Webb/Aouita - only two ever sub-27:40/sub-1:44??

I cant believe you guys didnt even mention Hicham El guerrouj his superiority compared to Aouita or Webb is unbelievable

800

Aouita: 1:43.86

Webb: 1:43.84

Guerrouj: 1:42.70

1500

Aouita 3:29.71

Webb: 3:30.54

Guerrouj: 3:26.00

Mile

Aouita: 3:46.76

Webb: 3:46.91

Guerrouj: 3:43.13

3,000

Aouita: 7:29.45

Webb: 7:35.07

Guerrouj:7:23.09

5,000

Aouita: 12:58.39

Webb: 13:10.86

Guerrouj: 12:50.24

10,000

Aouita: 27:26.11

Web: 27:34.72

Guerrouj: Probably under 27 easily if he did it.

Silva wrote:

Guerrouj: 1:42.70

Nope.

YES 1 42 70 is his best time at 800, he did it in a training Session in stade moulay abdellah (Rabat), early in the 2002 Saison, how do i know that? am a morrocan athlete from rabat, training in the same track where elguerrouj used to live and train at age 16-18 and in the same track where this performance (1 42 70) was done. at the time he was trying to determine if he should considere seriously the 800m in the future.

silva wrote:

YES 1 42 70 is his best time at 800, he did it in a training Session in stade moulay abdellah (Rabat), early in the 2002 Saison, how do i know that? am a morrocan athlete from rabat, training in the same track where elguerrouj used to live and train at age 16-18 and in the same track where this performance (1 42 70) was done

I'm the Queen of England.

Feel free to visit my blog and enjoy my PERSONAL COLLECTION of hicham pictures, most the were given to me by Hicham elguerrouj's friends personaly and the morrocan federation of athletism (the place where i train) and also by my personal friends too.

i dare you to find the personal pictures anywhere in the net! (not talking about the other official pictures)

http://h-guerrouj-1500m.skyrock.com

enjoy 70 pages of content (and i hope that you understand french and arabic).

Which one is you then? I'm still the Queen of England.

here i am in the "stade moulay abdellah" track (in the middle) after i got a gold medal in the 1000m cadets race, its the same track where hicham ran 1 42 70 in 800m back in 2002, i really dont care if you believe or not and excuse my english.

http://71.img.v4.skyrock.com/71f/taha-chapion1500/pics/285940402.jpg

Bye.

I do care. I am writing a book on Salah Hissou and am trying to get information, opinions etc from reliable sources. I am travelling to Morocco next year to do some final research. My book does not just speak of Salah, but many of his Moroccan teammates, plus his major rivals. You might be able to help me if you know El Guerrouj and any other Moroccan runners.

I tried to register for your skyrock website but it doesn't allow me to. If you want to talk more my email is

gregrowlerson@yahoo.com.au

Silva, I have also tried to send a message to the El Guerrouj email but it fails to send. Any help would be much appreciated.

Silva wrote:

I cant believe you guys didnt even mention Hicham El guerrouj his superiority compared to Aouita or Webb is unbelievable

800

Aouita: 1:43.86

Webb: 1:43.84

Guerrouj: 1:42.70

10,000

Aouita: 27:26.11

Web: 27:34.72

Guerrouj: Probably under 27 easily if he did it.

Hello silva, the problem is that El Guerrouj hasn't run any 800m races in competition after 1995 and that he never did an 10.000m. We only can speculate what he could have done in the two events. For sure I knew for many years that there are "rumours" that he once had done an 1:42 time in training. I always very much doubted this. It's very easy: I couldn't believe that someone does an absolutely world class performance IN TRAINING (I almost never heard something like this) and never tried it in competition. You are now the first good source which claims the 1:42,70 is true. We all know that El Guerrouj definitely was capable of a 1:44, maybe 1:43 over 800m. 1:42 - hm, I'm not sure. Did you have some more informations about that 1:42,70 in training? Was it something like an "official" time trial with good timing equipment? Did he had pacemakers? Was it more like an race? And, why did't run Hicham El G. any races below 1500m after 1995? He surely must be capable of an 2:13 over 1000m. Maybe 2:12.

But since he never had run a 10.000m, he couldn't be named in an thread where the subjekt is the combination 800m - 10.000m. Where did you know, that he probably could run under 27 minutes?

Silva wrote:

I cant believe you guys didnt even mention Hicham El guerrouj his superiority compared to Aouita or Webb is unbelievable

the problem is that the original poster said that he is only counting actual race times, not what an athlete "could have done" or unprovable practice times. no one is questioning that el Guerrouj is one of (if not THE) best. the question is whether anyone other than Webb and Aouita ever ran RACES under 1:44 for the 800m and 27:40 for the 10000m.

el G didn't.

