Thank you for mention it but I have already been on that thread to give them some critics )) My the Dancan system is another low mileage system shown to be more effective and gives faster sustained improvement. Right now I have just started my more ' potent ' lactate threshold training than their sub threshold method, but still sometimes I do some fast hillreps like today 20 x fast hillreps 20 sec with 80-90 sec walkrest back to start to even better up my running strength. I really feel strong now doing the hillreps. If I can stay healthy and injuryfree I'm now convinced my goal to run a sub 20 min 5 k next year will come true. 🇸🇪🧙♂️🇸🇪🖐🏃🏃♀️
I'm sure that went well for you. A man critical of a system that is laid out with an entire book and methodology to back it up , versus your belief in magic.
Not to mention, there's actual real people , thousands , succeeding using it. Yet everyone gets worse on the DANCAN train.
Cool story, Jan. As ever, you're a clown.
Are you criticizing his the dancan system? Surely a man who writes like a moron and uses emojis excessively is a stable genius!
I just read through the thread. It's a challenging but entirely possible goal. I looked at my old times and the last time I ran a sub-20 5k was a 19:58 at age 68. At 69 I ran 20:30, and the fastest I've done since turning 70 was 21:05. As you mentioned, at this age it's all about getting in a good stretch of healthy and injury-free training.
When I ran those times I was running about 2200 miles per year and around 45-50 miles per week for 3-4 months before the 5k. I usually was running 6-7days per week with a mid-week VO2 max interval workout of 3-4 miles that varied from 400s up to mile repeats. Saturdays I would run a 6-8 mile trail run at or near threshold pace, and Sundays I would do a 10 mile long run at whatever pace felt comfortable that day. The other days would be very easy recovery runs, sometimes with walking sections if I felt particularly tired from the workout days.
Good luck with your goal. I'm 76 now and in hindsight thinking about the last 10 years of training I would say that at this age volume is more important than intensity and in making choices about training always opt for the choice that provides more volume.
I just read through the thread. It's a challenging but entirely possible goal. I looked at my old times and the last time I ran a sub-20 5k was a 19:58 at age 68. At 69 I ran 20:30, and the fastest I've done since turning 70 was 21:05. As you mentioned, at this age it's all about getting in a good stretch of healthy and injury-free training.
…
That’s really impressive. I didn’t know if one guy was trolling or clueless when he referred to sub-20 as a “low bar” for someone over 65. I’d been hoping/planning to be there at 60 but as I’m getting pretty close I don’t know if I’ll make it. What were your times like when you were much younger?
To put Internet bullsh!t in perspective, nobody at the Abbott dash to the finish 5K over 65 ran under 20 and Joan Benoit Samuelson, who is 68 ran a 24 and change.
I just read through the thread. It's a challenging but entirely possible goal. I looked at my old times and the last time I ran a sub-20 5k was a 19:58 at age 68. At 69 I ran 20:30, and the fastest I've done since turning 70 was 21:05. As you mentioned, at this age it's all about getting in a good stretch of healthy and injury-free training.
When I ran those times I was running about 2200 miles per year and around 45-50 miles per week for 3-4 months before the 5k. I usually was running 6-7days per week with a mid-week VO2 max interval workout of 3-4 miles that varied from 400s up to mile repeats. Saturdays I would run a 6-8 mile trail run at or near threshold pace, and Sundays I would do a 10 mile long run at whatever pace felt comfortable that day. The other days would be very easy recovery runs, sometimes with walking sections if I felt particularly tired from the workout days.
Good luck with your goal. I'm 76 now and in hindsight thinking about the last 10 years of training I would say that at this age volume is more important than intensity and in making choices about training always opt for the choice that provides more volume.
Thank you very much buddy! 🖐Very impressing you ran a 19:58 age 68!! My the Dancan system reminds a little of how you trained. Good luck with coming years running. Happy New Year! 🇸🇪🧙♂️🇸🇪🖐🌲
When you're not doing reps with walking breaks, what is the rest of your mileage?
My concern would be that you'd get good at doing the workouts, and without the walking rest, racing becomes tough.
I'm working on the sustained easy runs to become longer and faster. Right now I do 30 min sustained easy or 4-5 x 10 min easy . Will be better over time....🖐🧙♂️
For some perspective, the runBritain ranking list, which is very comprehensive, has 50 guys in M65-69 at 20 min. or under on certified 5k road courses.
