rojo wrote:
Manning is far from the only one with stuff to answer here:
"Sly also named Ryan Howard, James Harrison, Julius Peppers, Ryan Zimmerman, and Mike Tyson as athletes to whom he supplied drugs, according to The Huffington Post."
Time for the NFL to bring in Ted Wells. He'll get to the bottom of this.
bravo rojo. I don't know how Americans can sleep at night. With the passing of time, the cracks in our society are growing... How oft are the cultural and moral critics and whistleblowers mocked and persecuted! There are people who do care about football (for example) and dedicated dreams and blood sweat tears and money to it. How about that young man who was paralyzed from the head down from a football accident? Meanwhile, phony Christians are filling the pews today for social reasons or to excuse themselves, while believing not or totally disrespecting the Saints of history... Saints that belong to religions beyond Christianity and to many times and places. These same people who disrespect humanity to brag about death or their shallow machismo.
Countenance the broken dreams and suffering of the innocent and meek with the fraud that is professional sports, with the greedy fat cats at the top taking all and the upper class, the middle class and lower middle class as pawns. Pawns for status or brainwashed with blue collar pride. That's the sporting culture and values we want to transmit to our children, that we are proud at calling American? That the American dream can come with a combination of luck plus ruthlessness and cheating, at the cost of many innocents? Celebrities making money off of endorsements they don't believe in, and "charity" work that is cookie-cutter bs just to look good.
There are people who are miserable everyday because they cannot get the opportunities they deserve and accumulate bad luck and injustice. There are people, in and out of uniform, through the ages, of our nation's history and beyond, who have made titanic sacrifices to get us to where we are today...
It's nonsense, and you all know it. But, no, let all the elite puffery proliferate on these boards. Block the whistleblowers on fb, hide behind phony social media. Hide and deny, worse than cowards because at least cowards have a semblance of a conscience... It's not an accident. Many runners out there are complete phonies in terms of social justice conscience, religion, American values, etc. Many of them continue to be friends with known dopers, thugs and all manners of ruthless reckless disgusting people because that's the name of the game, to be as greedy as possible and have as many linkedin connections or fb friends or instagram followers as possible. Plausible deniability and excuses is what they will cling to, to the end...
rojo wrote:
MM3307 wrote:The story was interesting but I wouldn't call it explosive. The most sensational allegations come from drug dealers who are trying to make themselves sound like a big deal to a potential client. I am sure there are grains of truth there but some of it sounds like he was embellishing. The fact that PEDs are not difficult to obtain and that there are unscrupulous doctors willing to help athletes cheat isn't news.
Are you guys crazy? For me this is HUGE news.
Dora the Agoraphobiac wrote:
Who cares about doping in football? I wouldn't be surprised if 95% of professional football players are on something.
Your attitude is beyond me. I'm sure tons of people think the same thing about track. The key is to get people to care about doping in track, football, baseball, etc. Your attitude is killing our sport.
To me, the key to the future of all sports is for WADA to handle testing for everything. WIth the money of the NFL, MLB behind it, they could do a real good job instead of us having sham testing like we do now in the pro team sports.
Now, it's important to note that one of the doctors says he made up names to try to impress clients:
http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/14441114/documentary-links-peyton-manning-other-pro-athletes-use-peds?ex_cid=espntwBut how could people think this isnt' an EXPLOSIVE story when the names of Ryan Howard, Payton Manning, etc are in it. To put some of the drug focus back on the NFL - where I assume illegal drug usage is worse than track and field - and maybe the MLB is huge.
Are you just playing dumb, Rojo? Have you seen a guy who plays NFL in person before? Nobody looked like that 30 years ago when steroid use was very much rampant. Can anyone with functioning eye balls truly believe there is a single clean person in the NFL? Even the kickers are usually more jacked than running backs were 30 years ago.
Sport is a reflection of our society, not the opposite. To be sure, our society is jacked on all sorts of drugs. If you think WADA with it's almost non-existent budget is going to combat that, you are very naive.
