ventolin^3 wrote:
that just leaves the 400 - believe it or not, he might not have cracked 51 !
I don't even know how to respond to this.
I've run under 51 for a 400m. KB is much faster than I ever was.
Now, I won't jump on the crazy train and start predicting 47's for him, but to suggest he couldn't break 51 is absurd.
Could even hicham wrote:
Who would be more likely to be able to do this workout? Bekele or El G?
El G could maybe do that workout.
READ
AND
REALISE
16x (400 in 52-54, rest, 200 in 24-25) w/ 90sec-2min rest is NOT the workout.
The workout is "16 alternating 400 and 200"
i.e. 8x (400, 200)
Look at the heart rate graph...There are 16 peaks
That is long ass rest after 400's and especially 200's...
NOT a hard workout, heart rate barely breaks 170bpm...
bdog wrote:
16x (400 in 52-54, rest, 200 in 24-25) w/ 90sec-2min rest is NOT the workout.
The workout is "16 alternating 400 and 200"
i.e. 8x (400, 200)
Look at the heart rate graph...There are 16 peaks
Christ people are stupid, hope salazar cleared that one up for stevey...
Now that is believable.
WAKE UP wrote:
READ
AND
REALISE
16x (400 in 52-54, rest, 200 in 24-25) w/ 90sec-2min rest is NOT the workout.
The workout is "16 alternating 400 and 200"
i.e. 8x (400, 200)
Look at the heart rate graph...There are 16 peaks
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-5KZl_0asFVE/TXMV6KDu12I/AAAAAAAAAIQ/wcHNc6DX76o/s1600/Bekele+Training+workout.PNGThat is long ass rest after 400's and especially 200's...
NOT a hard workout, heart rate barely breaks 170bpm...
The HRM graph it´s not from the workout for sure.
HR barely breaks 170 but do you knowwhats Bekele maximum HR ? 178 precisely. Bekele herat rate at rest 32.
Bekele has said in a an interview, on camera no less, that he can run 49 seconds for 400m. Why is that so hard for people to believe? He's the greatest 5000m and 10000m runner EVER. He's run seriously quick over 1500 without really training for it and people are saying he can't break 51? Seriously, it beggars belief the ignorance of some people.
actually mogelijk a 17min5ker would not be able to do that workout!! not a chance, 71.5 sec 400m is sub 14.55 5k pace and 16 of them!
Only on letsrun...
Here are some wild observations:
The HR graph is crytically titled
"16 alternating 400m (in 52-54 seconds) and 200m (in 24-25 seconds) reps with 1.5-2min recovery jogs at 2341m"
and the curve matches exactly what we would expect...
I'll go out on a limb here and say the graph is from the workout in question.
As for intensity, heart rate rarely tops 160 for most of the workout and this is at the absolute peak of the curve for a very short period, so assuming max HR is indeed 178 we are rarely at even 90% MHR...
Heart rate drops like a stone between reps, getting back down to as low as 90 early, and eventually going out to 110 at end of recovery period towards the late reps, so based on the 178 MHR and 32 RHR we are dropping to:
40% heart rate reserve or 51 % Max in one early rep
53% heart rate reserve or 62% Max in late reps
is this hard? You tell me...
It's amazing that a coach/scientist went into the kind of micro analysis he did in that article about a workout which never even happened and I hope no-one is asking "How do we get there?" for their pros who depend on solid advice not on multiplying Bekele's workouts by 2 and speculating...
Sounds like he's training to train, not race. That will be his downfall if he hopes to have a successful career.
I really don't see the "crazyness" of this work out. He is the greatest distance runner that has ever lived and it was done 10 days before he crushed all of the best distance runners on the planet by sprinting at the end. Also taking the rest in to account it seems like a work out some one of his caliber should be doing. Do you guys really think he runs 60-62 sec quarters for speed training just like your D1 college team did/does?
In terms of scaling that back for us...that puts me (a speed oriented 15:05 guy) running 64-30 at the slow end. That's completely undoable for me. I would probably get to 6... 8 max.
A couple things though:
1) Bekele absolutely cannot run 47. He is probably in the 49-50 range.
