RUNNERS FROM THE 70'S and 80's WERE CAPABLE OF SUB 13 and SUB 27

We were the best

David, you and I know that,but other people need more convincing.

why?

I think the sport is bigger now, more global with financial incentives for the poorer athelets/nations to perform. With the odd exception, Africans were't competing in the 70s. The sport was amateur now its professional so more people can afford (justify) competing.

Though the sport may have lost some popularity in the western world the number of different nations competing and winning medals is greater.

The heroes of yesteryear came from a much smaller sample (statistically speaking) than the current crop.

Thats the statistics! In addition I would say that the current crop of distance elites have some genetic advantage.

I would say that the stars of the 70s/80s are as good as the current western stars but not as good as the current 'global' stars.

wannebikila, I cannot accept that there is any relevant genetic difference between top runners then and now, other tha; white man was the best then, black man is the best now.

a generalisation I know, Hicham EL Gerrouj is neither black or white.

I think Haile Gebreselassie is probably the greatest distance runner of all time even more so than Emil Zatopek who I think was less able to control his obsession than Haile and this led to Zatopek's downfall from overtraining.

It could be argued of course that Zatopek was a pioneer of course, and it is interesting how similar they are in personality.

MOHAMMED EL. MUSTAFA wrote: "ACTUALLY, epo has been aroung for millions of years. it is found naturally in the human body, genius."

Actually, Genius (or Paddy, or whatever the hell your name is) erythropoietin is the naturally occurring hormone produced in the human kidney ... EPO is its synthetic creation and has been around since the mid 1980s but not mass-produced until about 10 years later.

There is NO mention of EPO or erythropoietin in any "early edition' of any Coe training book - and anyone who says so should either provide proof or retract the slander.

Coe, Cram and Ovett were fast, clean and British.

Live with it.

Martin

Hicham EL Gerrouj is neither black or white.

You're a bloody idiot and a bore. The same old broken-record b.s. PLEASE unplug your computer and read a few books.

its his idea of a joke, he also posts under the names;

Dr Steve and paddytheirishman.

thing is though, he's the only one who thinks its funny.

Happy birthday Tim Hutchings - born 4 Dec 1958 

Tim ran in the 5000 metres in 1984. In tough qualifying he ran 13:46.01 in his heat and 13:28.60 the next day in his semi-final. Two days later he ran the race of his life in the final, setting a personal best of 13:11.50 and finishing 4th.

An athlete can do no better than to set a pb in the Olympics. To put Tim?s performance in context, it still ranks him 5th on the all-time British list and has not been beaten by a Britain in more than 10 years.

Twice a World Cross silver medallist too and a bronze in the 5k at both the 86 Commonwealth Games and European Champs. Really nice bloke, good commentator on Eurosport and coach to the Graffin twins.

There are two point relating to genetics.

Firstly, todays distance champs are coming from a different gene pool. Given how competitive and challanging distance running is I would argue that this alone suggets a better genetic make-up amongst this group. Certain tests have shown a superior muscle texture in the legs of east african runners - an abudance of type II slow twitch fibres, far higher than the number in british/american runners.

Secondly, race aside, the number of different nations and peoples challenging for medals is surely broadening the genetic pool from which the best can emerge.

The analogy is that bedford et al were worthy local softball champs in their day while todays lot are world series winners. The sport is bigger.

your understanding of genetics is very poor.

HAPPY BIRTHDAY TIM

thanks Bazza, if Tim Hutchings isnt a perfect example of what I am trying to discuss in this thread, then I cant think of a more perfecterer one.

not a good enough repsonse JonnyO. Give detail. I'm not geneticist, granted, and my post was written very informally but where am I wrong?

JonnyO wrote:

your understanding of genetics is very poor.

WE HAVE;

wannabikila

wannebikila

wannabekila

any more variations?

wannabekele?

wannebekele?

wannebekela?

any more?

the same person?

help me out here.

Same person, I believe. I post from 2 PCs and used slightly different names. No reason, just typed it in incorrectly once. This is my most used spelling.

wannabekila wrote:

There are two point relating to genetics.

Firstly, todays distance champs are coming from a different gene pool. Given how competitive and challanging distance running is I would argue that this alone suggets a better genetic make-up amongst this group. Certain tests have shown a superior muscle texture in the legs of east african runners - an abudance of type II slow twitch fibres, far higher than the number in british/american runners.

Secondly, race aside, the number of different nations and peoples challenging for medals is surely broadening the genetic pool from which the best can emerge.

The analogy is that bedford et al were worthy local softball champs in their day while todays lot are world series winners. The sport is bigger.

wannabeabikerkilla,

your point about the larger gene pool is correct, it was the other points which I didnt agree with

your point about the different muscle profile of east african runners is irrelevant, you have been led to believe that more type II slow twitch fibres makes them better runners. there are other reasons why they are faster which I have already discussed on this thread

dave bedford enjoyed track running, but to win at the very top level you need a sprint. He should have been a marathon runner, but I just couldn't tell him, his head was in the clouds.

had to bump up this thread for the loser who dared to question the great JonnyO about distance runners true ability in 10k races, with the lamest handle of all

he called himself Tired of Know ItAll

JonnyO we know this is you again. I don't blame you for bumping it up though it a good thread.

Now I won't go in to science of all this but I will say that I agree with you on the fact that those guys could have ran quicker. Times have gotten quicker over the years. Also most ran races at mid-day and had no pacemaking. They also had less scientific knowledge / coaching available to them. However the larger gene pool is a good point also. On a final note I will say that none of them could have ran as quick as Geb or had the talent of Bekele. They just did'nt have the same god given talent!

yes I agree with you Stormin Geb is the Seb of distance running.