Take all the drugs out of football and you know what happens? People start watching another sport that isn't regulated. This is happening with cycling right now. It's not exciting anymore. It's happened to T&F already.
If you want to be an entertainer you better understand you are joining the circus and things happen behind stage that the audience is not supposed to know about.
The show must go on.
Con Mans wrote:
theohiostate wrote:Ari Fleischer has been retained to speak in behalf of Manning. He's calling Liam Collins, the British hurdler who went undercover, as a "well-known con man."
Ahem, all agents are con men/women. That is how they maximize contract values for their clients.
I know that. Posted that line while rolling my eyes.
Ballsface wrote:
theohiostate wrote:Manning does admit to have been treated at the Guyer Clinic for nutrient therapy, oxygen therapt and "holistic treatments."
Charlie Sly, the pharmacist who worked for the Guyer Clinic, said he supplied hgh to Peyton's wife Ashley.
There also has been no denial from Manning's agent that hgh was supplied to Ashley Manning. Instead, the term "medical privacy" was used.
Ari Fleischer has been retained to speak in behalf of Manning. He's calling Liam Collins, the British hurdler who went undercover, as a "well-known con man."
Charlie Sly has since recanted his story, claiming that he went through a vulnerable period following the death of his fiance. He also said he said those things to test out the legitimacy of Liam Collins.
This thing is not going to go away quietly. Hoping Manning is innocent.
"Hoping Manning is innocent"? Seriously? That seems like a really naive approach given the state of the modern sporting world. I'm more like, if all Manning was trying to do was get some drugs that would extend his playing career and help him recover from a serious neck injury, that hardly casts him as a villain. Given the nature of the NFL, that's almost his duty. Not saying that he hasn't been using all along, but come on - do you really think this type of thing is anything other than business as usual in the NFL?
I'm more interested in whether there were any track athletes named. Sadly, I'm thinking maybe not, because the guy (Sly) wouldn't have mentioned them because he didn't even know who the heck they were.
Anyway, I don't look at this as a story of, you know, wow! Look what a bad guy Peyton Manning actually is...and Ryan Howard, etc. What bad apples! It's more along the lines of contributing to ripping the facade off the modern sporting world, where just about everybody is doing this type of thing.
Yep. Hoping Manning is innocent.
Do I have my doubts? Unfortunately, yes.
All American football players have brain damage and they abuse drugs.
All fans of American football have brain damage and they abuse drugs.
Football players are abusing steroids and human growth hormone, and football fans are abusing alcohol and prescription drugs.
It is a perfect match. It is a crazy sport for crazy people.
I cannot believe that anyone in the USA in not aware that steroids are part and parcel of American football. The USA education system cannot be that bad.
Abrahamist Nut Job families like the Mannings are the worst people on the Planet Earth.
1000 wrote:
It is a perfect match. It is a crazy sport for crazy people.
I cannot believe that anyone in the USA in not aware that steroids are part and parcel of American football. The USA education system cannot be that bad.
So, how are things in Europe going? Enjoying the futboll & Heineken while shouting racist comments?
rojo wrote:
Dora the Agoraphobiac wrote:Who cares about doping in football? I wouldn't be surprised if 95% of professional football players are on something.
Your attitude is beyond me. I'm sure tons of people think the same thing about track. The key is to get people to care about doping in track, football, baseball, etc. Your attitude is killing our sport.
You misunderstood me. It's not that I don't care about doping; I'd be all for lifetime bans for cheaters. But when drug testing in major (and minor) sports is such an obvious joke, there's no need to pretend like it's breaking news that the top guys are on something. It's the norm.
