Lance Armstrong at Center of Cycling's Most Sophisticated Doping Program, Officials Charge

agog wrote:

What does the report say?

In a nutshell?

In a nutshell--it says Lance was that the center of a massive doping conspiracy. He not only doped himself with a variety of substances but he also acquired and distributed substances for his team to dope. He threatened to kick them off the team if they did not follow the Dr. Ferrari approved doping schedule. It states that he fraudulently had a positive test covered up for corticosteroid in the 1999 TdF. He also had inside information and tip-offs to avoid testing.

In short, it says a lot of things that were already known but supports these facts with lots of witness testimony and evidence.

Those are the big things, but it is 200 pages so it is hard to summarize in a nutshell.

Thanks Mr Obvious. It seems to me as though LA is a total control freak? I suppose most successful team leaders are?

He said she says does not work for me.

I wanna see the murder weapon, finger prints and dna.

In that case OJ did it and should be locked up or on death row for the murder of those 2.

agog wrote:

Thanks Mr Obvious. It seems to me as though LA is a total control freak? I suppose most successful team leaders are?

Yes he is, that has been known about Lance for a long time.

Here is one link (among many) to the full report:

George Hincapie quote..."Generally Aware" What does that Mean? Some dought?....not sure?....why don't George just come out and say it?.....MAKE IT PLAIN!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I see the smokeing gun, but need more just smoke, where is the gun and bullets?..or maybe smoke is fake, like a you see in night clubs, a machine producting smoke, it didnt come from a gun.

That's a lot to read, and I won't be printing it out.

I won't read it though. I think that the whole subject of performance enhancing drugs is a load of old tosh.

I thought the part about using saline injections to flush out the system was interesting.

If everyone in your sport is doing it, it really isn't cheating.

This statement oozes some much ignorance it makes me want to vomit all over your face.

He was probably being ironic? But really, the more people blathered on and on about EPO, the more people wanted to take it, and surprise surprise, the more doctors were willing to get involved in administering it.

Hincape says that he hasn't doped in six years, and that he's still been able to compete at the highest levels since then.

What kind of advantage was he getting from doping?

Years before Armstrong, just viewing the continually additional physical effort demanded on the Tour, I assumed that all the cyclists must be on ‘something.’

Never bothered me much, it wasn’t my sport and anyway, I had great pleasure watching that race, especially up and down those mountains.

So I’m a bit baffled about all this uproar over Armstrong, why did anyone imagine he was different, other than the fact he kept winning!

I do think though, these days, with the continual drug testing, most of them probably are clean - the times up the mountains are a lot slower and I’d be shocked if, for instance, Wiggins was found to have taken performance enhancers.

He’d have to emigrate from Britain if it was found he did - would he chance that?

theohiostate wrote:

Hincape says that he hasn't doped in six years, and that he's still been able to compete at the highest levels since then.

What kind of advantage was he getting from doping?

He was 14th overall and won a mountain stage in 2005, in 2006 he was 31st overall. After that I don't believe he had any GC ambitions.

Lionheart. wrote:

Years before Armstrong, just viewing the continually additional physical effort demanded on the Tour, I assumed that all the cyclists must be on ‘something.’

Never bothered me much, it wasn’t my sport and anyway, I had great pleasure watching that race, especially up and down those mountains.

So I’m a bit baffled about all this uproar over Armstrong, why did anyone imagine he was different, other than the fact he kept winning!

I do think though, these days, with the continual drug testing, most of them probably are clean - the times up the mountains are a lot slower and I’d be shocked if, for instance, Wiggins was found to have taken performance enhancers.

He’d have to emigrate from Britain if it was found he did - would he chance that?

The issue is LA systematically LEAD younger riders into doping. He in effect threatened their livelihood. "If you don't dope, you won't be on the team." So the excuse of everyone was doing it is a cop out.

theohiostate wrote:

Hincape says that he hasn't doped in six years, and that he's still been able to compete at the highest levels since then.

What kind of advantage was he getting from doping?

You believe the words of a cheater?

Hincapie continued doping after 2006, no doubt.

He is arguing to have stopped doping in 2006 to protect his image. He and the others would get a longer suspension than until spring (what kind of suspension is that btw???) if he had admitted doping until 2011 or 2012. Maybe he wants a job in the cycling industry after the end of his career.

You only admit as much as is known anyway.

Probably those guys all met and discussed what to admit and what not.

Hmmmmmmmmmm wrote:

If everyone in your sport is doing it, it really isn't cheating.

True, there would be no unfair advantage if everyone was cheating together. Still, doesn't make ir right.

Look, Lance did not win 7 tour titles because he took EPO. He won because he was training harder than anyone in the world. He was going into the gym and developing incredible strength in his legs and putting out massive wattage on the stationary bike that made going up the Alpe 'duhez at 17 miles per hour feel easy in comparison. The europeans did not believe in that stuff, which is why Lance beat them even though they were juiced too.

For me it comes down to this; his foundation for cancer has been incredibly successful, but would it have been if he had not won 7 titles? I say no, and having a wife that has beat cancer I am willing to give him a pass on his PED history.

free pass for Lance wrote:

For me it comes down to this; his foundation for cancer has been incredibly successful,

Successful at what?

Exactly. Which breakthrough cancer cures has Armstrong's money contributed to?

Even if he has given millions a better feeling through his Foundation, he remains a FRAUD. Wealth built upon a fraud. Same ad Madoff, same to me as any other Wall Street crook, or executive like Ken Lay. All had Foundations and did good things through charitable work. But still Frauds.

zzzzzzzzzzzzz, this is boringly old. Who cares about Lance. When do we find out exactly how he cleared all those drug controls, I mean that is the real conspiracy part right? If he did it then, what is stopping others from doing it now? Even most of the recent Tour winners have been dopers as well. Contador?