Hi first, let me tell that here in morocco and especially the atheletes we all know that if elguerrouj did not concentrate so much on the 1500m distance, he could have ran 1m 41secs for the 800, because of his speed and phenomenal ENDURANCE.

you say that elguerrouj according to you was maybe capable of a 1m 44 sec or 1m 43sec in the 800m? my friend a beg you to see this video in the 2002 saison :

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jTNBLDrkJH8

in this video elguerrouj ran a 51:90 secs first lap and a 52:44 last lap, thats 1m 44sec for the 800m inside a 1500m!, cant you see his potential here? what would have he done if it was just a 800m, the answer was in training back in 2002 and he ran a 1m 42 70 secs 800m time, and here in morrocco we all know that he could have done way better than that if it was a competition. elguerrouj was definetly capable of running 1m 41secs for the 800m.

yes i have a some informations about this time , first this was early in the 2002 saison, he and his coachs was trying to figure out if he should line up in the 800m distances as well, he had only 1 pace maker (the morrocan 400m champion at the time) the first lap was sub 50secs and after the pace maker stoped in 500m elguerrouj ran the second lap in about 53secs, hicham ran the 800m in 1:42:70.

this information was told to me by a friend of my coach who was present in the moulay abdellah stade when elguerrouj ran this time.

once again excuse my english.

peace.

while some people are going to dispute the legitimacy of el Guerrouj's 1:42.7 800m time, that's beyond the point. the original poster said:

"I think they are the only two who have run this fast in 800 and 10,000, right? I know 27:40 is nothing anymore, and other guys "could" do or "could have done" it, like Geb, etc. ... but are Webb and Aouita the only two?"

so it doesn't matter what el Guerrouj was capable of doing in the 10000m, and it doesn't matter how fast some people say he ran an 800m in practice. all that matters, as far as this thread goes, is that he never ran under 1:44 or 27:40 in a race.

for the record- i believe that, if he had raced the 800m in his prime, even without changing his training to suit the 800m, el Guerrouj was capable of running about 1:42.00.

Here is "achraf tadili" a morrocan 800m runner (he run for canada now, canadian champion) he talks about elguerrouj 1: 40:70 time:

here:

http://www.hbc.com/hbcf/mediacentre/press/hbc/press.asp?prId=238

and here:

http://www.olympic.ca/EN/games/panam/santodomingo/handbook/files/ATHLECTICS-ATHLETISME.pdf

Well, i think that elguerrouj did really ran 1 42 70secs for 800m. and was capable of a, mmm let say 1m 41 99 time.

for the 10k, we will never know...

Don´t you see, that El G 400m split time was about 53,3.

You should see the difference between the rabbit and El G.

The video doesn`t show the last 400m. I strongly doubt

it was 52,44 like you are saying. The fact is that Aouita

run 1.43,86 at Brussel in 1988 and and as the video proves

in Olympic final he run mathematically c. 1.43,1.

I believe, that El. G had low 1.43 potential.

Why El G was much faster than Aouita at 1500 and longer

distances ? The reason could well be that he had much

higher haemoglobin values than Aouita. High haemoglobin

does not help you at 800, because it is much more anaero-

bic than 1500 metres. These stories of 1.42 training

runs can´t be taken seriously. Was it hand timed ?

Flying start ?

silva wrote:

YES 1 42 70 is his best time at 800, he did it in a training Session in stade moulay abdellah (Rabat), early in the 2002 Saison, how do i know that? am a morrocan athlete from rabat, training in the same track where elguerrouj used to live and train at age 16-18 and in the same track where this performance (1 42 70) was done. at the time he was trying to determine if he should considere seriously the 800m in the future.

No offense, but you're just saying your from the same area as El G, as if that is supposed to provide more proof about this time.

Unless you're story is about how you SAW El G run a 1:42.70 800, then it's still just a practice story.

I think he was capable of sub 1:43, but you can't just claim a practice time to the 00th of a second. Unless they brought in automatic timing equipment, it was a hand-timed mark, which makes it even less likely that it was exactly 1:42.70.

I also think he is too big for the marathon. Maybe a triathlon. I think the kid can swim pretty well! Too much mass for marathon. But then again, if he can gain hair growth at age 24, I do not see it impossible for Alan to loose mass.

On second thought, he will run the marathon!

My point of the thread certainly wasn't that Webb and/or Aouita are the best ever, or even the runners with the best range ever, but just exactly what I said in my first post, they are the only 2 to break those two barriers.

I certainly realize that 27:40 is no big deal, too. But it still remains that only two with times under 1:44 have also run that fast for 10k. Aouita's 10k was world class at the time and Webb's is still US class, for what that's worth.

Maybe the more impressive stat for Webb is that he's top 10 in both the 800 and 10k in US history ... no one has ever done that on the men's side.

joaquim cruz also. he ran 1'41'77 and 27'52 10,000(practice in eugene)