The main takeaway from the recent Paris 1500: it marks the beginning of an end of Jakob in the 1500.

OACHaters wrote:

Siedge_Hammer wrote:

It's probably a slightly unpopular opinion on this board given the number of Jakob Stans here, but hear me out. From 2022-24, Jakob always lost in the world championship final. It goes without saying that he will never be the favourite in the WC/Olympic 1500m again, but he still has one thing that's head and shoulders above others - fast times in a TT setting.

However, with the sudden influx of sub 3:29 and even 2 new 3:28 runners, we can safely say, fast times are no longer Jakob's niche. Some people here say Jakob could've broken the WR in that race (there's even a thread on that, so that's not a straw man), because even the "B" runners are running 3:27 - I don't look at it that way. I think it proves that the level of competition has just improved and now we're getting back to the heyday of 90/early 00s across the board, be it 800/1500 or the 5k/10k. 5k/10k was in a pathetic state ever since Mo Farah had left the track, but somewhere around Covid, it has become great again with the likes of Cheptegei, while 800/1500 was still a sad state of affair. But progress has finally come along last year. Wanyonyi has been knocking the door of the WR, or even a sub 1:40, while his teammate Kockroachi Koech, just dropped a whooping 3:27 2 days ago at the tender age of 18. If this trend continues, he will be the first one to break 3:26,, and he may even get into 3:23-24. Actually the GOAT El g said he could've run 3:23-24, and I think we all can agree on that with the advent of wavelight and supershoes and Koech seems to be the one doing that unfinished business.

Now going back to Jakob, when the field was weak, he was arguably the best in the world, though given the 0:3 track record since 2022, even that is disputable, but now the time has come, we're living in the new era of 1500m running. There would be more 3:27 and 3:26 to come, and Koech may well get the WR under 3:25 in a few years just like what Kiptum did to the marathon. It's been a fun ride watching Jakob run, he's certainly great for the sport, but perhaps it's time for him to pass the torch to someone else. No shame in that, as that happens to every great runner and with his 1500m speed, he will still be competitive in the 5000m for a few years.

Koech is 1000% doping. Anyone denying that is a certified moron. Hope AIU does their work and takes that stain away from the sport.

Coevett wrote:

Siedge_Hammer wrote:

It's probably a slightly unpopular opinion on this board given the number of Jakob Stans here, but hear me out. From 2022-24, Jakob always lost in the world championship final. It goes without saying that he will never be the favourite in the WC/Olympic 1500m again, but he still has one thing that's head and shoulders above others - fast times in a TT setting.

However, with the sudden influx of sub 3:29 and even 2 new 3:28 runners, we can safely say, fast times are no longer Jakob's niche. Some people here say Jakob could've broken the WR in that race (there's even a thread on that, so that's not a straw man), because even the "B" runners are running 3:27 - I don't look at it that way. I think it proves that the level of competition has just improved and now we're getting back to the heyday of 90/early 00s across the board, be it 800/1500 or the 5k/10k. 5k/10k was in a pathetic state ever since Mo Farah had left the track, but somewhere around Covid, it has become great again with the likes of Cheptegei, while 800/1500 was still a sad state of affair.

You mean the Africans have started going full-throttle with EPO again, or whatever new undetectable drug is out now?

Siedge_Hammer wrote:

It's probably a slightly unpopular opinion on this board given the number of Jakob Stans here, but hear me out. From 2022-24, Jakob always lost in the world championship final. It goes without saying that he will never be the favourite in the WC/Olympic 1500m again, but he still has one thing that's head and shoulders above others - fast times in a TT setting.