I just read through the thread. It's a challenging but entirely possible goal. I looked at my old times and the last time I ran a sub-20 5k was a 19:58 at age 68. At 69 I ran 20:30, and the fastest I've done since turning 70 was 21:05. As you mentioned, at this age it's all about getting in a good stretch of healthy and injury-free training.
…
That’s really impressive. I didn’t know if one guy was trolling or clueless when he referred to sub-20 as a “low bar” for someone over 65. I’d been hoping/planning to be there at 60 but as I’m getting pretty close I don’t know if I’ll make it. What were your times like when you were much younger?
As you say a sub 20 min by an age 68 guy is extremely good! The guy who tried to disparage that sub 20 to an age 65+ runner is one of the many years stalkers have been harassed me and my coaching here at LRC for many years. But I will never " feed" them here in this thread by argue with them . When I will run for sure a sub 20 next year they will hide away haha! Coach J.S
For some perspective, the runBritain ranking list, which is very comprehensive, has 50 guys in M65-69 at 20 min. or under on certified 5k road courses.
How many of them under 20 and how many of them sub 19?
I just read through the thread. It's a challenging but entirely possible goal. I looked at my old times and the last time I ran a sub-20 5k was a 19:58 at age 68. At 69 I ran 20:30, and the fastest I've done since turning 70 was 21:05. As you mentioned, at this age it's all about getting in a good stretch of healthy and injury-free training.
…
That’s really impressive. I didn’t know if one guy was trolling or clueless when he referred to sub-20 as a “low bar” for someone over 65. I’d been hoping/planning to be there at 60 but as I’m getting pretty close I don’t know if I’ll make it. What were your times like when you were much younger?
I was a 440 guy at a small college and consistently ran in the mid to high 51s (my high school had faster 440 guys than my college did). I didn't run much between college and my mid-30s due to Navy Vietnam service, law school, young kids, long work hours, the usual. In my mid-30s I got into triathlon and was mixing swimming and biking with a modest amount of running. I was consistently running high 17s-low 18s in road 5ks and 37-38min 10ks. At 40 I decided I wanted to try and run sub-5 for the mile, and got into a good masters training group. I ended up running a bunch of miles in 5:03-5:07 but never did break 5. My times stayed surprisingly flat from age 45 to almost 60. I ran a 17:56 5k at age 49, and an 18:38 5k right after I turned 60. Although during that period I was getting more free time to train and training more intelligently. I weighed 130lbs when I ran in college and never got more than 10lbs over that since then. I'm running at 125lbs now and think that I have probably lost 5lbs of upper body muscle without all the swimming, surfing and basketball I used to do.
I just read through the thread. It's a challenging but entirely possible goal. I looked at my old times and the last time I ran a sub-20 5k was a 19:58 at age 68. At 69 I ran 20:30, and the fastest I've done since turning 70 was 21:05. As you mentioned, at this age it's all about getting in a good stretch of healthy and injury-free training.
When I ran those times I was running about 2200 miles per year and around 45-50 miles per week for 3-4 months before the 5k. I usually was running 6-7days per week with a mid-week VO2 max interval workout of 3-4 miles that varied from 400s up to mile repeats. Saturdays I would run a 6-8 mile trail run at or near threshold pace, and Sundays I would do a 10 mile long run at whatever pace felt comfortable that day. The other days would be very easy recovery runs, sometimes with walking sections if I felt particularly tired from the workout days.
Good luck with your goal. I'm 76 now and in hindsight thinking about the last 10 years of training I would say that at this age volume is more important than intensity and in making choices about training always opt for the choice that provides more volume.
Good post. Jan, I am older than you and understand the challenge. I would recommend concentrating on building up your volume to above 2000 miles pa to begin with. However at your age and no recent training, this in itself could take a considerable time, but is worth the investment. Don't be fooled by quick improvement. You may drop your time down to 22:xx after a few months, but this is a million miles away from sub 20:00.
That’s really impressive. I didn’t know if one guy was trolling or clueless when he referred to sub-20 as a “low bar” for someone over 65. I’d been hoping/planning to be there at 60 but as I’m getting pretty close I don’t know if I’ll make it. What were your times like when you were much younger?
