Ryan Hall vs. Yohan Blake in a 1k Steeple?
Ryan Hall vs. Yohan Blake in a 1k Steeple?
Kenenisa Bekele vs. Jordan Hasay in the hammer throw?
Felix if she trained ~6 weeks or so for it.
As far as the Kiprop vs Kirani James comparison that is ridiculous. Kiprop has proven 800m speed and can probably run a 46 400m split in peak shape. I'd give Jenny maybe a 54 on a relay leg.
Even endurance withstanding, it is hard to make up a 6s differential over 400m in an 800m (AF runs 48r). Maybe a better analogy would be Kirani James vs Ryan Hall (given that Ryan could split 50 in HS) or something like that.
Another way to word this, is most runners who run 48r 400m would beat 54r 400m runners in an 800m with some/any endurance training. Obviously, some people are maxed out at 400m, but I doubt Felix is one of them.
'Another way to word this, is most runners who run 48r 400m would beat 54r 400m runners in an 800m with some/any endurance training. Obviously, some people are maxed out at 400m, but I doubt Felix is one of them.'
Then how you most 8oom champions have 400m pr's of 53 or 54 surely some 2nd rate sprinter at 51/52 would step up and beat them
They don't because they are sprinters and not middle distance runners
Of course some can make the transistion but it would take years, to think someone can do this in 6 weeks shows you know nothing about running
I want a snack wrote:
26mi235 wrote:(Jenny's PR is 1:59 and she only runs it occasionally).
Her Pr is 2:01.
Opps, my bad, I thought that she had run a 1:59-high
ukathleticscoach wrote:
They don't because they are sprinters and not middle distance runners
Of course some can make the transistion but it would take years, to think someone can do this in 6 weeks shows you know nothing about running
You have no earthly idea how Allyson Felix trains and what she is capable of. I guess you've never heard of Alberto Juantorena. Allyson Felix is not some punk who can run 50xx but does not train. Felix ran 49.59 in a WC final and she does not even belong in the discussion with some pimple-faced adolescent who can run 50xx off the basketball court. Felix is capable of running under 2 minutes for 800, and it would not take "years and years" of additional training. She is already a well trained athlete, so she would just need to tweak her training a bit.
Aw shut the eff up. You L.A. trolls come on here and brag of your two dozen medals from Daegu. Go suck on a soccer ball.
I think that Felix could go sub 2 in the 800m next year if she trained for it. We had very successful speed based 800m runners in the women's just a few years ago and in the men's back in the 80s and 90s. Not sure what happened to them but Felix looks like she could do it, not with a dilettantish race with little training, but with serious training. And then maybe she would get down to 1:56.
TrackCoach wrote:
Allyson like Wariner whose name also comes up in 800m conversations, both of these athletes are (true) sprinters as in built for speed. They both have good sprint endurance and are slightly built, which suggest they could probably run decent 800m, but I am certain no where near the level of what they could run in sprint. There really is a physiological difference between a sprinter and middle diatance runners; with that said, JennyB would eat Allyson alive in an 800.
If Allyson ran an 800m at a 2 flat pace, the 1st 400 would seen like an interval workout, the next 200 would feel like a race and the last 200m would not be pretty. The last 200m will feel like what all 800m feel like at that point, except Allyson would have only known that feeling driving to the finish line in a last 50m of 400m. The 800 is the only race where when you start to redline is when the race begins. Unless you have trained for it and is mentally perpared, the 800m can be an absolute beast being as tied as you can be at 600m and the finish line is at the opposite end of the track.
Btw, the only sprinters I have seen successfully run the 800m are are 400m specialist; I have seen world class 100/200/400 types who can't run under a 5 minute mile.
Well spoken, sir. I couldn't agree more in my own personal experience. Our 200/400 guys were talking about how easy it would be to just run two 55's. they could both run 46's, so why not? they ran like 159 apiece while our 10k guy ran a 150.
Another Lunatic wrote:
Kenenisa Bekele vs. Jordan Hasay in the hammer throw?
Bekele.
to the OP: I'm not familiar with your previous posts, so I don't know if you are serious or not. I like the thread idea, but after reading your responses I'm not quite sure your aren't joking. It seems you spend quite a bit of time thinking of how to incorporate your SAT words into self promotion and putting down others, going beyond the realm of a normal troll. The reason you become the topic of your own threads isn't because you are interesting or intelligent, but because people react to you in the same way they react to other annoying people who are wrong. If you are in fact a troll, brilliant job.
Regarding your ideas about the drug abusing previous world record holder: If she was on drugs, you must retract your argument, plain and simple. Reasons- she could have taken EPO or some other drug increasing endurance performance, in conjunction with power and speed drugs. This completely obscures the time progression plot going up distances because it is not indicative of actual human performances, and there are no empirical data to measure drug users progression vs. a null model here. You are then left comparing apple's and orange's, poor scientific (and even speculative) form. The only argument you are left with is that if allyson felix took the same drugs she may be capable of similar times (if's and may's are weak and don't help arguments much).