2) That being said, he can close in 52-53 off of a reasonably hot pace. He is so aerobically fit that he can run close to max 400 speed while fatigued.
3) That is a lot of rest for Bekele. He is probably a monster at recovering. I think this would be a tough one for him, but I could see him doing it.
So, last year El G himself visited my college team when he was here for some event related to the Boston marathon. He told us of a workout (through a translator) that completely blew my mind. I can't remember the exact times, but the workout was as follows:
1000 (2:14), 30 sec rest, 200 (25)
800 (1:49), 30s, 200 (25)
600 (~1:20) 30s, 200 (25)
400 (50? 49?), 30s, 200(25)
200 (24), 30s, 200(24)
I think the rest between sets was 2-4 mins.
I don't really remember the details after the 1000, because I was just so awestruck that he would run THAT fast as part of a workout. The workout was done at altitude in Morocco, and I remember that the 600 and 400 times were more along the lines of 800 pace.
Anyways, this really showed me that the top athletes in the world can do absolutely incredible stuff.
heard it from the horse's mout wrote:
So, last year El G himself visited my college team when he was here for some event related to the Boston marathon. He told us of a workout (through a translator) that completely blew my mind. I can't remember the exact times, but the workout was as follows:
1000 (2:14), 30 sec rest, 200 (25)
800 (1:49), 30s, 200 (25)
600 (~1:20) 30s, 200 (25)
400 (50? 49?), 30s, 200(25)
200 (24), 30s, 200(24)
I think the rest between sets was 2-4 mins.
I don't really remember the details after the 1000, because I was just so awestruck that he would run THAT fast as part of a workout. The workout was done at altitude in Morocco, and I remember that the 600 and 400 times were more along the lines of 800 pace.
Anyways, this really showed me that the top athletes in the world can do absolutely incredible stuff.
Most of the top runners have 48/400 meter speed or faster.
long dong silver wrote:
Maybe someone like Coe could have done it, but I doubt KB could have (Coe had about 4 secs on KB in an open 400). Consider that KB's open 400, in his prime, was 50 flat at the best.
Could Coe have beaten KB in an open 400? Yes. By 4 seconds? No.
KB could run 47. I really doubt Coe could run much faster...maybe, mid or low 46.
51.0 for Bekele in a 400 race.
Y'all don't understand how this guys runs. His stride length hardly varies at all, and his maximum stride rate is 240
That's 12.5/100m top speed. He has never gone faster than this in any race at sea level.
The thing that most here can't grasp is that he can hold that top speed for almost 300m
At 8000 feet, yes he could do a rolling start 400 in under 50, or under 51 at sea level.
Yeah, if it's eight sets, this is credible. I'd imagine Bekele recovers from near-top speed VERY quickly, so 90 sec - 2 minutes is a pretty respectable amount of rest for him. I'd think it would be hard, but nothing particularly out of the ordinary.
Sixteen sets, on the other hand, seems like it would be near-impossible, even for him. But then, taking a workout that the best in the world does, then doing it twice, back to back, SHOULD be murderously difficult or impossible for anyone.
bekele would be good for 49x.
this is based on the assumption that he could run 330 1500.
your recall that gebreselasse did 331 1500 indoors... right?
you watched him take on el-g in the olympics and finished a couple of meters back in a 600m sprint duel (off a slow pace), right?
anyone that can run 330 can run 49x minimum, it is that simple.
go ask any world class coach.
Your post is simplistic. It's not that simple.
You don't need to ask a world class coach, just someone who understands how the differences between runners.
If Alan Webb could run 47 in high school, the Bekele could run at least a 49.
bdog wrote:
16x (400 in 52-54, rest, 200 in 24-25) w/ 90sec-2min rest is NOT the workout.
The workout is "16 alternating 400 and 200"
i.e. 8x (400, 200)
Look at the heart rate graph...There are 16 peaks
Christ people are stupid, hope salazar cleared that one up for stevey...
Yes. I noticed the same thing when I looked at the graph. I'm really surprised that the thread got out to 2 pages before anyone mentioned that.