However, with the sudden influx of sub 3:29 and even 2 new 3:28 runners, we can safely say, fast times are no longer Jakob's niche. Some people here say Jakob could've broken the WR in that race (there's even a thread on that, so that's not a straw man), because even the "B" runners are running 3:27 - I don't look at it that way. I think it proves that the level of competition has just improved and now we're getting back to the heyday of 90/early 00s across the board, be it 800/1500 or the 5k/10k. 5k/10k was in a pathetic state ever since Mo Farah had left the track, but somewhere around Covid, it has become great again with the likes of Cheptegei, while 800/1500 was still a sad state of affair. But progress has finally come along last year. Wanyonyi has been knocking the door of the WR, or even a sub 1:40, while his teammate Kockroachi Koech, just dropped a whooping 3:27 2 days ago at the tender age of 18. If this trend continues, he will be the first one to break 3:26,, and he may even get into 3:23-24. Actually the GOAT El g said he could've run 3:23-24, and I think we all can agree on that with the advent of wavelight and supershoes and Koech seems to be the one doing that unfinished business.

Now going back to Jakob, when the field was weak, he was arguably the best in the world, though given the 0:3 track record since 2022, even that is disputable, but now the time has come, we're living in the new era of 1500m running. There would be more 3:27 and 3:26 to come, and Koech may well get the WR under 3:25 in a few years just like what Kiptum did to the marathon. It's been a fun ride watching Jakob run, he's certainly great for the sport, but perhaps it's time for him to pass the torch to someone else. No shame in that, as that happens to every great runner and with his 1500m speed, he will still be competitive in the 5000m for a few years.

THOUGHTSLEADER wrote:

Kickers usually win wrote:

Shortening the race is not a good strategy for Ingebrigtsen. His best chance of winning is if someone else takes it out at 3:30 pace. The lack of such a pace setter is why he tried to burn off the field in Paris.

I’ve been following distance running for a long time and I’ve heard of a “controlled squeeze”.

Explain why it’s not a good strategy? The longer you go hard from the harder it is to properly conserve for the last 150m sprint. In 2022, Jakob really wasn’t that far off he just got too stubborn with his race plan in not letting Kipsang/Tim handle pacing, and then fell asleep letting Wightman pass on the straight. In 2023, he ran tactically pretty perfect and fell short despite making Kerr run extra. 2024, despite amazing fitness he got beat by 3 guys because of the challenge in pacing a full 1500. That should be a last resort. If he makes it hard from 800m out he has a better chance of finishing the last 100m hard while having a positioning advantage.

Siedge_Hammer wrote:

It's probably a slightly unpopular opinion on this board given the number of Jakob Stans here, but hear me out. From 2022-24, Jakob always lost in the world championship final. It goes without saying that he will never be the favourite in the WC/Olympic 1500m again, but he still has one thing that's head and shoulders above others - fast times in a TT setting.

However, with the sudden influx of sub 3:29 and even 2 new 3:28 runners, we can safely say, fast times are no longer Jakob's niche. Some people here say Jakob could've broken the WR in that race (there's even a thread on that, so that's not a straw man), because even the "B" runners are running 3:27 - I don't look at it that way. I think it proves that the level of competition has just improved and now we're getting back to the heyday of 90/early 00s across the board, be it 800/1500 or the 5k/10k. 5k/10k was in a pathetic state ever since Mo Farah had left the track, but somewhere around Covid, it has become great again with the likes of Cheptegei, while 800/1500 was still a sad state of affair. But progress has finally come along last year. Wanyonyi has been knocking the door of the WR, or even a sub 1:40, while his teammate Kockroachi Koech, just dropped a whooping 3:27 2 days ago at the tender age of 18. If this trend continues, he will be the first one to break 3:26,, and he may even get into 3:23-24. Actually the GOAT El g said he could've run 3:23-24, and I think we all can agree on that with the advent of wavelight and supershoes and Koech seems to be the one doing that unfinished business.

Now going back to Jakob, when the field was weak, he was arguably the best in the world, though given the 0:3 track record since 2022, even that is disputable, but now the time has come, we're living in the new era of 1500m running. There would be more 3:27 and 3:26 to come, and Koech may well get the WR under 3:25 in a few years just like what Kiptum did to the marathon. It's been a fun ride watching Jakob run, he's certainly great for the sport, but perhaps it's time for him to pass the torch to someone else. No shame in that, as that happens to every great runner and with his 1500m speed, he will still be competitive in the 5000m for a few years.