I was a 440 guy at a small college and consistently ran in the mid to high 51s (my high school had faster 440 guys than my college did). I didn't run much between college and my mid-30s due to Navy Vietnam service, law school, young kids, long work hours, the usual. In my mid-30s I got into triathlon and was mixing swimming and biking with a modest amount of running. I was consistently running high 17s-low 18s in road 5ks and 37-38min 10ks. At 40 I decided I wanted to try and run sub-5 for the mile, and got into a good masters training group. I ended up running a bunch of miles in 5:03-5:07 but never did break 5. My times stayed surprisingly flat from age 45 to almost 60. I ran a 17:56 5k at age 49, and an 18:38 5k right after I turned 60. Although during that period I was getting more free time to train and training more intelligently. I weighed 130lbs when I ran in college and never got more than 10lbs over that since then. I'm running at 125lbs now and think that I have probably lost 5lbs of upper body muscle without all the swimming, surfing and basketball I used to do.
Glad to read that you tell us. Thank you for contributing to the thread with interesting good stuff. 🖐🧙♂️🖐
I just read through the thread. It's a challenging but entirely possible goal. I looked at my old times and the last time I ran a sub-20 5k was a 19:58 at age 68. At 69 I ran 20:30, and the fastest I've done since turning 70 was 21:05. As you mentioned, at this age it's all about getting in a good stretch of healthy and injury-free training.
When I ran those times I was running about 2200 miles per year and around 45-50 miles per week for 3-4 months before the 5k. I usually was running 6-7days per week with a mid-week VO2 max interval workout of 3-4 miles that varied from 400s up to mile repeats. Saturdays I would run a 6-8 mile trail run at or near threshold pace, and Sundays I would do a 10 mile long run at whatever pace felt comfortable that day. The other days would be very easy recovery runs, sometimes with walking sections if I felt particularly tired from the workout days.
Good luck with your goal. I'm 76 now and in hindsight thinking about the last 10 years of training I would say that at this age volume is more important than intensity and in making choices about training always opt for the choice that provides more volume.
Good post. Jan, I am older than you and understand the challenge. I would recommend concentrating on building up your volume to above 2000 miles pa to begin with. However at your age and no recent training, this in itself could take a considerable time, but is worth the investment. Don't be fooled by quick improvement. You may drop your time down to 22:xx after a few months, but this is a million miles away from sub 20:00.
Good comment Alfie. 🖐🧙♂️
Well, I have never ever stopped to run completely since I started to run as a young boy aged 10. My national elite career lasted to age 40 when family life and so on took more of my time and focus. But I ran 50- 60 min easy now and then . And last years I have hold up a quite good level by frequently doing fast short hillreps 15-30 x 20-25 sec, so now we can't say I start from scratch of course. I'm amazed I'm still very fast sprinting shorter distances for my age 66. This is a very good factor to build further on and add endurance and anaerob capacity to reach the 20 min 5 k goal. 🧙♂️
For some perspective, the runBritain ranking list, which is very comprehensive, has 50 guys in M65-69 at 20 min. or under on certified 5k road courses.
How many of them under 20 and how many of them sub 19?
For some perspective, the runBritain ranking list, which is very comprehensive, has 50 guys in M65-69 at 20 min. or under on certified 5k road courses.
There are only 5 guys in the M70 age group. Jan will be 70 in 4 years. Building the required volume, and then adding the intensity (without getting injured) has to be progressed very slowly at this age.
How many of them under 20 and how many of them sub 19?
I checked myself. 14 sub 19 min .
Nice. Then I guess there is a good chance I can reach that too. But of course I'm satiesfied to reach sub 20 , or as someone told if I can come close and most important be very fit at my age as I agreed ....
For some perspective, the runBritain ranking list, which is very comprehensive, has 50 guys in M65-69 at 20 min. or under on certified 5k road courses.
There are only 5 guys in the M70 age group. Jan will be 70 in 4 years. Building the required volume, and then adding the intensity (without getting injured) has to be progressed very slowly at this age.
You have a good point there Alfie.I agree and see the build up has to be well in both volume and intensity. Can't force it. As many older runners told one doesn't recover as fast as when young and that's a fact of course. 🖐🧙♂️