Maybe "Who pays" is another of the disgruntled 1500 runners who lost on Saturday. If you can't beat them in the race then try to make life miserable for them in some other fashion.
It is hard to believe there is ANYONE that would have a problem with a U.S. champion having expenses paid to be able to compete in a meet somewhere.
A UO hater or fellow loser competitor most likely.
Who pays wrote:
He is getting a free experience, based soley on his athletic ability. That is preferential treatment.
Doesn't the same thing apply for every person who makes a team, compared to every person who doesn't make the cut at tryouts? Would you also suggest that anybody who wants to be able to run at NCAA champs and USATF champs, so that they don't miss the experience?
You're a goddamn idiot. Hopefully this was a joke.
Why is everyone attacking the OP? It is a legit question. Where are the actual NCAA boundaries for this type of trip? Anyone out there have REAL experience dealing with this situation?
Enough with the "you just hate UO" or "you're just picking on him cuz you can't beat him" bullcrap. I'm intrigued to know where the money comes from and how often these trips are allowed before the NCAA hammer comes down on you.
These meets in Europe, are not NCAA meets, USATF, or world championships. They are run FOR PROFIT. Therefore, U of O, USATF, and IAAF cannot pay his expenses. Comparing it to any of the above sanctioned events, is incorrect. Imo.
I'm pretty sure that USATF pays to bring the entire team to certain meets in europe. I am not sure if this includes any diamond league events but I think they support the top 3 possibly 4 qualifiers for at least a couple Euro meets.
How is this even an issue? Athletes on scholarship are investments. Of course U of O is going to pay for his trip, as they should, it is great press for them if he hits the "A" standard (which he undoubtedly will). The anti-Oregon bias on this forum is ridiculous. This is how life works: perks go to people who are good at things. It's called capitalism.
I brought this up 2 years ago when Ulrey was chasing the standard, here is what happened then:
http://www.letsrun.com/forum/flat_read.php?board=1&id=3108659&thread=3108609
Rabid Wiener wrote:
Why is everyone attacking the OP? It is a legit question. Where are the actual NCAA boundaries for this type of trip? Anyone out there have REAL experience dealing with this situation?
Enough with the "you just hate UO" or "you're just picking on him cuz you can't beat him" bullcrap. I'm intrigued to know where the money comes from and how often these trips are allowed before the NCAA hammer comes down on you.
The questions posed by the OP and repeated by you have already been answered in the thread. If that doesn't work for you, use google or go to NCAA.org. I have seen a lot of dumb threads on letsrun in my life, but this may be the dumbest.
In order for Matt jr. to go on the Euro trip he must turn pro.
I have phd's in physics and chemistry so i know what im talking about.
Are you guys forgetting about the ORIGINAL Centrowitz? I'm sure his dad is loving every second of this and would be more than happy to pick up the tab for a few flights and hotels.
Based on a quick scan of the NCAA rulebook, it's pretty clear that he can be reimbursed for reasonable travel, food, and lodging for a non-collegiate race. It's also clear that, as a member of the national team this reimbursement could legally come from USATF. It wasn't clear to me whether Oregon, a for-profit race organizer, or other benefactor could cover expenses, nor was it clear to me that they couldn't. Obviously he can pay his own way to any race. Under no circumstances can he be paid a fee or prize money beyond expenses.
113 wrote:
[quote]Rabid Wiener wrote:
The questions posed by the OP and repeated by you have already been answered in the thread. If that doesn't work for you, use google or go to NCAA.org. I have seen a lot of dumb threads on letsrun in my life, but this may be the dumbest.
I've read the entire thread thanks to a slow day in the salt mines and have yet to see a reasonable explanation.
This is not the same as an entire team travelling to a meet. Yes, there are instances where elite athletes are sent to meets with specific qualifying standards that the entire team does not attend, but are those athletes sent to meet after meet after meet, without other athletes? No. This is the treatment the OP is referring.
Before the season begins the Athletic department has a budget and certainly cannot plan for multiple *additional* trips for a single athlete to perform. So where does the $$ come from (Nike?, Boosters?) Once that is established, only then can it be determined legal or not.
