Joe Rosa is faster than Ritz was as a junior in high school

I think it's true that 8:55 may not be what it used to be, but let's be real. There are maybe 5-8 school nationally where an 8:55 guy isn't the top distance recruit in a given year. And times under 8:45 are as precious as ever.

Sub 9 still gets you in the top 20 or so pretty much any year (Once you add the 3 or 4 seconds from 3200m to 2 mile). What is new is that huge depth between at just over 9 min (or 8:56 3200m) where there is like 60 guys between 9:00 and 9:10. At the recruiting level, there really isn't a much of a gap between a 9:10 guy and a 8:59 guy. You need to look at secondary things (miles run, leg speed,..) and so on to predict who will be a college star. And then you got to get lucky. There are a lot of guys that find track isn't as much fun when you are not the star

slate burger wrote:

I think it's true that 8:55 may not be what it used to be, but let's be real. There are maybe 5-8 school nationally where an 8:55 guy isn't the top distance recruit in a given year. And times under 8:45 are as precious as ever.

slate burger wrote:

I think it's true that 8:55 may not be what it used to be, but let's be real. There are maybe 5-8 school nationally where an 8:55 guy isn't the top distance recruit in a given year. And times under 8:45 are as precious as ever.

True, and only 2-4 of those schools contend for national titles in cross country which is what most top high schoolers dream about, so you have maybe 5-10 2 milers and perhaps another five 4:08 or better milers who all would ideally like to run for schools like Oregon, Ok State, Stanford or perhaps Colorado or Wisco. Most of those schools try to balance a track team and already have a good deal of scholarships locked up on the current roster with may be 1-4 scholarships opening up on a given year, which will be divided up amongst maybe 8-15 athletes coming onto a track team. Obviously I'm talking about the big programs here, the ones the 8:55 guys dream of running for.

A guy who has run 80-100 miles a week for 4 years and has grinded down to 8:55 may not be that attractive. Obviously he'll land a scholarship somewhere but that doesn't mean he'll ever race for a ncaa team championship in cross or track, and he may end up running for a piss poor coach and running a 13:50 never to see ncaas.

ishuffle wrote:

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/11/21/sports/21runners.html

from 7 months ago

Interesting - from that article, Jim Rosa is 10 pounds heavier than Joe. 10 pounds is probably worth the difference between them, no?

The difference is that sub-9 almost got you in the top 20 for the 14 years combined between Trautmann and Ritz (I count 21 from here:

.) Also, sub-8:45 didn't happen at all in those years (even sub-8:50 didn't happen between Trautmann and Sanchez.)

We are going to see an amazing season next year....

A couple of freshman who have ran sub 4:20 this year, one running around 4:15/9:10ish?

Craig Lutz, Elias Gedyon, Joe & Jim Rosa, Lukas Verbizcas, Jeramy Elkaim, and a whole bunch of other underclassman who were around the 9:00-9:10 range.

Next year will be the best year for distance running we have ever seen on the high school level.

Joe Rosa - 2:59 split / 4:08 m / 8:44 2m

Jeramy Elkaim - 4:12 / 8:46

Lukas Verzbicas - 4:04 m / 8:53 2m (soph)

Jim Rosa - 4:07 m / 8:51 2m

Sam Pons - 4:13 / 8:57

Elias Gedyon - 4:08 m / 8:56

Ammar Moussa - 4:10 m / 8:57

Craig Lutz - 4:09 / 8:58

Darren Fahy - 4:12 / 8:59 (soph)

Imagine if some of these kids like Lutz or Gedyon had ran in a well setup race like New Balance Nationals...

There's a bunch of other kids who are fast, but I was just trying to grab the sub 9 kids. There are a number of 9:00-9:10ish runners I saw of course, which means next year will be just plain crazy.

I think a lot of elite kids have problems improving between junior and senioryears. They have sort of maxed out the high school training program and the competion level. But with so many people coming back you expect a couple to take the next step. Should be fun

THE TRUTH IS INSPIRING wrote:

Joe Rosa - 2:59 split / 4:08 m / 8:44 2m

Jeramy Elkaim - 4:12 / 8:46

Lukas Verzbicas - 4:04 m / 8:53 2m (soph)

Jim Rosa - 4:07 m / 8:51 2m

Sam Pons - 4:13 / 8:57

Elias Gedyon - 4:08 m / 8:56

Ammar Moussa - 4:10 m / 8:57

Craig Lutz - 4:09 / 8:58

Darren Fahy - 4:12 / 8:59 (soph)

Imagine if some of these kids like Lutz or Gedyon had ran in a well setup race like New Balance Nationals...

There's a bunch of other kids who are fast, but I was just trying to grab the sub 9 kids. There are a number of 9:00-9:10ish runners I saw of course, which means next year will be just plain crazy.

This Guy wrote:

ishuffle wrote:http://www.nytimes.com/2009/11/21/sports/21runners.html

from 7 months ago

Interesting - from that article, Jim Rosa is 10 pounds heavier than Joe. 10 pounds is probably worth the difference between them, no?

If the difference is muscle, it might help explain why Jim is the better mid-distance (800/1200/1600) guy and Joe is the better long distance (3200m/XC) guy.

ohnoes wrote:

This Guy wrote:

Interesting - from that article, Jim Rosa is 10 pounds heavier than Joe. 10 pounds is probably worth the difference between them, no?

If the difference is muscle, it might help explain why Jim is the better mid-distance (800/1200/1600) guy and Joe is the better long distance (3200m/XC) guy.

There is no way Jim can currently beat Joe at the 1200 and up.

Joe ran a 3:00 1200m + an 8:44 2-mile. I would imagine he could run 4:05 in the mile, which his brother cannot.

the truth hurtzzzzz wrote:

ohnoes wrote:

If the difference is muscle, it might help explain why Jim is the better mid-distance (800/1200/1600) guy and Joe is the better long distance (3200m/XC) guy.

There is no way Jim can currently beat Joe at the 1200 and up.

Joe ran a 3:00 1200m + an 8:44 2-mile. I would imagine he could run 4:05 in the mile, which his brother cannot.

Last time they ran a mile together it went 4:07 for Jim and 4:08 for Joe.

That was two weeks ago.

Rethink that.