On a larger note, there is much more evidence suggesting that 200/400 athletes are not capable of competing in the 800m. I've seen it so many times, as have most other track and field fans. Where there is room for debate is true 400m specialists running the half, as other posters have mentioned. Here I have seen 46 guys run 151, and there is argument for them having shots against steeple/1500 runners.
newsclues wrote:
Regarding your ideas about the drug abusing previous world record holder: If she was on drugs, you must retract your argument, plain and simple. Reasons- she could have taken EPO or some other drug increasing endurance performance, in conjunction with power and speed drugs. This completely obscures the time progression plot going up distances because it is not indicative of actual human performances, and there are no empirical data to measure drug users progression vs. a null model here. You are then left comparing apple's and orange's, poor scientific (and even speculative) form. The only argument you are left with is that if allyson felix took the same drugs she may be capable of similar times (if's and may's are weak and don't help arguments much).
"You are then left comparing apple's and orange's..."
Really? You are appraising my enormous intellectual firepower with this vacuous verbiage. What exactly are the apples and oranges possessing?
That; and all others grammatical mistake's aside: address's the larger, more, important statement's, please../'
newsclues wrote:
That; and all others grammatical mistake's aside: address's the larger, more, important statement's, please../'
OK, so you are continuing with the mistakes...I will cut you some slack.
Now, to the substance of one of your assertions. I will preface my remarks by mentioning that my point regarding Krotch was only an assertion which negated some assertions that Felix was too fast at the short sprints to run a decent 800. Even without Krotch, that assertion is ludicrous on its face. However, moving to Krotch...I don't believe that the insinuations people have made regarding Krotch possibly using PEDs has much to do with any EPO type agents, but rather anabolic steroids or human growth hormone type agents. There is no reason to assume that her progression in running 100 meters through 800 meters is being disproportionately impacted at one distance or the other. I would say that if you look at her performance curve, it is fair to say that any PEDs she may have taken would have helped in all of her events, and thus, it is not clear how this would provide a fatal flaw in drawing potential comparisons with another (even if clean) athlete's range of potential performance distribution. However, if you're implying that she was using PEDs during the year she ran her 400 and 800 pbs, and not using during the earlier years when she ran her 100 and 200 pbs, this would be a factor but it is all unknown. It is not clear that a PED using Krotch provides no foundation in which to compare another athlete's (even if clean) possible performance distribution. This is not tantamount to saying the clean athlete would necessarily have the same quality of performances, but to say that the distribution of relative strength across the range from 100 to 800 is not necessarily impacted in any significant manner.
As usual, not funny.
The fact that you think most women 800m champions can only muster a 53-54 shows you kow nothing of running. Secondly, my example was a 6 second differential in 400m times. The idea you posed is for a 51-52 400m runner to move up....we aren't talking about a 2nd rate sprinter as you put it. We are talking about a top runner in the event below.
Lastly, everyone has seen the 400m guy run an 800 with no training and die hard in the 2nd lap because the first lap was at a ridiculous pace but we've also all seen runners run more than one 800m and drop huge time.
No way Jenny Simpson ~54 400m runner can beat Allyson Felix 48r if AF trained for an 800m.
jjjjjjjjjj wrote:
We had very successful speed based 800m runners in the women's just a few years ago and in the men's back in the 80s and 90s.
Were any of them national champions in the 100m like Felix was?
jjjjjjjjjj wrote: Not sure what happened to them but Felix looks like she could do it, not with a dilettantish race with little training, but with serious training. And then maybe she would get down to 1:56.
So you are saying that a person who was national champ in the 100, and best 200 runner in the world could go on to become national record holder in the 800?? Has this EVER happened in the history of sport? No.
So you are confidently predicting something that, again, has NEVER COME CLOSE to happening in the history of sport. Now of course once she runs 1:56, she could clearly run under 4:00 in the 1500, right? I mean, how could a 1:56 800 runner NOT run 4:00 in the 1500? And once you run 4:00 in the 1500, even with bad endurance, one should be able to run, oh, let's say 15:30 in the 5k, right? That's almost a minute slower than Shalane, so not that fast. And if she can run 15:30 for 5k, then she's GOT to be able to run under 2:30 for the marathon, at least, right?
So, based on your logic, I'd say, give Felix a year, and she could run 2:25 in the marathon.
How'd I do? Did I make some sense?
'I guess you've never heard of Alberto Juantorena.'
The exception that proves the rule
'Felix is capable of running under 2 minutes for 800, and it would not take "years and years" of additional training. She is already a well trained athlete, so she would just need to tweak her training a bit.'
Well done, you also know nothing about running. Like I said why does some 51 second girl just tweak her training a bit more and win gold?
Another Lunatic wrote:
Kenenisa Bekele vs. Jordan Hasay in the hammer throw?
Best ever. Will this be on HBO? I'd pay for it.
Doclove wrote:
'I guess you've never heard of Alberto Juantorena.'
The exception that proves the rule
'Felix is capable of running under 2 minutes for 800, and it would not take "years and years" of additional training. She is already a well trained athlete, so she would just need to tweak her training a bit.'
Well done, you also know nothing about running. Like I said why does some 51 second girl just tweak her training a bit more and win gold?
Juantorena was not one of the best 200m runners in the world.
He was a 400/800 guy, Felix is a 200/400 runner. Big difference.