than chasing the "fatter paycheck" that we could make elsewhere.

May God bless letsrun.com message board posters and reward us for our endless pursuit of a greater and more unified US of A. It is an honor to share this board with so many people that do EVERYTHING in their power to promote the proud name of this country... and to make sure that it stays the greatest place on the face of George W. Bush's planet.

Shame on the selfish athletes that spend their lives in the pursuit of a bigger bank account.