Galen Rupp... guts - respect.

rojo wrote:

The problem people have with the NOP is 2nd part of your statement. How do you legally suddenly develop world class speed and then lose it? Seriously, how do you do it? Many argue pharmaceuticals and that's why the androgel accusations are so alarming for many. When Semenya is pumped full of testosterone, she's a world beater. When she's not, she's not.

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C'mon rojo, that's ridiculous. In case you forgot, the Magness/BBC, etc accusation-story-line on Rupp is a cheater goes like this: Rupp has been getting testosterone since HS. If testosterone is what gives him his kick, then why didn't he have that superb kick all along?

And you have no evidence he has suddenly lost his kick. He's lost a small bit of fitness which has him completely spent in hard races, so he is unable to respond/kick on the final lap when the pace quickens. No matter how good someone's speed/kick potentially is, they ain't kicking/finishing fast if they've already burned everything in their tank before the final lap. You know as well as anyone else that it's one freshness at the end of a race (due to incredible endurance/fitness) that allows one to throw down a great final lap moreso than just having some good pure speed. You need both, but without the former, the latter ain't happening .

rojo wrote:

For 2009, the IAAF reports that the temps were 25 celsius with 44% humidity so that's 77 degrees. .... Last night, the weather was officially reported as 26 celsius and 61% humidity so that's 78.8 degrees (So you can see why people still don't put Farah in Bekele's class).

I'm not claiming Farah is in Bekele's class but I want point out 1) I think those are significant humidity differences; 2) 61% humidity means it feels several degrees hotter than it is.

We can use the humidity to calculate the heat index. The heat index is, defined by NOAA as, "a measure of how hot it really feels when relative humidity is factored in with the actual air temperature."

Using this NWS calculator:

The heat index for the 2009 race was 76 F

The heat index for last night is 81 F.

That seems substantial.

The weather in Rio will definitely be better.

The head coach of the Ethiopians probably didn't sleep well tonight. His best guy was 50 seconds behind Mo and 45 behind Rupp. Not to mention all of the Kenyans.

This is the distance the Ethiopians consider to be theirs; Jifter, Gebreselassie, Bekele, Jeilan - before the arrival of Mo they only lost one gold medal since the early 90s.

But today their best guy was just seconds away from being lapped...

Definitely a stellar performance in those conditions. And who knows, maybe he'll get bumped up a few spots when the kenyans are actually drug tested year round like americans.

Just got out of a hospital today. All I saw was winner, Mo like 27:02, and Galen like 27:08! I'd SAY HE DID FREAKIN AMAZING. I remember Geb and Bekele winning these big worlds at 27:03 and 04.

How do you legally develop speed and the lose it?

Quit your nonsense. Thats hate baiting, a true and proven brojo mechanism.

Hey former Coach....

Stop your nonsense.

I know your former athletes , and many were active recreational drug and PED users.

Once again Rupp amazes with his grit and mental toughness to run one of the greatest races of his career...and Rojo comes back with his nonsense. I have to question how Rojo can live with himself. The bitterness and jealousy must be all-consuming--not a healthy way to live. Let's just appreciate what we just saw from the greatest American distance runner of all time.

the beijing track is FAST!!!!!

but you never want heat for a good distance run.

i think the top group with moe can run at least 26:30 in perfect conditions.

probably rupp's effort was about the same or a bit better than his AR.

i hope he has something left for the remainder of the season.

i am curious what the boy can do.

Yes. wrote:

Definitely a stellar performance in those conditions. And who knows, maybe he'll get bumped up a few spots when the kenyans are actually drug tested year round like americans.

Except there were no "conditions". It was full shade and 78 degrees with a slight breeze. That's good running conditions.

Stressball wrote:

To comment on your "How do you legally suddenly develop world class speed and then lose it? Seriously, how do you do it? " statement: Have you ever considered that a prolonged period of public ridicule that escalated during the most important training period of the track season could induce a level of stress of a sufficient proportion to interrupt training and thereby negatively influence race performance? Stop trying to plant seeds, Rojo. For once.

This⬆️

Stressball wrote:

To comment on your "How do you legally suddenly develop world class speed and then lose it? Seriously, how do you do it? " statement: Have you ever considered that a prolonged period of public ridicule that escalated during the most important training period of the track season could induce a level of stress of a sufficient proportion to interrupt training and thereby negatively influence race performance? Stop trying to plant seeds, Rojo. For once.