I'm all for him chasing the standards, but what I'd push for is clarity in the NCAA rules. Namely, to allow this without possible question.
Didn't read the thread, but I hate when these threads pop up (usually once a year). I'm sure the kid has some cash saved up from working in the summer. Maybe mom and dad are footing the bill. Maybe he's going into credit card debt.
Everyone on these boards acts like going to Europe is as financially difficult as buying a million dollar home. When I graduated from college I traveled Europe, as do MANY college kids, on a shoe string budget. Paid for by mowing lawns the previous summer and putting as much as I could on plastic. I knew I was coming home to a job, so I didn't mind going into a little bit of debt.
I don't understand why people assume he's going to blow 100grand or something on some outlandish world trip.
He can get a round trip flight to Europe for probably between $1000 and $1500. Once there, he could easily only spend $100 a night on lodging. He has to eat whether he is in the US or Europe, so can't factor that in. All in, a 30 day trip isn't going to run him more then $5,000, and possibly cheaper if he is going with friends, sharing costs for hotels and whatnot.
Most people can scrap together, save, borrow, etc. 5 grand. Throw in the fact that I think USATF will provide some NCAA-friendly assistance, and Matt will probably break-even.
Where? wrote:
I've read the entire thread thanks to a slow day in the salt mines and have yet to see a reasonable explanation.
This is not the same as an entire team travelling to a meet. Yes, there are instances where elite athletes are sent to meets with specific qualifying standards that the entire team does not attend, but are those athletes sent to meet after meet after meet, without other athletes? No. This is the treatment the OP is referring.
Before the season begins the Athletic department has a budget and certainly cannot plan for multiple *additional* trips for a single athlete to perform. So where does the $$ come from (Nike?, Boosters?) Once that is established, only then can it be determined legal or not.
I'm all for him chasing the standards, but what I'd push for is clarity in the NCAA rules. Namely, to allow this without possible question.
If you honestly think that Oregon's athletic department isn't going to foot the bill to give their university exposure on the world stage because they already had their budget set last fall, I don't know what to tell you.
Even if the money didn't come from Oregon, the rules, as already posted multiple times in this thread, couldn't be clearer. Centrowitz can accept assistance from anyone as long as it doesn't go beyond required expenses. It's no different from football players going to the Heisman ceremony, basketball players ending up in the ESPN studios, volleyball teams going to Australia, etc., etc., etc. All of the other follow-up questions about preferential treatment, profit vs. non-profit, sight-seeing, etc. have been non sequitors and really just read like someone being suspicious and paranoid for the sake of it. It's annoying because it happens every single summer when there is a world championships or an Olympics, and it just seems bizarre to pretend like this is some new mysterious thing or the death knell for amateurism.
Ulrey's case is clearly not relevant ... he's not a Duck!
Is there an entry fee to get in a Diamond League event? No. It is by invitation only. Preferential treatment, due to an athletes reputation(U.S. Champion) is a prohibited form of payment. NCAA Bylaw 12.1.2
Your opinion counts for f**k all. The regs are what they are so you can mentally masturbate all you want, but Centrowitz will head to Europe, get the standard, & compete at Worlds while you huddle in a corner biting your pillow.
Who pays wrote:
These meets in Europe, are not NCAA meets, USATF, or world championships. They are run FOR PROFIT. Therefore, U of O, USATF, and IAAF cannot pay his expenses. Comparing it to any of the above sanctioned events, is incorrect. Imo.
So what happens to the prize money Centro would have received for winning US Champs? I know there was that new rule that collegiate athletes can accept prize money in the summer, but wasn't sure if there was a cap on that or what?
How much money do you win for being a national champion?
Oregon Pays. Non-issue.
Who pays wrote:
He is getting a free experience, based soley on his athletic ability. That is preferential treatment. Whether or not it is a business trip, or a vacation, he will still have a great memory, most of us would pay for. It is a gift.
You could also argue that anyone who was able to travel to USA's out in Eugene received a memory and vacation most of us would pay for....
The same could be said for meets in NYC, California, anywhere.
Pull your head out from between your legs and worry about yourself instead of spending so much face time down there being jealous of others....