The reality is that people don't truly care about doping. They want to see gigantic meatheads who can barely read destroy each other and make spectacular plays. If you take away drugs, the sport becomes less entertaining. Therefore, it is in the NFL's best interest for its players (especially the most marketable ones) to be roided-out freaks who can take/deliver a tremendous beating once a week for months on end. They will never seriously test for drugs. My "attitude" is not killing track or any other sport; basic economics and greed already did that decades ago.
old news wrote:
So, how are things in Europe going? Enjoying the futboll & Heineken while shouting racist comments?
Racist? Are you drunk?
Brain damage is a serious problem in American football. Drastic action should have been taken years ago. To make the problem dramatically worse, steroids and human growth hormone are rampant in the NFL. This means that the impact forces in tackles are significantly higher than they should be.
Any football player that is caught using potent drugs like steroids and human growth hormone should be sent to prison.
Anyone that supports American football should be ashamed of himself or herself. The truth always hurts.
My claim that all football fans are alcoholics and drug abusers is an exaggeration, but a certain proportion of football fans fit this definition.
My claim that all football fans have brain damage in not an accurate statement, but there is something obviously wrong with any individual that could provide financial support to such a messed up sport.
Rugby is not a huge sport in Europe, but like American football, it has a huge problem with steroids and human growth hormone.
Balian wrote:
QB's playing well into their late 30's? Come on!
I knew George Blanda was on sumthin'
;-)
Bourbon, most likely.
Does this surprise anyone?
Tens and, in some cases, hundreds of millions of dollars are on the line.
Of course they are doping.
Football, basketball, baseball, hockey - all laboratories of human ability augmentation.
Just as easily added to the list: athletics, futbol, tennis, golf, indy car.
If you see their face on tv they are probably on something. If you hear their name mentioned they are definitely on something.
I knows this breaks the heart of little fan boys like the brojos but we need to stop worshiping cheaters and call them for what they are.
I got to be honest I think this is very shoddy journalism.
When you publish anything alleging PED use you better have some facts to back it up and from what I see they don't have any. They have the word of a guy who has come out and said what he told the undercover reporter was embellished. Linking people to PED's ruins reputations and you better be pretty sure before you do. They may be right and maybe Manning and the others are dirty but from the what they've presented I'm not seeing anything solid to stand behind.
Primo Numero Uno wrote:
I got to be honest I think this is very shoddy journalism.
When you publish anything alleging PED use you better have some facts to back it up and from what I see they don't have any.
Oh please. Unless the needle is in Manning's arm during a game on the field it didn't happen.
Denials all around with a few personal attacks, and lawyers making it rain documents.
Someone needs to explain who Ari Fliescher is and why he matters? Lance Armstrong had plenty of defenders too...
More doping stories to come in 2016. Wake me up when NCAA ball sports get perp walked.
1000 wrote:
All American football players have brain damage and they abuse drugs.
All fans of American football have brain damage and they abuse drugs.
Football players are abusing steroids and human growth hormone, and football fans are abusing alcohol and prescription drugs.
It is a perfect match. It is a crazy sport for crazy people.
I cannot believe that anyone in the USA in not aware that steroids are part and parcel of American football. The USA education system cannot be that bad.
^
Dora the Agoraphobiac wrote:
You misunderstood me. It's not that I don't care about doping; I'd be all for lifetime bans for cheaters. But when drug testing in major (and minor) sports is such an obvious joke, there's no need to pretend like it's breaking news that the top guys are on something. It's the norm.
The news isn't that they are doping, The news is that it's finally out in the open and the public will need to face the facts.
You seriously don't know who Ari Fleischer is? Have you been living under a rock?
Gonna have a tough time proving this. The primary source recanted totally - the tape of his recantation was on TV tonight.
NFL doesn't want its signature wholesome hall-of-famer busted. Advertisers don't want a scandal. No problem for Manning to defeat half-assed accusations, especially since no real follow-up investigation will be done. Lance made enemies and usada had motivation to make an example of him. In this case, everyone wins if nothing happens.
Manning is too big to fail.
They can put an asterisk next to his name and everyone else's in 15 years if anyone cares about PEDs in the NFL by then.