Suddenly stopping the use of PEDs due to an investigation by USADA into one's training group could also negatively influence performance.

Seriously Rojo. Your comment about Rupp suddenly obtaining world class speed is shockingly misinformed. First of all he had good speed for a long distance runner even when Salazar first started coaching him in high school. Around 08' Salazar began focusing on honing Rupp's kick to be able to eventually win medals. That speed work continued through 2012.

The ridiculous thing is that for about 3 years on this board (09'-11") the standard compliant about Rupp was his "sit and kick" tactics to win races against low level American runners. Yet you are saying he suddenly obtained world class speed? Really? Rupp's 2012 season was much more about how strong he looked.

As for Rupp losing speed. The jury is out on how much he has really lost. I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if he displays a pretty good kick in the 5000M or in a DL race later in the year. IMO he will beat True. And in so much as he has lost speed it certainly hasn't been sudden.

Irk wrote:

Agree x 10 wrote:

We need a temperature and humidity measurement from inside the stadium as it was likely warmer insider than outside.

Why likely? Isn't it just as likely that there was shade in parts of the stadium?

Everyone keeps saying "the heat and humidity". Did anyone actually see measurements for these or is this just something we're assuming?

Farah was pouring water over his head and making expressions about how hot it was right before the start. He also took a drink during the race

Reflective heat and shelter from wind will mean the temperature inside the stadium was higher than outside

Rupp ran well considering Salazar almost burnt him out with those ridiculous post race workouts.

You only have to look at the marathon results to see how tough the conditions were out there

Irk wrote:

Agree x 10 wrote:

We need a temperature and humidity measurement from inside the stadium as it was likely warmer insider than outside.

Why likely? Isn't it just as likely that there was shade in parts of the stadium?

Everyone keeps saying "the heat and humidity". Did anyone actually see measurements for these or is this just something we're assuming?

Paula Radcliffe on the BBC commentary said it was 25 Celsius 65% humidity at the start.

Reality calling wrote:

Yes. wrote:

Definitely a stellar performance in those conditions. And who knows, maybe he'll get bumped up a few spots when the kenyans are actually drug tested year round like americans.

Except there were no "conditions". It was full shade and 78 degrees with a slight breeze. That's good running conditions.

Seriously? You think 78.8 degrees with 61% humidity is good running conditions? That is oppressive. The best runners in the world were taking water in a race that lasts less than 30 minutes.

Rojo - This was a remarkable insight:

"No one really gave him props as his 6th place finish only got him 6th"

rojo wrote:

The problem people have with the NOP is 2nd part of your statement. How do you legally suddenly develop world class speed and then lose it? Seriously, how do you do it? Many argue pharmaceuticals and that's why the androgel accusations are so alarming for many. When Semenya is pumped full of testosterone, she's a world beater. When she's not, she's not.

1) Rupp has always had great top end speed, better than Farah according to Salazar. He's just lacked the strength to use it. Rupp's ability to sprint isn't at question; his ability to sprint after running within a second per lap of PR pace is the issue.

2) Being sharp in terms of speed comes and goes. You can't replicate everything perfectly every season, or else everyone who stayed healthy would PR every year.

3) Rupp was allegedly using that stuff since HS, so there's no reason it would be connected to a sudden improvement in kicking speed much later in Rupp's development (that would more closely follow the pattern of aerobic development I described in my first point, where Rupp is now strong enough to tap into that speed at the end of fast races).

4) Rupp lost some of that strength this winter when he had that virus; he simply may not have been able to put in the work this training cycle.

gdm wrote:

He definitely earned his participation trophy. Just like all the other runners.

Really, Nimrod? Because that group of 5 gapped the field by 30+ seconds and lapped have the runners. The other two Americans lagged in together 70 seconds back. The group of 5 were clearly in a class by themselves.

Slivery Slope wrote:

Once again Rupp amazes with his grit and mental toughness to run one of the greatest races of his career...and Rojo comes back with his nonsense. I have to question how Rojo can live with himself. The bitterness and jealousy must be all-consuming--not a healthy way to live. Let's just appreciate what we just saw from the greatest American distance runner of all time.

Drugs and NOP apologists aside Rupp wasn't overly brave out there. He sucked off the other runners (Kenyans) for 24 laps and got outkicked. But rojo hain't too bright if he thinks getting outkicked in a world championship final--off an honest pace--is sign that he once took drugs and now isn't. Just a dumb statement.

Meanwhile, NOP apologists you make me sick. Go find your rock and crawl under it.